trouble with Genoa setup????

poter

poter

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Still going south currently in Corsica for winter
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I am sure that the genoa setup on my 35 Dufour is wrong.
The tack cringle is attached direct to the furler drum & it pulls the foot of the Genoa way below the level of the guard rail, the sheets are outside the guard rail!
I'm guessing but I would say that the genoa is a No1, in other words comes way back beyond the mast, & it just does not seem to set correctly, it also creates horrendous problems when tacking.

Has anyone got any good pics of their setup - a 35' 1974ish Dufour would be great?

I am willing to try all suggestions next time I get out.

thanks.

poter.
 
Looking at your pics I'd suggest that you should be taking the genoa sheets outside the shrouds but then straight to the block on the genoa car,rather than outside of the guard rails aswell.
It is quite normal for the tack of the sail to be below the guardrail height.
The sheeting angle to the genoa clew is one of the most important factors in achieving a good sail shape and the way you apear to have the sheets taken outside of the guardrail will never achieve this.
 
The foot of the genoa should be below the level of the guard rails and clear of the deck - my furler is below deck and the foot just clears the deck. Having it above the guard rails for a NO1 is far too high IMO.

Sheets should be outside the shrouds and then through thier lead blocks onto the winch - definately not outside guard rails and then back thro' to the winch which is what I think you describe.
 
If there's any room at the top of the furling track, try fitting a strop between the sail and furling gear. We did this last year and the improvement was instant. Can now see under the sail and it sets just above the level of the guard rail.

We made the strop from webbing with a loop in each end and just shackled it either end. You do need room at the top of the track however to be able to still tension the sail properly.

Good luck

Chas
 
Re: trouble with Genoa setup???? Common faults ...

a) Tack below guard rail height ...
b) Sheets not suiting all situations.

Now you start to understand why serious all-our race boats have no pulpits and guard rails !!

If you are a cruiser with only occasional race forays - then fit a short strop to tack ... making sure that foil height is sufficient for luff to still be tensioned by halyard .... many boats not possible - that extra foot often is too much.

OK - then sort out sheets to be outside stays - but not outside guard lines ... try it ... change if not good ... experiment till you get what suits best.

If you have other sails to bend on top furling gear ... maybe a smaller genny that allows tack to be raised and foot not quite so long - you could have an improvement you didn't expect .... NOT always is a big genny the answer ...

maybe you can borrow a pals smaller foresail to try ?
 
Thanks chaps...
I have tried to set the foot of the Genoa inside the guard rails & it just don't work, well not on the set up I have at present. Have a look.........
S2400014.jpg


S2400023.jpg


Yes I know it aint pretty, but this was very much a shakedown in a rush in april..
comments on the correct set up for a Dufour 35 or any 30-40 footer, ta.

pics would help.

poter
 
Tack position looks about right but the foot and clew look far too low. It may not be the correct genoa for your boat as the leech appears too long.
If you speak to a sailmaker they can give you the right sail dimensions for the Dufour and lay yours out to measure to check. If it's not right you could get it re cut or talk to any sailmaker who may have a better second hand genoa that they could sell you cheaply.
 
First thing .......... now having seen the photos ...

UGH !! The sheet angle is way way out !!!!! The sheet is too low and aft to do anything except pull the foot of the sail .....

BUT the sail is setting too low at clew anyway - I don't believe the sail is designed for that boat .... looks like a sail from a larger boat ......

The foot of a genny shouold rise up to clew - not be horizontal like yours ..... Look at the second picture .... your sheet attachment is close to deck level and far too much aft. But because of the sail clew too low - if you move sheet point forward - you will foul the clew !!

Where did you get that sail from ?


My honest suggestion - Contact Seatech in Emsworth - they have one of the best stocks of second-hand sails .... tell them what boat and they may have a s/hand job in stock - they will take old in part-ex ..... so may not be as expensive as you first imagine ....

That sail is a waste of time ..... get it altered or replaced .....
 
