trapper 500 drying out

[vidapura]

Folks,
Quick question to anyone who owns a trapper 500 fin keel.

Is it a boat that behaves well when drying out next to a wall or will it pitch forward onto its nose?

I live in an area where all of the harbours dry out. So am looking for a boat that can take the ground well.

I've obviously considered the bilge keel option but would rather the fin keel.

Thanks
Vida

 

[dylanwinter]

welcome

and the answer is...

change harbour or buy a different boat that is designed to take the ground

such conditions will be hard on you, your warps, your fenders and your boat

 

[TonyBuckley]

It does take the ground well, but I wouldn't keep a fin keel boat that has to do that every day even on a Trapper which is reasonably solid.

It should not be an everyday occurrence .

You could ask on the 'main forum' here for more detail...

http://www.trapperyachts.org.uk/

 

[vidapura]

Thanks guys,
I should have said that it wouldn't actually be a daily occurrence... I'd keep it on a deep mooring at the club most of the time.
But if I went for a night or two away then three of the five local options would require drying out.
So, I'd like to have the option and be comfortable about it.

It had just occurred to me looking at photos that the 500 might be inclined to end up on its nose when drying...

Have test sailed one already and really liked the layout below as well.
Reviews and other bits I've read have it as a 'viceless' sail.
And lately they appear to be very reasonably priced for what they are.


I notice there's actually a bilge keel version for sale in Wales now too.. hmm...

Thanks again.
Vida

 

[GrahamP]

I dried out tied to a dock with a flat concrete base in a 1977 fin keel Trapper 500. The forward end of the base of the keel is slightly rounded. When I walked towards the anchor locker the extra weight cause a see-saw effect which was a bit alarming. I would not sleep in the forepeak, but apart from that, no problems.

 

[dylanwinter]

Thanks guys,
I should have said that it wouldn't actually be a daily occurrence... I'd keep it on a deep mooring at the club most of the time.
But if I went for a night or two away then three of the five local options would require drying out.
So, I'd like to have the option and be comfortable about it.

It had just occurred to me looking at photos that the 500 might be inclined to end up on its nose when drying...

Have test sailed one already and really liked the layout below as well.
Reviews and other bits I've read have it as a 'viceless' sail.
And lately they appear to be very reasonably priced for what they are.


I notice there's actually a bilge keel version for sale in Wales now too.. hmm...

Thanks again.
Vida

I think that you would find life easier and more pleasurable with a twin keel boat if that is your chosen cruising area

and having owned fin. drop, triple, centre plate and twin keeled yachts

sacrificing a quarter of a knot for the extra freedom that comes with a yacht that can take the ground is well worth the trade

you can sauil to newer places and if you do screw up with a twin keeler , put the kettle on, get out a book and pretend that you meant to do it

D

PS - never buy a boat on the basis of a nice interior - that is thinking like a girlie

 

[TonyBuckley]

They are very nice and underrated boats imho.

Turns on a sixpence, and sails to windward very well.

That forum is not at all active but you do get replies, if a little slower than here.

 

[Pitterpatter]

Our first boat was a fin keeler in an area where the majority of harbours dry (Firth of Forth). We did go up against the wall quite a few times but I would never say I got a good nights sleep when balanced. I bought that boat on the basis that I could keep a fin keeler in our local harbour and it would sail better. I never thought that the purpose of the boat was actually to visit other places and what that would entail.

Life changed significantly on changing to two keels. The first revelation was visiting a local island for lunch with a drying anchorage. Anchoring there before had meant always watching the tide to make sure you didn't get caught out. That became stress free and I remember thinking to myself 'oh well, if we get caught out we can get the bus home and I'll get the boat later'. My inclination to actually stop places overnight has increased immeasurably since the change too.

And as Dylan says, you will probably never notice the difference in performance anyway. And for when it counts (racing), your handicap makes up the difference anyway.

I like trappers and looked at them years ago, but from what you have said I'd definitely hang on for a twin keel one.

PP

 

[vidapura]

"..get out a book and pretend that you meant to do it"

Ha ha.. brilliant.. that'd be me alright.. heh...

Thanks very much for the feedback everyone... It seems I've been a bit too quick to judge the bilge keelers...
There are a few Centaurs around here I should take another look at so...

"never buy a boat on the basis of a nice interior - that is thinking like a girlie"

Well, yeah, but there is a wifey in the mix and she has a lot to say about interiors.
She was very taken with a Centaur we went to see funny enough...

