the smallest practical sailboat

Bosun Higgs

Bosun Higgs

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I was fascinated this afternoon to see tied alongside a 14ft sailing yacht with two berths, an o/b and a bucket and chuckit system. Looked ideal for pottering round the lake behind Cardiff barrage but I couldnt imagine taking it out into the channel.

But it started me wondering which is the smallest production boat that the average cruising sailor could use for coastal cruising / cross channel trips in reasonable safety and with a modicum of comfort. Not interested in the fools / brave souls who cross the Atlantic in an 8 ft boat. But cant help thinking that the modern trend to ever bigger boats just builds up expense and gives much less fun.
 
Well I've little doubt that my 22ft Dehler could go just about anywhere if you really wanted as its just a scaled down version of bigger cruising Dehlers of its time, but its skinny and headrooms not super fantastic. The Swift 18 has enough room to cruise..just, but in terms of sea work and wave work I'd really want 25 to 30 ft boat. The Pippin 20 (Robert Tucker design) is probably the roomiest 20 footer that can still sail properly. Nicely made too....hoping they survive the recession down at Sutterton where they make em near Boston.

Unless its very beamy 14ft is a wee bit small for me.

Tim
 
Re 14 ftr.

The man must be mad sailing a 14 footer. Didnt look a bit like this by any chance?? :-)

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When young and indestructable I sailed the length and breadth of the Bristol Channel in a Lysander 17 which had a very big safety flaw in that the cockpit wasnt self draining.To be on the safe side we allways carried two large builders buckets for bailing but in reality rarely ever needed them.

At least the Voyager is unsinkable and has a draining cockpit.But with a few more years behind me now I think it will be sailed mostly on sheltered waters.Well maybe a few short cruises in settled weather......
 
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Bosun Higgs said:
I was fascinated this afternoon to see tied alongside a 14ft sailing yacht with two berths, an o/b and a bucket and chuckit system. Looked ideal for pottering round the lake behind Cardiff barrage but I couldnt imagine taking it out into the channel.

But it started me wondering which is the smallest production boat that the average cruising sailor could use for coastal cruising / cross channel trips in reasonable safety and with a modicum of comfort. Not interested in the fools / brave souls who cross the Atlantic in an 8 ft boat. But cant help thinking that the modern trend to ever bigger boats just builds up expense and gives much less fun.
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Very much depends on the height of the owner! I wanted the smallest boat I could practically use. Main stipulations were that I could sit upright in the saloon, I could lay flat out on a berth and I could sit on the toilet. At 6'6" there are surprising number of boats that are ruled out and so I ended up with a 29footer.
 
Bosun Higgs said:
But it started me wondering which is the smallest production boat that the average cruising sailor could use for coastal cruising / cross channel trips in reasonable safety and with a modicum of comfort.
Click to expand...

I had a huge amount of fun round the West of Scotland in my 21' Westerly Jouster, and I still find her quite roomy enough for me on my own. I recently acquired a Hunter 490 (16') and though she sails and handles delightfully, there just isn't enough room in the cabin that I can imagine being comfortable there for more than a night or two. That Hunter 19 that they raffled at the Boat Show, on the other hand, looked fine for extended periods.

So for me (6'4" tall) the cut-off is around 19' or so. My nice new 26 footer feels incredibly spacious, although if I ever sneeze on the toilet something is going to have to give.

I think you're quite right about sizes nowadays. There seems to be an assumption that nobody could ever contemplate sailing in less than 32' and that real cruising - whatever that is - takes at least 34'. Folks, that Just. Ain't. True.
 
graham said:
The man must be mad sailing a 14 footer. Didnt look a bit like this by any chance?? :-)

010.jpg



When young and indestructable I sailed the length and breadth of the Bristol Channel in a Lysander 17 which had a very big safety flaw in that the cockpit wasnt self draining.To be on the safe side we allways carried two large builders buckets for bailing but in reality rarely ever needed them.
Click to expand...

Me too, and down the N Devon coast and well up into the Irish Sea, in first a 17-foot GRP centreboarder, then a 18 ft plywood Caprice bilge-keeler. Neither had self-draining cockpits, both powered by the same 3 hp Seagull outboard until eventually I sprung for a new 4 hp. No guardwires, jackstays, VHF, and an military-surplus rubber and cotton Mae West lifejacket that I never wore except when racing dinghies. Charts, compass, HB compass and leadline. I had a sextant before an echosounder or RDF. I actually ran aground more after buying the echosounder as it let me cut corners and you looked at the faint spinning and dancing light instead of the look of the water.