As a temp resort ... you could keep a few rolls on the furling gear ... so that sheet angle and foot present better .....

As I said before ........... large sails don't always do better .....

I won 2003 Baltic Regatta with a #1 and didn't change throughout the final days racing .... won hands down ... all others had LWG, Spinny's etc. up .... we romped home ...

sail set is more important than sheer size ... roll it in a few turns to improve set - bet she goes better !!

With sail as in photo - it's so bellied that you have a bag - not a sail !!
 
Nigel thanks......

Have you got a contact web site or phone for Seatech.

Ok I'm off to the village fair & down a load of cider to drown the genoa........

ta

poter.

quote:
"As a temp resort ... you could keep a few rolls on the furling gear ... so that sheet angle and foot present better ..... "

yesssss! brill thanks...why didn't I think of that???

beers are on me..
 
Having looked at your pics I agree with the other comments - the sail is huge & not cut right for your boat.
As a general guide the position to place the car to get the correct sheeeting angle is on a line that runs at right angles from the luff thro' the clew - your seems a long way back.
Also noticed in first picc that you have spare halyards attached to the deck between the mast and forestay - i suggest that you move them either to the mast or in front of the forestay onto the pulpit - it will clear the area for the sail to pass thro.
Again first picture you look as tho you are reaching a bit & thats what I would expect the set to be; if in fact thats you trying to point up its v poor set-up/sail.
Dig deep a new sail is peanuts compared to the cost of a boat; course once you have bought a new genoa (115% - nothing too big/ decent dacron if you cruise) then a new main just has to follow.. .................................seriously tho' talk to a sailmaker & be cautious of buying secondhand - they are secondhand for a reason.....
Good luck.
 
When we had a Hurley 27, it had a short wire strop with eyes each end, this fitted between drum and genoa giving added clearance to deck.
Depends what the top end is like, no photo though.

Brian
 
Sorry BAtoo ... what a long winded post to say that he's got a bad sail !

He's probably been handed with the boat a cheap replacement sail from a much larger boat - maybe its #2 jib etc. LUff will be right length - but angle of forestay to mast / deck will be all to cock ... making the clew very low.

Onto your statement about s/hand sails - simply put - rubbish ! Yes there are good and bad s/hand sails - that is why the price range is so huge .... check out Seateach prices ... BUT a good s/hand sail is checked, resewn etc. - a near new sail in fact ......... how do I know ? I am a very happy customer of a number of s/hand sails ...

and WHY should he now start thinking of a new mainsail ?

Why the comments about what reach he's on - the sail is badly set - QED.

I wish I had a pound for every post that literally leads to a more costly solution .... This boat can solve it by either rolling a couple of turns on the furl or getting a good s/hand sail ....

Oh - I forgot to add - not all s/hand sails are secondhand - some are new but have a small error or something that says - B grade !
 
The fairlead is set too far aft for the sail.

Question. How near is the head of the sail to the top of the mast? Can you put a strop at the tack? and raise the sail further from the deck?

This would let the sail nearer to clearing the guardrail and the sheeting position would be better.

Could you post a photo of the whole sail.

In the past on well worn hire boats I have found that the sail would set better with about a couple of turns on the furler. This was mainly necessary to get the sheeting position correct.

Don't know if that's any use to you.

Still my of course be the sail.

Iain
 
Once again, thanks for all the comments, I must emphasise that as we were only down in France for a very short time in April & I really did not have a great deal of time to sort the sail settings, only that the Genoa was giving me problems in the way it was set up, with the sheets being outside the guard rails.

The main sail seems to be in reasonable nick & I am not looking to change that yet.

The day we eventually got out into the bay of Foss was almost windless so very little time or wind to strech the sails, rigging or the boat, even so, in gusts, she got up to 7knts over the ground, which in my opinion was very impressive even with the crappy set of the Genoa....There's life in the old classics yet...

I will be out again in August & hopefully I will take all your comments & see how I get on. If the marina WiFi connection is ok I will get some pics up on the net.

thanks all.

poter.
 
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