Teak decking on flybridge in med

[jfm]

There's two newish ,less than 2 y olds boats side by side near me .
One is a Targa 48 ,t,other a Prinny v48 .
Without naming names one has allready exactly what I describes in a heavey trafficked area on the B platform .
It looks like guardiene has no Passerelle fob and jumps on foot stricking the same place. Dodging the stern springs .
The black caulk has worn away across 2-3 lines., which look like a solid mass of wood now .
So I reckon it's a template of sheet ,routered to say 1/2 way ( guess..?) and back filled with caulking
I,ll try to take some pics next time .,to illustrate this and some corner pieces to check the grain direction of both boats .
It would make a good post .iam ambivalent I like teak and the subject with real life pics of these two and a few others old and new will be a great topic .
It's just that if they were all seperate pieces /strips as you suggest ,then the caulk would run down all the way ,not 1/2 ,and that would wear evenly ok thinner but you would still see the black lines .

So why have the black lines -caulking disappeared on the landing area of the B platform on a del in 2015 boat from one f our big 3 ?

As you wish - I give up and if you want to believe it is laminate or veneer then do so.

The caulk does indeed not go the full depth. You can't* make teak deck sheeting efficiently if the caulking is taken through the full depth. Rebating one edge of each plank to about 2/3rds of the plank's thickness, as Nick H describes in detail above, is the smart way to make these decks and that is what the manufacturers (like Wattsons, kjhowells, Moodys) do, but that does not mean they are laminate or veneer.

*Well you can, if you make all the forward planks straight, rather than curving them into a king plank. Fortunately not too many builders use the cheap trick of keeping the planks straight, and the UK big 3 don't, but Itama are one of the bad guys in this regard: if you spec a teak deck they install awful straight planked foredecks urgh.

 

[CLOUD9]

for me, it's got to be the real thing even if that does mean faffing about removing grease stains.

I do agree. When I viewed my current boat she had been fitted with lookey-likey teak on both the flybridge and side decks. Fair to say it would have been an older incarnation lookey likey, and I know things have improved vastly since 2007 (Im assuming it was fitted when she was new, but don't know for certain). I didn't think it did the boat justice at all. It was a show-stopper and I walked away from the boat. I only walked back when new teak was promised to replace all the plastic. I think the feel of real wood under foot is important, and more than makes up for a bit more effort keeping it looking good.

 

[petem]

+1.

I must add that I remain open minded and would consider lookey-likey if it indeed looked identical to brand new teak, smelt the same, was cooler underfoot, required less maintenance, was stain resistant and was cheaper than the real thing!

 

[jrudge]

This is an interesting thread. I am looking at a boat with knackered teak. Another in the marina has fake teak which looks ( only looks ) OK.

Teak is a pain and I just dont worry about it other than picking up crisps etc as with small kids on board, and messy adults, there is not much more you can do. 2 part makes it look great at the start of the season and its down hill from there. The thought of not having to worry about is is relatively attractive - depending of course on how it performs in real life.

Fake teak has an attraction, but I did not realise it suffered from significant heat issues.That said on my current boat ( ex boat in 5 days) most of the teak you walk on is either under the bimini or flybridge overhang so heat is never really an issue.

How does it compare price wise to real teak replacement ( assuming templates bought from the OEM supplier as opposed to some skilled bloke making it from scratch)?

 

[petem]

Are replacement Teak decks is one of the few things that are cheaper when bought from the original OEM manufacturer? Whenever I've seen quotes from Wattsons, for example, they've always been surprisingly reasonable.

 

[petem]

... ex boat in 5 days ...

Commiserations J, it was a lovely boat.

 

[rafiki_]

Commiserations J, it was a lovely boat.

+1 Jeremy

 

[MapisM]

Fortunately not too many builders use the cheap trick of keeping the planks straight, and the UK big 3 don't, but Itama are one of the bad guys in this regard: if you spec a teak deck they install awful straight planked foredecks urgh.

Hang on a minute J, let's distinguish between sacred and profane.

