Upgrading Winches

[andyb28]

Good Afternoon Everyone,

My boat (Parker 325) has lovely Lewmar 40 self tailing winches for the headsail. But on the coach roof are standard Lewmar 24. I am looking to replace the standard winches for self tailing ones.

On my own, its a bit of a challenge trying to keep the boat into the wind (due to the lazy jacks), and pull the halyard with one hand and winch with the other. I could do with an Octopus crew mate. So, I think a couple of self tailers will make life a lot easier for me.
I have never purchased a winch in my life as every boat I have had, already had them fitted, so I have couple of questions.

The standard winch being a 24, but I can not find a self tail 24. I have seen Lewmar Ocean and there is a 16 or a 30.
Would it be bad to go smaller than 24? Harken appear to have a 20. Or should I check to see if I can fit the 30? The bonus with that one is its two speed.

Many thanks for your guidance
Andy

 

[Tranona]

16 will be fine. That is pretty standard on modern production boats up to 35' I had them on both my Bavarias - older 37 and later 33, although they both had furling mains so were used for inhaul/outhaul. Also used to raise sails at beginning and end of the season and seemed to cope OK. You have probably discovered you need deep pockets if buying new!

 

[andyb28]

Many thanks Tracona,

Thats good information to know. Yes, they are a lot more expensive than I thought!

 

[GD_Chi]

Here is a different opinion, as is often the case on forums..... The Parker 325 has a big main. We have a Starlight 35 with a fully battened main of similar size and find our Lewmar 30 ST's about the right size. Sorry, even more expensive.

 

[andyb28]

Here is a different opinion, as is often the case on forums..... The Parker 325 has a big main. We have a Starlight 35 with a fully battened main of similar size and find our Lewmar 30 ST's about the right size. Sorry, even more expensive.

Heh, so I did consider the size of my main sail. To the point on checkout, I changed my mind and went with Harken 20 Winches. Hopefully they will be enough of a compromise as 30's appear to be quite a bit bigger.

 

[johnalison]

Do you really need to winch the sail the whole way? I can hoist my 34 with a fully-battened main almost the whole way and only use the winch to tension it, and also need to steer through the lazyjacks. You may well benefit from ST winches, but it might be worth making sure the system is functioning optimally too.

 

[andyb28]

Do you really need to winch the sail the whole way? I can hoist my 34 with a fully-battened main almost the whole way and only use the winch to tension it, and also need to steer through the lazyjacks. You may well benefit from ST winches, but it might be worth making sure the system is functioning optimally too.

No, I can get it 2/3 of the way up without the winch. My wife, if she is out with me struggles a lot earlier though.

 

[Tranona]

No, I can get it 2/3 of the way up without the winch. My wife, if she is out with me struggles a lot earlier though.

Probably too late now, but you might consider dealing with the problem at the source. You really should not have that sort of problem with that size boat. Consider this shaft-seals.co.uk/product/sail-track-system/ I have fitted one and the difference is amazing. You may also have excess friction in the system and money spent on good blocks is well spent.

 

[[70521]]

No, I can get it 2/3 of the way up without the winch. My wife, if she is out with me struggles a lot earlier though.

Personally, I'd be looking at the amount of friction in the system, before doing anything.

I can raise my Gib'Sea 96s main with ease all the way to the top and that is with everything led to the cockpit.

On a sail training vessel I volunteer on the mast was down over the winter and all the running rigging carefully inspected and 'sorted'. The difference between last season and this is amazing.

 

[andyb28]

Personally, I'd be looking at the amount of friction in the system, before doing anything.

I can raise my Gib'Sea 96s main with ease all the way to the top and that is with everything led to the cockpit.

On a sail training vessel I volunteer on the mast was down over the winter and all the running rigging carefully inspected and 'sorted'. The difference between last season and this is amazing.

I think the sail on the Parker is bigger than the Gib'Sea. But I take your point. I would like a track system as it would also make getting the sail down easier.

Probably too late now, but you might consider dealing with the problem at the source. You really should not have that sort of problem with that size boat. Consider this shaft-seals.co.uk/product/sail-track-system/ I have fitted one and the difference is amazing. You may also have excess friction in the system and money spent on good blocks is well spent.

Out of interest, how much did the system cost?

 

[mattonthesea]

Maybe too late but have you considered 'Winchers'? Much cheaper than replacing. Not as good as ST but I find them adequate for our genoa Winchester.

 

[thinwater]

a. If your wife is with you, let her drive. I'm sure she can keep it into the wind. Why would you have her do the hoisting/winching, if you are larger and stronger?

b. It sounds like you need an autopilot (wheel pilot). A better use of $$ IMO than new winches. Really handy when singlehanding.

 

[PetiteFleur]

And check that winches base will fit your existing position and holes - to save drilling different holes. Look on ebay, often winches much cheaper than new.
And spray the track & slides with silicon spray - it certainly makes a difference on my boat.

 

[Tranona]

Out of interest, how much did the system cost?

About £1000 with slugs, a bit more with full battens. The area of the sail is not so important. It is not necessarily the size/weight that is the constraint but overcoming friction. There is no reason why you cannot get your sail to the top by hand with the right gear. Having oversize winches is hiding the problem. I went through this when buying new sails and gear and went the Tides route with normal battens because the sail is low aspect ratio. It has the added benefit of instant drop into the stack pack. similar sail area to yours and winch is an Evo 15ST.

 

[PabloPicasso]

Sort out the friction issues
Lubricate the sail sliders.
Look for other sources of resistance in blocks, sheaves, crossed lines etc. Maybe a bent sheave pin? Inspect and cottect.

I had issues on a 30ft boat but sorting above took about 20minutes and made a world of difference.

Easy to raise the main now. Just winch to tension the last bit.

 

[dunedin]

So i have an electric halyard winch on a 38 footer with big heavy main. Can pull up 2/3 before winching. But definitely would support your argument for a self tailing winch for single handing.

With two or more on board do a faster method. Smallest person on helm and tailing through the stopper. Bigger person at mast swigging up from there - heave, pull at mast, ho take up slack through stopper. Repeat. Pulling outwards and downwards makes easy. Then winch last bit of tension.

 

[PabloPicasso]

Yes, sweating the halyard its called round our way.

One of you at the mast uses body weight to pull the halyard out sideways where it exits the mast, as you release helmsman tails usually with halyard through a clutch and around the winch.

There is a better description than mine here:

eOceanic