Transitting Firing Practice Ranges rules

NickRobinson

NickRobinson

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While I'm not trying to get blown out of the water (actually or metaphorically), can I tap the forum's wisdom?

On my leisurely 'round Britain' I've passed several ranges and either been ignored, (Donna Nook, Wainfleet), or asked for my ETA departing the area, (Eskmeals). So Lullworth was different.

Lullworth was my latest, I rang before departure and monitored the range channel which was active. The chart said, as usual, 'no restrictions on the right to transit'..

The radio chatter between the range boats used terms like, 'making sure these yachts behave' and when asked to move slightly further south, while complying, I asked if this was a request as per the chart's 'open range' note or an instruction and was told it was an instruction.

I understand the problems of running live shooting in a place like Lullworth, with so much traffic, but is the guard boat exceeding his authority?
 
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If you want to exercise your rights, you are allowed to transit but not loiter. But if everybody did this then they wouldn't be able to use the range which would not be to the benefit of the tax payer nor help maintain the skills our armed forces need.
 
oldharry said:
I was also told that delays caused by yachts insisting on transiting involve the army (therefiore the tax payer) in considerable costs as everything and everyone goes on 'hold', and delays the training programmes.
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So it sounds like the range boat in the op may have been lying?

I totally understand what a nuisance it must be, to have a leisure yacht holding up proceedings, and I'm not condoning such action, but it also seems wrong for them to lie (if that was the case).

I can't help feeling that the vast majority of us would happily comply with a reasonable, friendly, request, especially when it contains the 'magic word', but some might decide to insist on exercising their rights in the face of unauthorised 'instructions'.
 
NealB said:
I can't help feeling that the vast majority of us would comply with a reasonable request, especially when it contains the 'magic word', but some might decide to insist on exercising their rights in the face of unauthorised 'instructions'.
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Exactly so.

The leaflet linked upthread is perfectly pitched - a polite request, with reasons. The crews on the water need a reminder to do the same - exceeding their authority by barking orders can only be counter-productive.

Pete
 
I've seen both sides of this; was a visitor at test ranges - in Wales& Scotland, where our very very expensive ' Range Slot ' we might have been slogging hard for weeks to get ready for, had to be scrubbed because of boats on the range ; in those places it was always fishing boats though.

OTOH the Lulworth Range is a serious pain causing boats a long diversion, which could even cause dangerous fatigue with a small crew - I have always thought it's a silly place to have a gunnery range.

The range boats DO come over very official / officious in my experience.

My Dad once tried ' exercising his right to transit ' and went on through Lulworth Range; to be met by a colossal splash like the depth charge films from WWII.

He decided to go south around it after all.

We have often wondered if it was a squaddie with a sense of humour, or nobody knew he was there !
 
I have to say that some of the comments do not reflect my experience in transiting the Lulworth Range. I have always found range control and the safety boats to be extremely polite and helpful, they will usually give a line of latitude for you to stay south of, and a point abeam of which you can resume your own navigation. This usually greatly decreases the extra distance and inconvenience and, in my view, is a small price to pay if it aids our armed forces.
 
I've transmitted the Aberporth range several times (first few without being aware of it) but now we look at the range info on the net so we are aware of when and if they are firing. Haven't been challenged to date. Last time we went close to one of the targets in daylight, they are pretty big and unlit at night so you need to look out for them esp in the dark.
 
At ranges, aircraft have to do a ' dry run ' over the target, both to get alignments right and as a last check no-one is there, before the ' hot run ' to loose off whatever it is they're dropping or firing.

We had two occasions with Sea Harriers - over rough seas - when the Test Pilot was cleared ' in hot ' and at the last second saw a fishing boat in the way; once for a dive rocket attack in Lyme Bay, once for an anti-ship missile at Aberporth - the fishing boats might well even have had a Russian contingent in those days, but anyway if he hadn't spotted them there might have been tons of paperwork for a lot of people !
 
I was happily sailing out of the Tay - close to the coast to commune with the seals and stay out of the flood - and bloke in cammo came strolling down the beach and told me to get away from the shore and in to the channel

(and out into the strong flood)

polite man
 
Out of nothing more than curiosity, a couple of years ago, I did a bit of digging around the various range byelaws and, as far as I could tell, there is only one range in the UK where the right to transit doesn't exist and that is Shoeburyness

All the others, it seems, legally must operate a clear range procedure and cease fire to allow vessels to transit through the range area

(I have no idea why it's different for Shoeburyness although a clue might lie in the fact that the byelaws for that range date back to the 1930s whilst the others all seem to use a variation of a standard form of byelaws of post war origin)

(Another possibility occurs to me as I write which is that the Shoeburyness range area is almost entirely drying mud and sand and isn't an area that shipping or even yachts would habitually navigate)

Being a generally civic minded sort of chap I wouldn't insist on transiting an active range as a matter of course but if it was necessary for the welfare of my crew* or the safety of my vessel...

* which would certainly include getting to the pub before last orders :)
 
More than happy to avoid the ranges and even Lulworth doesn't add that much extra time if you time your passage correctly. Equally never had a rude range safety boat.

However - being ordered to clear the range by a snotty oik in the boat would lead me to exercise my right to safe passage and I might be low on fuel so best not run the engine and then I'm not sure that full sail would be a good idea in a F4 so best reef just in case the gusts are bigger than I thought. The state and employees of it need to understand that the law applies to them
 
Erbas said:
Being a generally civic minded sort of chap I wouldn't insist on transiting an active range as a matter of course but if it was necessary for the welfare of my crew* or the safety of my vessel...
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Or, if the range staff are being dicks. Which is where we came in.

The bosses understand the situation very clearly, and are doing all the right things to maximise clear range time. But the staff on the ground (or water) are undermining their efforts (if behaving as reported).

Pete
 
I believe the Lulworth range boats are operated by Smit who are contracted to the MOD to carry out the task. As with other examples once an oik gets into a position of perceived power they can tend to go overboard (no pun intended!).
 
Erbas said:
* which would certainly include getting to the pub before last orders :)
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A true boater in every sense of the word! :encouragement: I used to sail with a chap whose mantra was "Aleing & sailing in that order" and there have been times when I did not believe that a Jaguar 27 could get up to a hull speed of double figures but he managed it when "last orders" was fast approaching! :eek:
 
Giblets said:
I believe the Lulworth range boats are operated by Smit who are contracted to the MOD to carry out the task. As with other examples once an oik gets into a position of perceived power they can tend to go overboard (no pun intended!).
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I've always found them pleasant and courteous.

I did insist on sailing through the range once. I was sailing from Poole to Weymouth and discovered that one battery had gone flat and the other was a bit dodgy. I wasn't sure if the alternator was charging. Visibility was about 3 miles and I had turned off my instruments to save the remaining battery for engine starting. The wind was N but the forecast was for gusts up to F7. All this meant that I didn't want to go offshore and lose sight of land. It wasn't a problem. The range safety vessel crew just told me to use the engine and transit as fast as I could. With a strong northerly wind, this was very quick.
 
I seem to remember the Admiralty Notices re the range at Wembury ( closed down now I believe ) read something like ' rapid fire automatic weapons are often used in the direction of the Mew Stone so vessels should not loiter in this area ' ...:)

Shoeburyness range is used for all sorts of things, largely for taking bits of new and old aircraft and blasting them with assorted weapons to see how the structures hold up; so I'd guess they don't have much of a clue where any ricochets or straight through rounds might go. this also always seemed a pointless exercise and drain on the taxpayer, to me.
 
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