bushwacka
Active Member
These don't come up for sale often. Old but still a very capable classic up for grabs. Looks very underpriced or am I missing something?
Pardon our interruption...
Pardon our interruption...
The mother of all bargains?
- Thread starter bushwacka
- Start date
Leslie frank
Well-Known Member
Very pretty lines. I didn't realise it would be saildrive. Looks a bargain
mrming
Well-Known Member
They weren’t a saildrive originally (don’t think it had been invented). In the photo of the saildrive you can see where the prop used to exit the top of the keel. This is because the engine was midships under a bit of settee that stuck out (not present here). In this boat the engine has been relocated to the companionway area.
Buck Turgidson
Well-Known Member
Money pit with dodgy engine swap. I assume it's yours.
Stemar
Well-Known Member
Money pit, certainly - that's a good definition of any boat, but why a dodgy engine swap? Yes, I'd prefer a shaft drive, but she looks tidy, and the price reflects the fact that a lot of potential buyers would be put off by it.
At that price, I reckon she'd be well worth a look.
At that price, I reckon she'd be well worth a look.
Blueboatman
Well-Known Member
New mast boom and rig
And a sensible engine
That’s a lot of the big ticket items
They sail beautifully
And a sensible engine
That’s a lot of the big ticket items
They sail beautifully
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Particularly if you get rid of that huge 3 bladed prop and fitted a folder.
Baggywrinkle
Well-Known Member
I guess a saildrive swap makes sense ... glass in the engine/saildrive bed and cut a hole in the hull.
Probably getting more and more of a faff to find reconditioned v-drives or spare parts which is probably what was originally fitted given the engine location. It's what Corby Yachts are doing with their Contessa 38.
... there's life in the old dog yet
Probably getting more and more of a faff to find reconditioned v-drives or spare parts which is probably what was originally fitted given the engine location. It's what Corby Yachts are doing with their Contessa 38.
... there's life in the old dog yet
RunAgroundHard
Well-Known Member
I guess a saildrive swap makes sense ... glass in the engine/saildrive bed and cut a hole in the hull.
Probably getting more and more of a faff to find reconditioned v-drives or spare parts which is probably what was originally fitted given the engine location. It's what Corby Yachts are doing with their Contessa 38.
View attachment 206412
... there's life in the old dog yet
It doesn’t make sense. You and others would be highly critical of anyone who came on here saying they were thinking of doing that on a MAB. You and others would be all over the proposal claiming that buying a AWB would be better and then writing paragraphs justifying your position.
The volte-face is extraordinary!
KevinV
Well-Known Member
new rig, etc, but no mention of the sails? leaky coachroof which means taking the liner down, lots of paint and varnish required....
It's a lovely boat, but the price looks reasonable rather than cheap when you take the work into account - and the fact the seller has moved on already..
It's a lovely boat, but the price looks reasonable rather than cheap when you take the work into account - and the fact the seller has moved on already..
Baggywrinkle
Well-Known Member
Looking at the OPs post, it's not possible to get an AWB that size for that money so it's a pointless argument. Getting afloat for 8k in that 34ft boat is not a financial risk, the engine and saildrive are where the majority of the value lies, so a bit of DIY from someone capable and it could find a good home.
As for the Contessa 38 which is getting a saildrive, it is being completely re-built. The amount of work involved to get it up to a condition equivalent or better than a recent AWB is completely transparent, so no need to say anything. He want's a Contessa 38 and he's prepared to spend what it takes to get the boat he wants. Nothing wrong with that - he's open and honest about the effort needed.
The reason I post about AWBs being a good option is when other posters are disingenuous and don't talk honestly about the issues involved in buying older boats - boats from the 80s and early 90s really need careful consideration - there is a reason they initially look like bargains - but there is nothing magical about them when it comes to voyaging other than nostalgia. They are simply older design approaches to the same job.
The Moody 419 on another current thread is an example of the reality of what can pop up when tropes like "old boats are better built" or "modern boats are rubbish" go unchallenged. To bring that boat up to a standard equivalent to a privately owned, much younger AWB will involve a massive amount of investment, pushing the eventual price into decent AWB territory. The teak deck is shot, and the deck underneath is balsa cored with thousands of screws in it, the chainplates are leaking and are attached to a plywood bulkhead, there are areas of water ingress inside the boat ... Everything was fine when the boat was young, but age and neglected maintenance now make it a liability for the uninitiated. If the buyer goes into the purchase aware of the issues, then fair enough. It's his decision, and if he likes the boat, and knows what to expect, I've got nothing more to say on the subject.
