twins Broom versus Twins other?

[Robin]

in a conversation earlier today with a UK marina manager he mentioned a personal opinion that screws on Broom twin engine boats were closer together than on others like Princess etc and as a result the directional twistability effect was less in manuevering situations. Is that a generally held view, therefore making a bow thruster more needed on a Broom? We are talking used boats here not new designs. Just getting my somewhat scrambled thoughts together in the decision processes for a new life chapter No longer have the time nor money to get it wrong and correct again at leisure down the line.

TIA.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I never felt that with my Broom 37 (the planing 37 not the SD 37). It was a dream to manoeuvre around a marina because the the windage was low and the vestigial keel stopped it being blown about as much as a normal planing hull. Actually I did fit a bowthruster to my Broom 37 but it was a nice to have rather than essential and mainly because sometimes I took the boat out on my own. All round they're great boats for UK waters and I think if I hadn't moved to the Med I'd still have one (probably a 530)

 

[superheat6k]

The shafts on my Corvette are closer than those on the Turbo 36 and I did notice this at first, and when manoeuvring at slow speed at first I would snake down the fairway away from the berth, but you simply adapt to having to control the throttles more sharply and without over bursting, but once the rudders kick in she settles easily, that said she also carries a lot less windage.

 

[Robin]

I never felt that with my Broom 37 (the planing 37 not the SD 37). It was a dream to manoeuvre around a marina because the the windage was low and the vestigial keel stopped it being blown about as much as a normal planing hull. Actually I did fit a bowthruster to my Broom 37 but it was a nice to have rather than essential and mainly because sometimes I took the boat out on my own. All round they're great boats for UK waters and I think if I hadn't moved to the Med I'd still have one (probably a 530)

Not sure if a 530 is 53ft or 53 metres, my budget might only manage 53 inches! Planing 37 versus SD 37 I understand the terms but not sure which models blow which way, on line have seen Monarchs, Crowns and Oceans. and whilst i have downloaded multiple pics of all to study later, I was looking more at internal rather than external features. Also looked at Princess 45s, 41s and a Fairline Phantom 37.

As an ex raggie with ingrained prejudices and worries, fuel consumption has to be a concern and that brings in the multiple variations on installed motors/horsepowers. We want to have some funds left for moving occasionally if possible. We had twin 250hps on our heavy loaded live aboard inUSA SD trawler but mostly only ran it at displacement speeds in the ICW aside from occasional WOTs at 16kts to piss off a yottie. Petrol. aka gas is cheap here at$2.20 'ish, marine diesel is not so at over $4/us gallon.. MDL in Poole tell me 85p on the 60/40 deal is current per litre from them.

 

[oldgit]

Something else to ponder is if the props are farther apart,so also will the engines.Especially if you intend self servicing.
This means easy access to any bits bolted inbetween the engines which will need attention at some point. If it can be seen and got at it will probably get attention over the years.
Tales of fairly important stuff being hidden way and virtually impossible to access are not uncommon on newer craft.
On many older boats ,a common complaint is having to move furniture to get at engine bay,however at least everything important can be got at afterwards.
We have just about every model of Broom ever produced down here at RCC and have never heard a single complaint about lack of "staying put" when mooring. Most Brooms here are in remarkable condition considering age.
Only grumble ever heard was about window leaks in probably the biggest and newest Broom on the moorings.
Many of the older boats have a keel of some description,this is very useful in esturary and river work.
It means you remove a layer of A/F when touching bottom not the tips of your props.

 

[Robin]

Something else to ponder is if the props are farther apart,so also will the engines.Especially if you intend self servicing.
This means easy access to any bits bolted inbetween the engines which will need attention at some point. If it can be seen and got at it will probably get attention over the years.
Tales of fairly important stuff being hidden way and virtually impossible to access are not uncommon on newer craft.
On many older boats ,a common complaint is having to move furniture to get at engine bay,however at least everything important can be got at afterwards.
We have just about every model of Broom ever produced down here at RCC and have never heard a single complaint about lack of "staying put" when mooring. Most Brooms here are in remarkable condition considering age.
Only grumble ever heard was about window leaks in probably the biggest and newest Broom on the moorings.
Many of the older boats have a keel of some description,this is very useful in esturary and river work.
It means you remove a layer of A/F when touching bottom not the tips of your props.

The trawler we had here for a year had no keel and had more windage than a yacht with full sail up and no bow thruster, but we managed albeit sometimes less elegantly than I would have liked. the engines had space between but one had the dipstick on the blind side and when we had to have some flybridge drains replaced a big exhaust waterlock had to be removed to get access to a manifold on the hull side so I am aware of access needs even though I had a mini Popeye get in there to do that job. We had to move a pull out sofa bed to lift the engine hatch or crawl in via a lift up stair to the galley. I bought a little ladder to help me get in/out of the engine space from the saloon The generator was shoe horned in too in the same area.:ambivalence:

The older SD Brooms seem cheaper and being also popular on rivers suggests they run well at lower speeds possibly saving fuel too over a big engine planing boat run at displacement speeds. More food for thought to a newbie to dark side living again

 

[oldgit]

