Thank St Greta for saving us

WayneS said:
One of the most emotive things that I have watched which tugged at the hearts of the world some years ago were some Pacific islanders showing the world how their Island was been gobbled up by rising sea levels. Some of their houses were 2m below sea level now. Well, the last time I looked at the mean high water mark in Portsmouth it was about the same place as it has been for hunderds of years and as far as I know, water levels itself out, so could it possibly be the land mass that was sinking instead?
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https://www.bas.ac.uk/data/our-data/publication/sea-level-rise-2/
 
There are raised beaches all around the Scottish coast, which show where sea levels have been in the past. The variations in sea level have been mostly attributed to the land rising over the past 10,000 years, due to the weight of the ice which covered most of the land in the last Ice Age, being removed.

Bad news for some:- As Scotland still very gradually rises, England slowly sinks.
 
Ohlin Karcher said:
I will leave this thread to the previously mentioned "easily duped mugs, unwilling to admit their own gullibility" , so they don't need to shame themselves by making personal attacks to distract from their lack of facts.
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Still waiting for you to provide me some real scientific evidence to back up your assertion that there is no problem with climate change. I feel that I may be waiting for some time.
 
WayneS said:
One of the problems we face is that it is possible to prove Anything with science, just be selective with your data or evidence.

Both sides of the lobby have shot themselves in the foot many times with crazy predictions, misreporting, blatant lies and misrepresentatiuon of the facts. Its a bit like Brexit now, there is a yawn factor creeping in where people cannot be bothered any more.

Another point to bear in mind is that the sceientific community need funding. The more expreme their predictions, the more chance that they will receive funding.

One of the most emotive things that I have watched which tugged at the hearts of the world some years ago were some Pacific islanders showing the world how their Island was been gobbled up by rising sea levels. Some of their houses were 2m below sea level now. Well, the last time I looked at the mean high water mark in Portsmouth it was about the same place as it has been for hunderds of years and as far as I know, water levels itself out, so could it possibly be the land mass that was sinking instead? But lets not let facts get in the way of a good story hey.
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All the usual garbage with no hard facts to substantiate it. To anyone who has a basic understanding of the physics, it is absolutely clear. Man is causing unnatural change to our climate. If you or anyone does not agree, then please give a cogent reason or reasons. of the physics, it is absolutely clear. Man is causing unnatural change to our climate. If you or anyone does not agree, then please give a cogent reason or reasons.
 
JumbleDuck said:
She started her protest just a year ago, which makes the effect even more remarkable. Unfortunately the solutions she demands are so simplistic and unachievable that there is absolutely no chance of them being met That would inevitably mean some combination of widespread disillusionment or widespread resentment. Either way, I don;t think it will be long before her young fans have moved on to something else ... and we'll still be in a mess.
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She has plenty of old fans as well, me included
 
franksingleton said:
All the usual garbage with no hard facts to substantiate it. To anyone who has a basic understanding of the physics, it is absolutely clear. Man is causing unnatural change to our climate. If you or anyone does not agree, then please give a cogent reason or reasons. of the physics, it is absolutely clear. Man is causing unnatural change to our climate. If you or anyone does not agree, then please give a cogent reason or reasons.
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It does not matter much whether adverse climate changes due to global warming are wholly or partly caused by human activity, the solution and concerns are the same: minimise humanity's impact, encourage the absorption or sequestration of CO2. Greta is trying to raise awareness of the problem, we can't expect her to come up with all solutions on her own
 
T
oldmanofthehills said:
It does not matter much whether adverse climate changes due to global warming are wholly or partly caused by human activity, the solution and concerns are the same: minimise humanity's impact, encourage the absorption or sequestration of CO2. Greta is trying to raise awareness of the problem, we can't expect her to come up with all solutions on her own
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It does matter insofar as we can reduce emissions to try to minimise man’s effects. We know the maximum CO2 concentrations that occur naturally. We are well above that limit and increasingly so. We know that CH4 is highly dependent on CO2. We know that there was no N2O or CFCs in our natural environment. We know that CFCs reduce stratospheric O3. That lets more heat from the sun to reach the earth.

Greta is a distraction. She is one of many messengers. That point is ignored by the backwoodsmen in this thread who seize up0n her to denigrate the science. Her Atlantic stunt may have done some good in helping get the message across. In this thread, it has backfired insofar as she has become a figure of fun. In no way does that invalidate the message.
 
franksingleton said:
T

It does matter insofar as we can reduce emissions to try to minimise man’s effects. We know the maximum CO2 concentrations that occur naturally. We are well above that limit and increasingly so. We know that CH4 is highly dependent on CO2. We know that there was no N2O or CFCs in our natural environment. We know that CFCs reduce stratospheric O3. That lets more heat from the sun to reach the earth.

