Thames Barges

Sniper said:
I don't think this thread should be considered antagonistic to Thames barges per se. The majority of barge skippers are quite happy to abide by the col regs and are competent to handle their craft accordingly. However, there is one barge whose name always seems to crop up in these discussions....
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That will be the "prickly" one. Perhaps Top Sail Charter would be interested in this and the other thread. http://www.top-sail.co.uk/thistle.htm
 
Stork_III said:
That will be the "prickly" one. Perhaps Top Sail Charter would be interested in this and the other thread. http://www.top-sail.co.uk/thistle.htm
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The photo of your sailing dog reminds me of the following sailing barge yarn

Two old barge hands were in a pub frequented by yachtsmen.

They were boasting of how the spritsail barges were always sailed with a small crew, usually two.

Ted said "Do you remember old Bill?"

Fred replied "Oh yes. I remember him alright. Used to sail with just himself and a dog"

A yachtsman drew near as the barge men ostentatiously flourished their empty glasses.

After a pause for refilling Ted said "That's right. The dog used to take the wheel when they was wending, and old Bill used to back the foresail"

Fred said "Why didn't Bill steer?"

"Cos the bloody dog couldn't reach the bowline." said Ted

The astonished yachtsman exclaimed "But that's incredible. I've never heard of anything like that. I'm very impressed."

"Don't you be too impressed, sir" said Ted "That old dog used to pinch her something rotten!"
 
To go back to the OP, you acknowledge a large blind spot in front of the bow. I have an even bigger one when my massive genoa is unrolled, which means I am up and down peeping round it every few seconds, or getting someone to look out around it, to see anything to my lee in good time. It hasn't occurred to me to promulgate this via the internet, let alone speak to the MCA about it. Perhaps you should post a lookout?
 
parsifal said:
The photo of your sailing dog reminds me of the following sailing barge yarn

Two old barge hands were in a pub frequented by yachtsmen.

They were boasting of how the spritsail barges were always sailed with a small crew, usually two.

Ted said "Do you remember old Bill?"

Fred replied "Oh yes. I remember him alright. Used to sail with just himself and a dog"

A yachtsman drew near as the barge men ostentatiously flourished their empty glasses.

After a pause for refilling Ted said "That's right. The dog used to take the wheel when they was wending, and old Bill used to back the foresail"

Fred said "Why didn't Bill steer?"

"Cos the bloody dog couldn't reach the bowline." said Ted

The astonished yachtsman exclaimed "But that's incredible. I've never heard of anything like that. I'm very impressed."

"Don't you be too impressed, sir" said Ted "That old dog used to pinch her something rotten!"
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Excellent!


Anyways.... The only thing Timmy pinches is the packaging from jumbo hot dogs....
 
"vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway
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I am sorry but what does that actually mean?

Like does it mean a barge can naivgate safely if it is making passage up the Barrow where the channel is narrow, but it becomes unsafe crossing from Southend to the Swale where it can tack or whatever shere it wants?
 
Tomahawk said:
I am sorry but what does that actually mean?

Like does it mean a barge can naivgate safely if it is making passage up the Barrow where the channel is narrow, but it becomes unsafe crossing from Southend to the Swale where it can tack or whatever shere it wants?
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Yes it does sound odd, but it is intended to refer to an area of water,with a deeper "channel" or "fairway" which certain vessels must follow or go aground, due to their draught.
It could be anything from The Swale, right up to the English Channel for very deep draughted vessels.
It might be well buoyed or not at all.
All this stuff is written by lawyers really so can sound silly! cheers Jerry (Outremer fan btw)
edited to add, assuming you are not mucking about ;)
 
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Last year I was becalmed off pin mill and just happily drifting across the river, one of the barges coming up river had miles of room either side of me but deliberately held a course directly at me I had to start the engine and power away from him. Ok he would probably have altered course but no way was I hanging around to find out.

His action was totally unnecessary as he could have seem me from miles away.

I also had another being a idiot in Harwich when I was close hauled and he was under power, I was forced to tack away from him. I was sailing in a force 6 and well reefed so last thing I needed was an unnecessary tack.

Sorry but some of the barge skippers are not doing themselves any good relationship wise. I avoid them if I can as I have no desire to take a hit from them.

Rivers big enough for all of us its a matter of using common sense.

Oh and as a result of these two incidents I will not hire the barges for corporate hospitality, which I have in the past. So what goes around comes around,
 
kevburt said:
Due to comments made on another thread I felt that it might be worthwhile putting the following facts on here regarding the handling of Thames Barges:

Firstly a vessels size increases by volume therefore a 90 foot vessel it’s nearer 6 times the size of a 30 foot one. Also barges weigh something in the region of a hundred tons.

Secondly although they have a shallow draft for their size this is counteracted by high windage, sometimes this means that to manoeuvre slowly the leeboards need to be lowered increasing draft by several feet.

Thirdly they have a very large turning circle and most of them have an engine to one side of centre restricting their ability to turn.

Fourthly there is a very large blind spot directly in front of the bow.

In view of the above facts, discussions have taken place with the MCA who have asserted that Barges come under Rule 9 as a "vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway."

Rule 9

(b) A vessel of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can
safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway.

As such when motoring in any such area Barges are required to keep as far to the starboard side of the channel as they can and maintain course and speed so that any vessels of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel can take appropriate action to avoid them.

In spite of this generally speaking as fellow sailors, Bargemen will try to avoid causing disruption to vessels sailing especially if they are doing something like beating up against wind and tide but in general we can’t be expected to know whether the other vessel will go beyond the channel before tacking so trying to slow down or turn would only create difficulty as the other craft could then tack across our bows and we might not be able to see them do so.
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Having seen Thistle on the water today, I'd like to know how much of her overall length is bowsprit ... cos the hull certainly does not look 86 foot long.
 
I was fortunate to be a guest at a party on a barge out of Maldon this weekend.
As we sailed past Heybridge under topsail & 1/2 main, we met some dinghies racing. I was impressed that the skipper made every effort not to get in their way. The notion that 80 tonnes doing 4 knots could dodge a foiling Moth weighing a few grammes doing 20 knots I thought was amusing, but he did give them some space.
A bit later he noticed a disabled dinghy and called for assistance then stood by until a rescue boat arrived.
They aren't all ignorant idiots.
 
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