Vetus, Beta, nanni or yanmar?

[King Penguin]

Just about to replace my old Volvo MD21a on my HR Rasmus 35 footer with a 40-50hp offering from one of the above makers.

Beta & Nanni marinise Kubota engines, Vetus engines are based on Mitsubishi I believe. Yanmar are the most expensive.

Whilst value for money is important, my question is which engine is going to give me the best reliability, ease of servicing, obtaining spares, etc.

Re-engining is an expensive business anyway and I'd hate to find because I saved a thousand or so on the price of the engine I had years of hassle and regret........

What experience have other forum readers had with these engines?

Thanks for your help

 

[Norman_E]

I suppose it depends how much more expensive the Yanmar is, but my own much bigger Yanmar now has over 5,000 hours to its credit, with no problems. Another Yanmar would be top of my list if I had to replace an engine, mainly because their engines are purpose built, not conversions of industrial units. Do look carefully at the position and spacing of engine mounts. No real problem if the mounts of a new engine are higher up than the old, as you can always build up the engine bearers, but lower, or wider apart, could spell trouble.
P.S. Why is Volvo not on your list?

 

[pvb]

I wouldn't think there's anything to choose between the different makes in terms of reliability. Your choice will surely depend on ease of access to service points. In terms of spares, I don't think anyone can match Volvo Penta's global spares service; is there a reason you're not considering another VP engine?

 

[lumphammer]

I expect you will get as many opinions as there are types of engine. For what its worth we re-engined with Beta and are very pleased with it.

We based our decision on the reputation of the person who was installing it rather than the engine itself as I expect that from a reliability point of view they are all much of a muchness.

 

[Talulah]

I have re-engined a few boats.
My preference is Yanmar.
The main reason being weight. Everything else being equal.

 

[RAI]

Hidden problems

I chose a Yanmar to replace an MD21A. I am happy with the choice, but I let myself in for a lot more problems during installation. Just a few I remember:-

1. Exhaust on port side instead of starboard, so lost one battery from the bank and needed a new water trap.
2. Exhaust 90 mm instead of 70 mm diameter, so lots of fun running it through bulkheads.
3. Opposite direction of shaft rotation. Max-Prop needed reversing, so did gearbox controls.
4. Lower shaft centreline. Resulted in adopting a Python drive, lowering the engine bearers, fitting a thrust plate and structure, changing the propshaft.

So have a careful look at each of those new engines' installation requirements compared to the MD21A's configuration.

 

[sailorman]

Just about to replace my old Volvo MD21a on my HR Rasmus 35 footer with a 40-50hp offering from one of the above makers.

Beta & Nanni marinise Kubota engines, Vetus engines are based on Mitsubishi I believe. Yanmar are the most expensive.

Whilst value for money is important, my question is which engine is going to give me the best reliability, ease of servicing, obtaining spares, etc.

Re-engining is an expensive business anyway and I'd hate to find because I saved a thousand or so on the price of the engine I had years of hassle and regret........

What experience have other forum readers had with these engines?

Thanks for your help

I replaced my Perkins 4108 Low Line rated @ 3000 RPM with a TMP hudraulic box, about 10 yrs ago with a Nanni 4150 HE.
this is a 4 cylinder 1500 cc Kubota based engine rated @ 37.5 hp @ 3000 RPM & a PRM 150 hydraulic box.
it has now done 1000hrs, apart from routine maintenance all i have replaced is alternator belts & the exhaust elbow (700 hrs , it cost £70).
there are no anodes in this engine.
I doubt you need more power than my engine, i had to increase the pitch on my MaxProp to get the new engine down to 3000 RPM.

 

[pvb]

I have re-engined a few boats.
My preference is Yanmar.
The main reason being weight. Everything else being equal.

Bearing in mind the old MD21 weighs getting on for 300kg, I reckon any modern engine is going to be lighter!

 

[King Penguin]

I chose a Yanmar to replace an MD21A. I am happy with the choice, but I let myself in for a lot more problems during installation. Just a few I remember:-

1. Exhaust on port side instead of starboard, so lost one battery from the bank and needed a new water trap.
2. Exhaust 90 mm instead of 70 mm diameter, so lots of fun running it through bulkheads.
3. Opposite direction of shaft rotation. Max-Prop needed reversing, so did gearbox controls.
4. Lower shaft centreline. Resulted in adopting a Python drive, lowering the engine bearers, fitting a thrust plate and structure, changing the propshaft.

So have a careful look at each of those new engines' installation requirements compared to the MD21A's configuration.

Good advice.....now, where is my MD21a manual........

 

[sailorman]

I chose a Yanmar to replace an MD21A. I am happy with the choice, but I let myself in for a lot more problems during installation. Just a few I remember:-

1. Exhaust on port side instead of starboard, so lost one battery from the bank and needed a new water trap.
2. Exhaust 90 mm instead of 70 mm diameter, so lots of fun running it through bulkheads.
3. Opposite direction of shaft rotation. Max-Prop needed reversing, so did gearbox controls.
4. Lower shaft centreline. Resulted in adopting a Python drive, lowering the engine bearers, fitting a thrust plate and structure, changing the propshaft.