Greta is a distraction. She is one of many messengers. That point is ignored by the backwoodsmen in this thread who seize up0n her to denigrate the science. Her Atlantic stunt may have done some good in helping get the message across. In this thread, it has backfired insofar as she has become a figure of fun. In no way does that invalidate the message.
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I still think it doesnt matter so much about the causes if we can fix the problem. Many on this planet remind me of homepath friend who when faced with an injury worry more about what imbalance caused it rather than how it could be cured. If you found a nail in your foot you would get it out before asking who dropped it on the path. There may well be some natural rises in temperature as well as human - but if we dont get the temperature stable we are still f***d
 
franksingleton said:
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The title of this thread is rather silly. If the intention is to discuss climate change then the thread should be transferred to the Climate Change forum.
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The intention is to draw attention to the possibility of more regulation and bureaucracy impacting on our freedoms.
As boat owners we do not need more regulation and thus it is important to respond to this stupidity.

The fact that such regulation and indeed the entire consultation is not justified needs to be part of the response. Other matters relating to climate change are a separate issue.
 
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Tomahawk said:
The intention is to draw attention to the possibility of more regulation and bureaucracy impacting on our freedoms.
As boat owners we do not need more regulation and thus it is important to respond to this stupidity.

The fact that such regulation and indeed the entire consultation is not justified needs to be part of the response. Other matters relating to climate change are a separate issue.
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Not much regulation and bureaucracy though, not compared to being dead.
 
Do I take it you believe that reducing your sailing derrived carbon footprint will make you immortal.

I suppost it is a different religion. But evidence shows you will die regardless of what you do.
 
oldmanofthehills said:
I still think it doesnt matter so much about the causes if we can fix the problem. Many on this planet remind me of homepath friend who when faced with an injury worry more about what imbalance caused it rather than how it could be cured. If you found a nail in your foot you would get it out before asking who dropped it on the path. There may well be some natural rises in temperature as well as human - but if we dont get the temperature stable we are still f***d
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This dhows climate over N Europe over the last 2000 years.
https://phys.org/news/2012-07-climate-northern-europe-reconstructed-years.html.

There were natural changes and an overall slow cooling. We know a fair amount about natural change. However, we are seeing unnatural change.. whether we can do much must be uncertain. But, that does not mean that we should not try. We know a great deal about GHGs. Satellite sensors show the absorption by each gas. We know that reducing emissions will slow down the unnatural warming. We will have to adapt but, clearly, that does not depend on knowing cause and effect - as you say.
 
franksingleton said:
This dhows climate over N Europe over the last 2000 years.
https://phys.org/news/2012-07-climate-northern-europe-reconstructed-years.html.

There were natural changes and an overall slow cooling. We know a fair amount about natural change. However, we are seeing unnatural change.. whether we can do much must be uncertain. But, that does not mean that we should not try. We know a great deal about GHGs. Satellite sensors show the absorption by each gas. We know that reducing emissions will slow down the unnatural warming. We will have to adapt but, clearly, that does not depend on knowing cause and effect - as you say.
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+1
 
Tomahawk said:
The intention is to draw attention to the possibility of more regulation and bureaucracy impacting on our freedoms.
As boat owners we do not need more regulation
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Essential to remember that we as recreational boaters sometimes also benefit greatly from regulations and 'bureaucracy'
For instance, in this case targeting land owners:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_to_roam
To which can be added, at least in some countries, including my own, heavy restrictions on building too close to the shoreline, thus privatizing it.
 
Tomahawk said:
The intention is to draw attention to the possibility of more regulation and bureaucracy impacting on our freedoms.
As boat owners we do not need more regulation and thus it is important to respond to this stupidity.

The fact that such regulation and indeed the entire consultation is not justified needs to be part of the response. Other matters relating to climate change are a separate issue.
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I am not aware of any great regulatory framework that affects my sailing. My beef is that there was no need to refer to Greta at all, never mind the St Greta. By doing so you invited discussion of climate change. Looking at the article, it seems perfectly fair. Large vessels will be assessed for pollution. They will point out the vast numbers of leisure craft and cry foul if we are not assessed also. From my perspective, compared to other countries, we currently have little regulation
 
Tomahawk said:
Do I take it you believe that reducing your sailing derrived carbon footprint will make you immortal.

I suppost it is a different religion. But evidence shows you will die regardless of what you do.
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Nahh, I believe that its a shitty thing to crap all over the place you and others do and will live.

Its not how or when I die but if I was nice to others. You, apparently dont give a damn about anyone else.
 
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