The trawler we had here for a year had no keel and had more windage than a yacht with full sail up and no bow thruster, but we managed albeit sometimes less elegantly than I would have liked. the engines had space between but one had the dipstick on the blind side and when we had to have some flybridge drains replaced a big exhaust waterlock had to be removed to get access to a manifold on the hull side so I am aware of access needs even though I had a mini Popeye get in there to do that job. We had to move a pull out sofa bed to lift the engine hatch or crawl in via a lift up stair to the galley. I bought a little ladder to help me get in/out of the engine space from the saloon The generator was shoe horned in too in the same area.:ambivalence:

The older SD Brooms seem cheaper and being also popular on rivers suggests they run well at lower speeds possibly saving fuel too over a big engine planing boat run at displacement speeds. More food for thought to a newbie to dark side living again

My personal choice for a Broom would be the Crown 37. Interior volume better than the infamous Turbo 36 with its notorious "Instanto Jam" sliding saloon door and hack-a-hole in the shower floor stern tube access.
Crowns appear to have the most durable fit our of all the Broom versions and still look relatively modern compared to other fit outs by Ocean etc .
Fly in the ointment is the engines, bit weedy by any a standards for boat that statuesque and almost impossible to source major spares for the odd ball counter rotating version of Perkins.Holding their price very well considering that any serious engine malfunction probably means a re-engine job
Read Latestarters posts for the real deal on fuel pumps and other simply non available stuff.
One to go for would be anything with Volvos ?

 

[oceanfroggie]

We've always found our Broom 38 a dream to handle, and very rarely need the bowthruster when berthing. We use 3 cruise speeds 16kt planing on long passages, 7.5kt and 5kt displacement speeds on short passages. Her WOT is 26kts but she's designed to plane at 18-20kt. However we find the fuel consumption at 16kt very economic for long passages @ only 10gph, and at 7.5kt only 2gph. We've found 16kt fast enough for 100-150nm daily passages, and when weather and sea state permit we love cruising at displacement speeds, and wander around the quiet boat in chill out mode. Its almost as relaxing as sailing. Ours has Yammer 6cyl so ultra quiet.

 

[Newbroom]

The 39 KL I have just bought does have the props closer together than normal. It does take a little getting used to but is a dream to handle when you are used to it. One advantage of this configuration is that there is room round both sides of the engine.

 

[Robin]

My sincere thanks to all for increasing my knowledge base multifold:encouragement:. Of course what is available today may be long gone when we get to buy but we need to have a sensible order of service sorted in advance of priority boats, ready to look at when the time comes to catch the plane home. Exciting and frightening at the same time!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I understand the terms but not sure which models blow which way, on line have seen Monarchs, Crowns and Oceans.

Yup the Broom model names were very confusing. My 37 was known simply as the Broom 37 http://www.broomowners.com/gallery/discontinued-models/37 and was most definitely a planing hulled boat unlike the previous 37 models. The 37 hull morphed into the 41 and then the 415OS (OS = offshore). My boat topped out at about 26kts with 2 x Sabre 250hp engines. I'm not sure the SD hulled Conti/Ocean models got anywhere near that

Yes the price of fuel in the UK and Europe generally is a disgrace. There is only one solution and that is to drive your boat slower

 

[Robin]

Yup the Broom model names were very confusing. My 37 was known simply as the Broom 37 http://www.broomowners.com/gallery/discontinued-models/37 and was most definitely a planing hulled boat unlike the previous 37 models. The 37 hull morphed into the 41 and then the 415OS (OS = offshore). My boat topped out at about 26kts with 2 x Sabre 250hp engines. I'm not sure the SD hulled Conti/Ocean models got anywhere near that

Yes the price of fuel in the UK and Europe generally is a disgrace. There is only one solution and that is to drive your boat slower

8kts constant/average is 'fast' for ex raggies ( though our record under sail was 27kts on a wild surf) so no problems as long as go slow doesn't make handling difficult or wreck the motors.! I'm pondering on the differences between Broom SDs and Princess planing hulls, both seen in reasonable numbers on inland waterways so must get used at lower speeds rightly or wrongly. Another option would be sailing cats with wide spaced twin motors of low hp and backup sails to hand. Decisions, decisions.

 

[Greg2]

Never heard it said that the engines on Brooms are closer togther than on other boats. We had an a Broom Ocean 37 (same hull as the Continental and the Crown) and currently have a 41. Both were/are superb at close quarters handling with no bow or stern thruster required (we have both but not really needed).

I have read that the Atlantic range (similar design to Broom) have their engines very low down, which makes them closer together due to the hull shape.

 

[superheat6k]

Something else to ponder is if the props are farther apart,so also will the engines.Especially if you intend self servicing.
This means easy access to any bits bolted inbetween the engines which will need attention at some point. If it can be seen and got at it will probably get attention over the years.

This for me is the only downside of the Corvette set up. I recently had to replace the exhausts (on the top 5 worst list of jobs to do on a boat list that one !) and whereas there is tight crawling access to the outside of both engines, getting between them is simply not viable. To get to the exhaust outlet elbow I had to drain the fresh water cooling system to remove a large manifold that had had a disagreement with my chest when it tried to pass between, and even then I nearly got stuck.