rubberduck
Well-Known Member
It has been suggested to me that if I buy a vat paid boat in France, Spain, Italy, I may have to pay Uk vat if bringing it back here, which I intend to do, is this correct &in any event, what duty would I have to pay ?
VAT
- Thread starter rubberduck
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jrudge
Well-Known Member
No. If vat paid in the EU it is vat paid and good transfer free of duty.
Post brexit who knows.
If you take the oat out of the EU for I think 18 months then it can loose its vat paid status ... but that was not your question.
Post brexit who knows.
If you take the oat out of the EU for I think 18 months then it can loose its vat paid status ... but that was not your question.
jfm
Well-Known Member
First sentence is generally correct. Regarding last sentence it is generally 3 yrs not 18mths
All these rules have devil in detail. Above is merely the highlights.
Portofino
Well-Known Member
Slightly related the Italians recently in a bid further boost there boatbuilding competitiveness have recently April this year said that with modern AIS and such like , when a boat is new they will take a print out or what ever of the boat being delivered in international waters defined as 12 miles offshore
Apparently this makes vat free purchase a lot easier .
Defo for new
Not sure if if that new rule applies to temporary importation by the none EU entity .
If it does then going Fwds I can see a trend to vat free boats
Cos you don't have to go to N Africa etc and do a photo shoot .
In what ever time interval -just log your position on AIS every time you go 12 miles out
I think that's defo for new read it in last months
barche mag
Apparently this makes vat free purchase a lot easier .
Defo for new
Not sure if if that new rule applies to temporary importation by the none EU entity .
If it does then going Fwds I can see a trend to vat free boats
Cos you don't have to go to N Africa etc and do a photo shoot .
In what ever time interval -just log your position on AIS every time you go 12 miles out
I think that's defo for new read it in last months
barche mag
jrudge
Well-Known Member
I would be surprised if this would stand up, but convenient if it did.
Remember just because someone is doing it does not make them right!
The requirement is to leave the EU and given the "exclusive economic zone" stretches 200 nm I would be surprised if once you are at 12nm you have left the EU.
Remember just because someone is doing it does not make them right!
The requirement is to leave the EU and given the "exclusive economic zone" stretches 200 nm I would be surprised if once you are at 12nm you have left the EU.
rubberduck
Well-Known Member
Thanks all, very informative as usual, & as I thought.
superheat6k
Well-Known Member
As already said, presently whilst we remain members of the EU this is incorrect. If you can show the VAT was paid by evidence of bona fide bills of sale and original invoice in an EU member state then the VAT paid status applies throughout the EU. Duty is different to VAT and presently is zero rated in all EU and EEA member states and territories e.g. CI.
So what happens after Brexit ? No one knows and on the grand list of priorities our hobby is a mere speck of dust on the screen. But look what has happened previously e.g. VAT deemed paid was allowed for boat pre I think 1985 (stand to be corrected), and again in 1992 if a boat was in an EU harbour. The precise details are now getting fussy for me, so perhaps someone can firm up the precise details.
The point here is that possibly on a date to be confirmed, but very likely March 2019, a date could be stated that for boats in the UK at that date will be deemed UK VAT paid, but this might not be that they are any longer EU VAT paid, or possibly that they are also EU VAT paid, and much here could be dictated by how the Brexit deal works in practice.
Interesting times !
MapisM
Well-Known Member
L, I have no reason for not taking your word for it, of course.
But if you could email me a copy of the article, I'd be very curious to read it.
In fact, not only I didn't hear anything like what you are reporting, but I find it very weird indeed...
rubberduck
Well-Known Member
Indeed !
Portofino
Well-Known Member
L, I have no reason for not taking your word for it, of course.
But if you could email me a copy of the article, I'd be very curious to read it.
In fact, not only I didn't hear anything like what you are reporting, but I find it very weird indeed...
Iam away from the boat and home at the mo
Blondie and Phil Collins @ Hyde Park
But I will perhaps create a thread later on it
jfm
Well-Known Member
J, it is clear from the law that the EU VAT zone stretches to 12nm only. The 200nm is all about who owns minerals and fishing rights, and suchlike. I've done super yacht completions at 15nm (to get margin of safety - the 12nm is measured in a special way when the coastline isn't straight) and never had a problem, but even if challenged I'm sure of the law.