These days I quite like 35 ft, a nice Yanmar, and two chartplotters, one at the helm and one below!
 
" I actually ran aground more after buying the echosounder as it let me cut corners and you looked at the faint spinning and dancing light instead of the look of the water."

Absolutely right. I wonder also how many boats have hit things because the "skipper" was peering into a chart plotter constantly instead of looking at the real world.
 
I've got a (just short of) 21ft Coromandel, a bit tight for space with 2 of us with all our gear, but big enough. Single-handed there's room to live aboard!
 
Newbridge Voyager

The Newbridge Voyager just has to be in the small and very practical category, with six feet headroom, enough space for two to live on comfortably (although they say she is a five birth). They have an inboard engine and a dry-ish cockpit, with some successfully completing the Jester Challenge.:D
 
My First 18 was the smallest boat on one of the Clyde cruises I went on with the TSA. There was a Manta 19 too but the rest were more like 22-23' and needed a 4x4 to tow them.
I got chatting to a bloke in the Vic in Tarbert who had been cruising a Wayfarer. He had been weather bound in Campbeltown for a couple of days though.
I saw a very nice looking wood (ply) 14' job on Windermere, based on a GP14 IIRC. Two berth with twin daggerboards that came out through the cabin top like those racy round the world jobbies. In sheltered waters, with a weather forecast, you can sail anything.
 
graham said:
The man must be mad sailing a 14 footer. Didnt look a bit like this by any chance?? :-)

010.jpg

.
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Yes - and as far as I can tell it looks like the same chap in it. Is that you?

Got to admit I was quite taken by the idea of something so small and simple ( it's the boat I'm referring to in case you wonder).
 
aquaplane said:
I got chatting to a bloke in the Vic in Tarbert who had been cruising a Wayfarer. He had been weather bound in Campbeltown for a couple of days though.
.
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There's a group of dinghy cruisers down here, and there have been times when they have gone out in bad weather when I cowered in harbour with 25kn on the nose. A couple of them crossed the English channel against a F6 in a wayfarer and I believe the French authorities tried to dissuade them from crossing back again on safety grounds. Headbangers!

There is a crossover point though. As you get bigger, the boat might be safer but becomes more difficult for a single person to handle. As it gets smaller, its easier to handle but less comfortable and less safe in extremis. So where is the sweetspot?
 
Define the word practical

In the context of the question…..how do we define the word practical?

I would say:

Being warm dry and comfortable.
Being able to take heavy weather to achieve your objective (get to where you want to go).
Inboard engine so that pitching is not an issue.
Enclosed Heads so that you do not have to share your experiences with others (could put me off my food).:D
Galley for hot food.
Standing headroom (we’re not getting any younger) if you intend to use her for more than an overnight.
Ample storage to enable you to “store for sea”.
 
Old Glow In The Deeps said:
In the context of the question…..how do we define the word practical?

I would say:

Being warm dry and comfortable.
Being able to take heavy weather to achieve your objective (get to where you want to go).
Inboard engine so that pitching is not an issue.
Enclosed Heads so that you do not have to share your experiences with others (could put me off my food).:D
Galley for hot food.
Standing headroom (we’re not getting any younger) if you intend to use her for more than an overnight.
Ample storage to enable you to “store for sea”.
Click to expand...

But that's the logic that has led me to the 35footer that is really a bit big for me to single hand in my dotage. I don't believe any small boat is warm dry and comfortable in heavy weather and nor do I think I need to plan for heavy weather with all these forecasts available and in retirement when I dont need to get back for anything.

Sure an inboard engine is a plus because by avoiding unfavourable wether you end up doing more motoring. Toilet - yes I agree. But storage will only get full of seldom used rubbish.
 
The First 18 was open plan so I avoided getting wet because there was no where to dry stuff. A spray hood in conjunction with the boom tent could give a bit more flexibility in that regard.
I can't think af a boat that hasn't got somewhere to put a camping stove so brewing up and cooking is possible anywhere. Putting the kettle on while in bed was a bonus in the First.
Single handed a seperate head is'nt high on my list of must haves. If it's quiet an alfresco squat in the cockpit works, otherwise inside is as good.
I can single hand my 26' Centaur, have a seperate head, can stand up, can dry stuff off, and have 2 rings to cook on but the same applies to a 23' Pagent or 21' Warwick. I can't trail any of those though so to me they are bigger than practical.
 
Standing headroom (we’re not getting any younger) if you intend to use her for more than an overnight.
Ample storage to enable you to “store for sea”.
Click to expand...

With that requirement I would be into the 40+ foot range. Basically I resigned myself to the fact that if I want to stand I need to go outside!
 
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