Hey maybe I can get the best of both worlds:
http://wales.boatshed.com/trapper_500-boat-171454.html

Hmmm...

Thanks again,
Vida

 

[TonyBuckley]

"

Hey maybe I can get the best of both worlds:
http://wales.boatshed.com/trapper_500-boat-171454.html

Vida

That Kelvin Hughes VHF brought some memories back lol.

 

[baltic]

if you decide on a fin keel don't forget the mast band when drying out that is embarrassing seen it happen once hell of a bang 3 crew rolling around in the mud luckily no damage done but egg on face it was a sailing instructor the mast went right between 2 boats on the up side we dry out twice a day fin keels long keels the lot no problems

 

[chrisbitz]

if you decide on a fin keel don't forget the mast band when drying out that is embarrassing seen it happen once hell of a bang 3 crew rolling around in the mud luckily no damage done but egg on face it was a sailing instructor the mast went right between 2 boats on the up side we dry out twice a day fin keels long keels the lot no problems

What's a mast Band? I don't understand what happened? did the mast break?

 

[Tam Lin]

If you buy a Centaur (or any other oldish boat) get one where someone else has already replaced the original engine. Let them take the financial hit and have the bother of doing it and enjoy sailing with a modern, trouble free engine. It will not cost you much more and far less than than a boat plus a new engine. Don't ask me how I know!
If you don't believe me read some of Dylan's threads / KTL when he had the Mirror Offshore!

 

[prv]

if you decide on a fin keel don't forget the mast band when drying out that is embarrassing seen it happen once hell of a bang 3 crew rolling around in the mud luckily no damage done but egg on face it was a sailing instructor the mast went right between 2 boats on the up side we dry out twice a day fin keels long keels the lot no problems

What's a mast Band? I don't understand what happened? did the mast break?

For what it's worth it's complete gibberish to me too

Pete

 

[baltic]

you put a rope from the mast to the pier to stop the yacht falling away from the wall

 

[donm]

I bought that boat in 1978 as a hull and decks and fitted it out in my garden (after demolishing the garage!) The present owner bought it off me in 1985 and by the look of the 'photos has kept it very well.

She sailed very well particularly to windward in a strong breeze and was/is a great boat

 

[12 Year Plan B-)]

Hey Vida...

I was thinking about a twin keeled Trapper, too. The one in Cardiff looks to be low spec, plus s/rigging would need doing and she would probably a new engine in the not-too-distant future. Did you get as far as viewing?

At the risk of telling you something you already know, the main risk with twin keels is that if they are splayed outwards, repeated drying on a soft (e.g. mud) bottom places immense stresses on the keel roots. Over time, they start to flex, crack and leak; they can eventually fail. The splayed keels are, however, reported to facilitate higher pointing than those that are more upright (such as those of the Cobra 850).

Good luck in your search.

 

[Laurie]

A very similar alternative (slightly smaller...slightly) to the excellent Trapper 500/501 is a Jaguar 27. Fin keel is VERY similar, also twin keel variant that sails well too. Loads available too.

 

[vidapura]

Hi again,
yeah, the trapper locally has been taken off the market. The broker said he was just testing the market.. which is annoying...but there yeh go.
I have been sorely tempted by the westerly centaur as it reportedly sails well and my wife loves the interior. Prefers it to the trapper inside.

However the people I've been dealing with here about them lately have annoyed me so much that I'm giving the search a rest.

I drove 3 hours to see the first centaur only to have the owner text me when I was 500 yards from the club to tell me that he had just sold the boat.. despite having arranged for me to come see the boat 3 days earlier and I having been in regular contact in the meantime.

Then the second centaur owner refused to put the boat under offer while I got the survey done despite being offered the asking price. He said I could go ahead and spend the money on the survey but if he was handed money by someone else in the meantime it would be sold. So, naturally I wasn't going to spend the money on the lift out and the survey under those circumstances...

So, I'm a bit sick of it all now...

Thanks for the Jaguar 27 suggestion.. I had seen a jag 25 alright but found it a bit small for what I wanted...
Maybe the 27 would be better.

 

[Laurie]

Hi, whilst I wont pretend that the J27 is the biggest below, partly because of the massive cockpit, it is available in several layout options below. If you want any info., I have stacks of stuff, as for my sins, I set up and ran for many years the Owners Assoc., as was. Indeed some of my old stuff isstill on the current version of the OA website.............
Feel free...... laurie@lmilton.co.uk ( I sailed a J27 for 14 years....)

ps I see my old J27 is up for sale on the east coast..........