So have a careful look at each of those new engines' installation requirements compared to the MD21A's configuration.

A PRM hydraulic box can drive in either rotation.
my Nanni should have had a larger exhaust but as the Perkie was 1700 cc & the new engine 1500 cc i kept the existing.
engine manufactures use an exhaust elbow to cover say 3 engine size`s. my engine was the smallest in that series.

 

[pvb]

Good advice.....now, where is my MD21a manual........

If you do a bit of Googling, you'll find a number of sites by Rasmus owners, in some cases showing how they've re-engined, with pics. Engine choices vary widely.

 

[sailorman]

Bearing in mind the old MD21 weighs getting on for 300kg, I reckon any modern engine is going to be lighter!

my new engine & gearbox only weighed 3 x the old gearbox. the transom came up 50 m/m

 

[Koeketiene]

What experience have other forum readers had with these engines?

Re-engined two boats.
First one: replaced a remperamental Volvo with a Yanmar.
Night and day - VERY pleased with the Yanmar. Quiet, very economical to run.

Second one: Ageing Vetus (old Peugeot based one).
Had already been rebuilt and overhauled before. Bits had started to corrode.
Considered Yanmar as a first choice. However, cost came as a major shock to the wallet.
Fallback options: Beta/Nanni.
Eventually opted for Nanni (seems somewhat better marinised). Also the fact that we will be moving the boat to France in the not too distant future was a consideration.
Pleased with the Nanni so far (after 2 years - 250 hours). Economical to run, though I seem to remember the Yanmar on the previous boat being quieter.

Don't regret getting the Nanni, but if I could have afforded it would have gotten another Yanmar.

 

[King Penguin]

If you do a bit of Googling, you'll find a number of sites by Rasmus owners, in some cases showing how they've re-engined, with pics. Engine choices vary widely.

Another great bit of advice......

 

[King Penguin]

Re-engined two boats.
First one: replaced a remperamental Volvo with a Yanmar.
Night and day - VERY pleased with the Yanmar. Quiet, very economical to run.

Second one: Ageing Vetus (old Peugeot based one).
Had already been rebuilt and overhauled before. Bits had started to corrode.
Considered Yanmar as a first choice. However, cost came as a major shock to the wallet.
Fallback options: Beta/Nanni.
Eventually opted for Nanni (seems somewhat better marinised). Also the fact that we will be moving the boat to France in the not too distant future was a consideration.
Pleased with the Nanni so far (after 2 years - 250 hours). Economical to run, though I seem to remember the Yanmar on the previous boat being quieter.

Don't regret getting the Nanni, but if I could have afforded it would have gotten another Yanmar.

Thanks for that, I suppose Yanmar are my first choice but the others are so much cheaper..........decisions, decisions......

 

[pvb]

Thanks for that, I suppose Yanmar are my first choice but the others are so much cheaper..........decisions, decisions......

The actual engine cost is only a portion of the total cost of re-engining. Price differences between makes might only make a small percentage difference to the overall cost.

 

[Paddingtonbear]

Beta are absolutely ridiculous for the cost of spares. I recently enquired about the cost of a gasket set for a 13hp cylinder Kubota based engine as I couldn't believe the price that some friends of mine had been quoted for a decoke. I was quoted over £300 and no I could not get one from a plant firm either. Their oil filters are also £30ish pounds as well. All this info. is heresay as I have a proper engine that doesn't need such fripperies as servicing.

Don't buy any engine with a cam belt and try and avoid any that is vehicle derived as they need to rev.far too fast to be efficient.

 

[Tranona]

Agree with PVB. There is little difference in performance reliability or cost but there can be significant differences in layout and ease of installation. Although the list price of Yanmar and Volvo tend to be higher than the others, when you come to buying a package the overall difference is small spec for spec. Both those makers concentrate on the OE market and are less active in the re-engine market, although Volvo have a good deal going on at the moment.

I have re-engined twice (same boat) and first was a Yanmar which was fine but underpowered (1GM). Space limitations meant a 2GM or the new 2YM would not fit but a Kubota based twin would so this is what I fitted (Nanni).

You will find you have to replace just about everything in the drive train so look for the best package. Although spares needs on the new breed of engines is minimal it helps to buy something that has good dealer backup and as noted Volvo (and Yanmar) have extensive world wide servicing networks.

 

[King Penguin]

The actual engine cost is only a portion of the total cost of re-engining. Price differences between makes might only make a small percentage difference to the overall cost.

Being realistic I'm budgeting pretty much the same again for installation........new propshaft (likely, as new engine will likely be shorter than current lump), new prop (current engine very slow reving), new morse controls (currently have 2 levers), clean out fuel tank (in keel underneath engine), new engine mounts, engineer costs, etc, etc.

Obviously, I'll make a bit selling the old engine, prop, and shaft, etc.....but I am not under any illusion this project is going to be cheap or simple!

 

[RAI]

One more thing to check

Take a look at the type of alternator provided. You might want to change it for a bigger one or at least have if compatible with your current wiring. I didn't and ended up buying an alternator-to-battery charger, as the new Hitachi alternator didn't provide for external control. Mind you, the new electronics are heaps better than the old split diode arrangement.