Teak Decks - Turkey

Moscowman100

Moscowman100

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Been quoted a steep €700/M2 to replace teak decks on a 50' ketch in Gocek. Anyone able to recommend a good Turkish contractor somewhere along the coast - was hoping to spend no more than €400/M2, otherwise the decks would be worth more than the boat!!
And no... SWMBO will not accept anything except teak!
Thanks

Peter
 
Just be careful of teak in Turkey. A cheap quote might be using the 'wrong' type of teak (I can never remember whether Burmese teak is the good stuff or not). Importing teak has become expensive business so they frequently use alternatives. If you are being quoted that much, however, it's probably the real stuff.

Yat Lift in Bodrum gave me a good quote a few years ago. Management has changed hands since then though. Also, if you can be bothered, it might be worth a wander around the sinai (industrial area) of Marmaris and striking up a dialogue with some of the carpenters there. One of them gave me a stupid cheap quote for woodwork but alas I don't have his contact number.
 
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Been quoted a steep €700/M2 to replace teak decks on a 50' ketch in Gocek.

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Is that just for the teak, or does it include labour?
If it doesn't include labour, it's expensive for Turkey.

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otherwise the decks would be worth more than the boat!!


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Join the club.
A boat with teak decks - never, ever again. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
Can't help with Turkish contractors, sorry.
But out of curiosity (and with apologies for drifting a bit), after how many years is your boat in need of a complete rebuild?
And how was her used during those years (Always in the Med? Outside all year long?).
Ta!
 
Thanks for all the input. Price includes labour and "A1" teak whatever that is - I assume Burma teak.

Boat is nearly 30 yrs old - all the time in the Med and the decks are original. Not leaking (yet!) but looking tired and some of the plugs are starting to fall out; caulking getting proud etc etc. More of a cosmetic issue now but will need to be done sooner rather than later.
 
I all sounds like standard wear and tear rather than a complete new deck.
I have repaced several hundred teak plugs over the past five years.(Take screw out, zip in with an 8mm countersink, replace screw, glue in plug, come back later with sharp chisel and fair off).
For proud caulking, take same very sharp chisel and fair down to deck level.Then give deck a light sanding.
Think of the money you are saving and that will get you through the tedium of it all!
PS a pair of knee pads is a sound investment!!
 
Well, it's very reasonable that 3 decades of med sunshine and rain have taken their toll.
I assume that the deck has been re-caulked at some stage, maybe more than once?
Because if it's still not leaking with a 30 years old caulking, who made that deck must have been from another planet!
Btw, the latest suggestion from saltwater_gypsy is worth a thought: if the existing teak is thick enough and not cracked, you could get an excellent result with a fraction of the cost.
 
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f the existing teak is thick enough and not cracked, you could get an excellent result with a fraction of the cost.

[/ QUOTE ]Agree with that. You should contact Yat Lift that Demonboy has mentioned above. They are experts in both restoration and laying teak decks and they should be able to tell you what your options are. I would trust them; I have used them and they did an absolute sterling job in restoration for a very reasonable price. I had the feeling they went out of their way to ensure that they did not oversell me. I was very happy with the results and price.
 
You may be right about some re-caulking but the previous owner (who owned her from new) is sure that no major repairs were ever done. Original deck was laid in Taiwan - maybe not quite another planet but close!

2 informed votes for Yat Lift - will contact them ASAP. I suspect the deck is now too thin and cracked to be sanded down but I will confirm.

Many thanks for all the input
 
Our decks could do with some recaulking but I do know there is a good thickness of teak by some deck fittings that we had fitted. I was thinking to enquire in Turkey when we get to that region, so please let me know how you get on and who you use.
Our caulking is not proud, just cracking, with excessive exposure to UV I presume. I would not be unduly bothered if the teak was not sanded right back to a perfect finish as I think it's better left in the plank than in the dust collector.

Our decks are not plugged so I'm not sure, but the depth of the plugs should give you some idea of the thickness of the teak planking. Working out from that might give you a clue to the amount that you could sand off after some repairs and recaulking.
It might not be as bad as you first thought, so good fortune with them anyway.
Teak decks are an expensive luxury but I would not want a yacht without them ! Even though there will be plenty on the Forum that will not agree or want them on their yacht.

/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
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I have repaced several hundred teak plugs over the past five years.(Take screw out, zip in with an 8mm countersink, replace screw, glue in plug, come back later with sharp chisel and fair off).

PS a pair of knee pads is a sound investment!!

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I have to replace quite a few teak plugs, and dont really know what I'm doing - again /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

what do you mean by "zip in with an 8mm countersink" .... would it not be already countersunk, or are you saying countersink more - hoping there is enough thickness to countersink more?

What type of glue?

When you say "fair off" do you mean sand down to match the level of the deck.

Agree on the knee pads - essential. I would also suggest that if there is a pair for £8 and one for £15, buy the £15 - the extra padding will be worth it!
 
You really need to know how the deck is consructed. Look on Guapa's website for the GRP/Ply/teak structure which is probably the worst combination. Teak screwed onto GRP with an adhesive is the next worst. Why puncture a monolithic watertight surface with hundreds of holes? Although your plugs popping out and bits of caulking lifting may appear "cosmetic" they are in fact indicators of failure of the deck structure. You may be able to "get away with" re-plugging and re-caulking, but only for a few years. Then the only answer is strip the whole lot off and if you are sensible epoxy glass it and paint. otherwise you will spend as much as the boat is worth on a deck that has a finite life.