My point is that it's the boat condition that determines if it is safe to go long distance cruising or not. The decade it was built basically reflects the features it does or doesn't have, not if it is ultimately suitable for the ARC, world ARC etc.
However, the older the boat, the more likely it is to have expensive or hair raising problems. This is simply a fact. Some are still in excellent condition but they are very much in the minority.
The most vociferous campaigner for old style "blue water boats" on this forum set off across the Atlantic with a bodged mast support that he (and his surveyor if he had one) obviously missed. It was found when the floor started making odd noises. The bodge involved replacing the bottom of the corroded mild steel mast support with a stainless section, welded in by an amateur, while the bottle jack holding the mast up slowly sank. The resultant support ended up too short. (The original option to pull the mast and remove the support for repair - do it properly - was deemed too expensive, hence the bodge). The welds looked like "bird shit", they didn't go all the way round the support as there was no access to one side due to interior furniture - but the owner set off across the Atlantic anyway. On the other side, the welding was re-done, shims were put under the support, and the main bulkhead which had come away from the hull (either from the jacking or the resultant load) had to be re-tabbed. This poster champions old "solid blue water boats", trashes AWBs regardless, but never mentions issues associated with older boats, or his personal experience of owning one, unless it is positive of course. I'll always challenge disingenuous posters, but I won't try and dictate what boat people should buy, that has to be up to them based on their own criteria.
ridgy
Well-Known Member
Hardly a bargain, there are loads of these old "classics" for sale under 10k. Try this one:
Pardon our interruption...
Pardon our interruption...
doug748
Well-Known Member
I think they are both bargains in their different ways. Of the two I would prefer your Rival though.
We encapsulated, lead keels they are already in front of 95% of boats on the water in terms of quality and reliability so, happy days.
.
ducked
Well-Known Member
If its got a balsa cored deck, it is a relatively modern boat (relative to my Trident 24 reference frame) and thus, by definition, at its core, relatively rubbish.
But then I dont know what an AWB is.
Average White Boat?
Is there a site glossary for this sort of jive?
justanothersailboat
Well-Known Member
AWB is Average White Boat. For some reason people here use "AWB" to describe 90s through 2010ish middling cruisers, the Jenneau/Beneteau/Bavaria/other makers are available white plastic bathtubs that all look and work pretty much the same. Some people here love to use the term as a contrast, to imply that other boats are MABs, Manky Auld Boats.
My suggestion that modern post-classic-AWB-era broad-open-sterned types be called FABs (Fat Ar...) didn't really catch on.
Your Trident 24 is just small, not particularly old. Larger GRP boats have balsa cored decks back to the 60s at least, solid decks would be too much topweight. The core is often not a problem at all on boats with painted decks and no bodgey previous owner mods making extra holes in it, tens of thousands of them are fine. However when a boat has screw-down teak deck planking on a balsa core the odds of problems become very high - hundreds of extra holes to fail. It's not insurmountable, just more work. It wouldn't really make a boat expensive unless you paid other people to deal with it.
I still wouldn't buy that one.
Sea Change
Well-Known Member
So is my 1988 Jeanneau an AWB? She more closely resembles a MAB (Manky Auld Boat) and looks nothing like her modern contemporaries, with a relatively narrow stern, single wheel and rudder, and shaft drive. She does have a sugar scoop, although not a completely open transom.
justanothersailboat
Well-Known Member
I have absolutely no idea, I'm not one of the major AWB advocates. She sounds like the kind of balance of old and new features that can be really good.
I doubt you leave her in "manky" condition and I really hate the assertion that older boats are. They often scrub up really nicely in my experience.
Sea Change
Well-Known Member
Well in fairness we found her in a manky condition... four years in a Caribbean boatyard will do that.
Gradually bringing her back as time and budget allows.
zoidberg
Well-Known Member
'Slipstream of Cowley'. Was used by the RAF Sailing Association for RORC races.
I've sailed on her, several times, in the early 70s.
Remarkable that she's still around, alive and kicking and, with the help of some TLC, able to do some more.
Same thing could be said of me....
potentillaCO32
Well-Known Member
I think a saildrive swap makes sense if the engineering is done by Corby. However the saildrive grp 'buck' is fairly large and has to be precisely shaped and bonded to a flattish area of the hull with fairly exact finishing dimensions. Easy enough for Corby to do but not sure i would be keen on trusting someone else to do it.I guess a saildrive swap makes sense ... glass in the engine/saildrive bed and cut a hole in the hull.
Probably getting more and more of a faff to find reconditioned v-drives or spare parts which is probably what was originally fitted given the engine location. It's what Corby Yachts are doing with their Contessa 38.
View attachment 206412
... there's life in the old dog yet