I'm not saying Porto is correct. It's always been the case you can buy a non VAT paid TI'ed boat at 12.1 nm offshore without the seller triggering VAT at that point, as he/she/it would if selling at 11.9nm, but that isn't news. It's very commonly done in fact. What would be news would be if IT now treated such a short voyage as a valid restart of the 18month TI clock, but I'm not clear whether that is what Porto is saying. If that is true, it is quite big news, but only for non EU residents (which now includes me of course
)
MapisM
Well-Known Member
It isn't, unless there's some further news which I'm missing.
I googled around a bit using "AIS" and a few other keywords in IT, and the only relevant webpage which I found is this one, which btw is one year old.
In a nutshell, the regulation is meant to avoid to the boatyards "exporting" (which by definition is a VAT exempt transaction) brand new boats the hassle of going from Viareggio to Tunisia (or wherever) upon delivery.
Which previously, was the only way for builders to be sure to avoid the risk of being asked to pay VAT themselves.
Otoh, coming to think of it (but the article says nothing about this), I can't think of how they could have restricted such regulation to new boats delivered by the builder, and make it non applicable to boats in TI status...
Portofino
Well-Known Member
I think it applies to all TI ---from an Italian perspective .
From memory they lost a challenge .No need to trail to N Africa now .
The official EU guide to Temporary Admission states that the following with regard to the time that a yacht has to remain outside the EU before it can return:
“Yes, you are not limited to a single period of temporary import. You can sail the yacht out of the EU and when you came back again for another holiday a new period of temporary importation can begin. The customs rules do not provide for a ‘minimum period’ during which the goods must remain outside of the customs territory of the EU.”
It's just Guardia Finanza now accept AIS records .
They will check the usage in the usual way to make sure the "principle user " is indeed domiciled outside the EU .
Setting up a Co ,even anonymous in BVI is not enough .If you an EU person is the "principle user " --it won,t work .
Begs a few Q re Brexit and GB ?
1- will domi in Uk qualify in IT eyes as out side the EU ? --great if it did
After all no longer in the EU .
2- post Brexit --if "hard " --- will UK customs + Excise play by the same rules ?
Bearing in mind rule book on EU vat /boats along with many other rules has to be rehashed .---don,t think so VAT will still need to be paid there will no TI by a uk domi into the uk , no change there obviously but those Med based particulary in IT will now be none EU in theory .
Or will there be a deal ( amongst others ) bit like Monaco where I understand a lot of the tax breaks are not available to French Co,s -otherwise they all would reg there , and Fr gov gets zero Co tax or equivalent .
None French no prob .
So it's plausible any current EU boat tax breaks open to the current deffinition none domi in the Eu will not be exteneded to Uk domi ,s even though Uk will be technically none EU post Brexit .
They might tack on CI into that "punishment "
Post Brexit our gov remember has sovereignty -so will make up its own law (s)
From memory they lost a challenge .No need to trail to N Africa now .
The official EU guide to Temporary Admission states that the following with regard to the time that a yacht has to remain outside the EU before it can return:
“Yes, you are not limited to a single period of temporary import. You can sail the yacht out of the EU and when you came back again for another holiday a new period of temporary importation can begin. The customs rules do not provide for a ‘minimum period’ during which the goods must remain outside of the customs territory of the EU.”
It's just Guardia Finanza now accept AIS records .
They will check the usage in the usual way to make sure the "principle user " is indeed domiciled outside the EU .
Setting up a Co ,even anonymous in BVI is not enough .If you an EU person is the "principle user " --it won,t work .
Begs a few Q re Brexit and GB ?
1- will domi in Uk qualify in IT eyes as out side the EU ? --great if it did
After all no longer in the EU .
2- post Brexit --if "hard " --- will UK customs + Excise play by the same rules ?
Bearing in mind rule book on EU vat /boats along with many other rules has to be rehashed .---don,t think so VAT will still need to be paid there will no TI by a uk domi into the uk , no change there obviously but those Med based particulary in IT will now be none EU in theory .
Or will there be a deal ( amongst others ) bit like Monaco where I understand a lot of the tax breaks are not available to French Co,s -otherwise they all would reg there , and Fr gov gets zero Co tax or equivalent .
None French no prob .
So it's plausible any current EU boat tax breaks open to the current deffinition none domi in the Eu will not be exteneded to Uk domi ,s even though Uk will be technically none EU post Brexit .
They might tack on CI into that "punishment "
Post Brexit our gov remember has sovereignty -so will make up its own law (s)