Best thing to do is spend the 10-15000 euros on a refurbish then seduce somebody else in love with a teak deck to buy your boat then they will inherit the problem!
 
I think he means counter BORE another 8mm. A countersink is what is used to fair in screw heads.

Align the plugs with the grain of the deck teak and chisel off in an upwards direction to avoid diving the chisel below the surface of the decking and splintering the plug.

I do not use glue but a dab of varnish. In fact, my plugs are often so tight I don't really need to use anything. I cut my own plugs, I should add. /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

To the OP I would say that, if he just has 'a few' plugs falling out this should not herald the need for a completely new deck. I would go for a mini restroration for now.
 
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Although your plugs popping out and bits of caulking lifting may appear "cosmetic" they are in fact indicators of failure of the deck structure.

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Sounds alarming.

What do you mean by 'failure of the deck structure'?

And what do you see as the consequences of this failure?
 
What I mean is that once the plugs come out or the caulking breaks away, water gets in and finds its way into the grp structure through the hundreds of screw holes used to hold the teak planking down. If it is a solid deck this often shows with leaks, and if a cored deck with core degradation.

The basic problem is that GRP (or steel) decks are monolithic and expand and contract equally. Teak has a different coefficient of expansion and this is also variable depending on how the planks were sawn. Hardly surprising, particularly in climates with extremes of temperature such as the Med that caulking fails and plugs come out. You will see many 15-20 year old boats, that if neglected have porcupine decks and seams like tram lines.

I looked recently at two "quality" blue water boats. One 1986 and GRP. Deck was in the last stages of decay and needed stripping off - signs of "refurbishment", but only delaying the inevitable. The other 1994, steel from a really high class yard. Looked fantastic - except - rust stains through the teak around just about every fitting and opening, particularly bad on the foredeck. This was 35mm teak, but had already worn so that screws were just below the surface.

My estimate was £20k to strip it off, weld up the holes and paint - probably lowering th perceived value of the boat or £50k to re-clad in teak - 40% of the asking price!

So the early consequences can be water damage to the interior. If a ply substrate is used, rot of the ply. If a cored deck structure, potential delamination. Steel, corrosion of the plating in addition to the leaks!

Sounds like enough to make one wary of teak decks on older boats. If you must have teak, buy new and sell before the boat is 10 years old!
 
Thanks for that.

However, in a Med climate, is there really that much risk of permanent and damaging leaks? I can understand it if the guy is planning to do a Moitessier and sail non stop round and round the world. With the heat of the Med does not any moisture dry out?

With a steel deck, is the risk of corrosion all that great? surely it must take a considerable time for rust to permeate and penetrate steel to the point of creating leaks? I would have thought that water ingress would be spotted by teak lifting and may be resolved by localised repair.

I am no fan of teak decks but the implicatons of full replacement cost for a 50ft yacht are truely scary. I would be looking for re-instatement of existing teak rather than replacement. I don't mean a bodge but a considered analysis of the extent of damage and best use of remaining material.

The mind boggles at the price of teak and sourcing quality quarter sawn in a foreign country adds a further dimension to the problem.

Anyway, thanks again.
 
Hi all again. Despite all the doom sayers, I am still a fan of teak decks - I just want to get value if I can. Certainly, the cost is exorbitant but was (fully?) discounted into the price I paid. Looking at sister ships which trade at nearly 2x what I paid, I can even see some upside potential (oxymoron when applied to boats?) and I get a brand new deck to my spec.

Buying a newer boat would eliminate some hassle but I would find myself in the position of my vendor of having to accept big discounts to allow for repairs etc. I chose to buy 'cheap' in the full knowledge that I would have to spend €€€€ to fully restore - but I then get a boat specced how I want it for ± the same cost of a newer boat that has a big future repair liability. At least that's the theory! Will keep those interested updated on actual costs/results when & if etc.
 
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Sounds like enough to make one wary of teak decks on older boats. If you must have teak, buy new and sell before the boat is 10 years old!

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Spot on! I was naive enough to buy an older boat with a teak deck - what a disaster. I have applied a Coelan treatment but feel I have only delayed the inevitable. Instead, I should have immediately shaken off the teak deck snobbery and removed the end-of-life material to lay something sensible.

There are plenty of modern, composite and better alternatives but we are brainwashed into believing it is a traditional and quality requirement. However, that is a myth; it was introduced into smaller yacht ranges during the 1970s in emulation of the large, luxury yachts that could better absorb the weight and cost proportions.

A teak deck is ponderously heavy and the weight too high for optimal stability. While the natural finish ensures firm footing when dry or wet, in tropical or sub-tropical climates it becomes burningly hot for bare feet. And it is so horrendously expensive that, for an older boat, replacement can typically cost up to half of the boat's value - a totally ridiculous situation.
 
To fill in the detail on fitting new plugs:
The 8mm countersink bit is indeed to "counterbore" but only by few of mm. If you try using a normal drill bit it will "grab" and plough into the deck. The usual reason for plugs coming out is that they have worn down and are too thin----hence counterboring.
I use normal exterior PVA wood glue as per B&Q seems fine.
I also do the sacrilidge of coating all my teal with Sikkens Cetol. It waterproofs the surface , prevents weathering of the teak. and it wears down rather than the teak. Decks are still OK after27years.(well actually they look a bit tatty at the moment!!)
 
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