First of all, glad to stand corrected if anyone can show me the opposite, but afaik NONE of the true Itamas, i.e. those built by Mario Amati (RIP) ever came out of the yard with "cheap tricks" of any kind - let alone sticking useless teak planks above a GRP deck which is inherently a thing of beauty, as white GRP Itama decks are, above their blue hulls.
In a sense, gluing a teak layer above GRP decks is something that I would rather call a cheap trick per se, regardless of the planks shape. in fact, what builders have to do nowadays is just order pre-cut panels to their supplier, designed in whatever shape they think is more fashionable, stick them on decks with some sika, and vacuum the thing.
And in this process, just to answer the OP question, what they actually achieve is:
1) increase the boat weight, cost, and maintenance needs - together with worse functionality vs. bare GRP (much higher temperature under the sun and more slippery when wet). And this is the objective part.
2) make the boat more attractive at boat shows, together with a more pleasant feeling on bare feet, at least when the teak is neither hot nor wet. And this is the subjective part, anyway - though it can well be the more relevant for someone, as this thread proves.
And as always, who am I to argue? Each to their own, in this respect!

Secondly, back to straight vs. curved planks, let me throw in a spot the boat: can you name the builder below, which as the pic shows used "the cheap trick of keeping the planks straight"?
Hint: the hull is triple planked mahogany, and the teak deck planks are 20mm thick.
To my knowledge, the yard is the one and only in the history of boatbuilding to get Lloyd's Formée Cross 100A1 classification for wooden built fast vessels.
If we can call cheap a boat as big as yours and capable of almost 40kts with the same power, which those guys used to build 30+ years ago, well, I struggle to think of anything built in modern days that shouldn't be called cheaper...

 

[Portofino]

Hang on a minute J, let's distinguish between sacred and profane.

First of all, glad to stand corrected if anyone can show me the opposite, but afaik NONE of the true Itamas, i.e. those built by Mario Amati (RIP) ever came out of the yard with "cheap tricks" of any kind - let alone sticking useless teak planks above a GRP deck which is inherently a thing of beauty, as white GRP Itama decks are, above their blue hulls.
In a sense, gluing a teak layer above GRP decks is something that I would rather call a cheap trick per se, regardless of the planks shape. in fact, what builders have to do nowadays is just order pre-cut panels to their supplier, designed in whatever shape they think is more fashionable, stick them on decks with some sika, and vacuum the thing.
And in this process, just to answer the OP question, what they actually achieve is:
1) increase the boat weight, cost, and maintenance needs - together with worse functionality vs. bare GRP (much higher temperature under the sun and more slippery when wet). And this is the objective part.
2) make the boat more attractive at boat shows, together with a more pleasant feeling on bare feet, at least when the teak is neither hot nor wet. And this is the subjective part, anyway - though it can well be the more relevant for someone, as this thread proves.
And as always, who am I to argue? Each to their own, in this respect!

Secondly, back to straight vs. curved planks, let me throw in a spot the boat: can you name the builder below, which as the pic shows used "the cheap trick of keeping the planks straight"?
Hint: the hull is triple planked mahogany, and the teak deck planks are 20mm thick.
To my knowledge, the yard is the one and only in the history of boatbuilding to get Lloyd's Formée Cross 100A1 classification for wooden built fast vessels.
If we can call cheap a boat as big as yours and capable of almost 40kts with the same power, which those guys used to build 30+ years ago, well, I struggle to think of anything built in modern days that shouldn't be called cheaper...

Well said MapishM
I,am a "watcher " type of bloke --- only reporting what I see .
No criticism implied /meant personally .
I just say it as I see it - and not afraid to do so - but happy to talk about it warts n all !
Not too sure how "Itama " ended up in this ? My contribution was to open to Dicussion the what find out -explore for the Op what exactly is "teak" in terms of manufacture /fitting .
So he know s what he's getting ,
For the record my teak is solid (not measured ) 12 or 15 mm thick .
And as MapishM says the "Ferreti " Itamas are also solid and the for deck s an option .
I,am in Piedmont at the mo looking at vinyards with patchy Wifi and we are off to back to Switzerland tomo ,
So it will be a bit longer before I can take a pic of said B platform + others to create a post + then we can discuss teak

Re streaight planks
Don,t care if striaght or curved , just don,t want the caulking to wear out -or wear down to the base wood in less than 2 years from new -having speced it and paid a few bucks for it .
Where do I go from here ?
Renew -?? -boats less than 2 Y !!!!
Just feel sorry for the poor sod that speced teak in one for the remaining I might add "big 3 " UK builders .
Hope the Op does not end up in the same predictament ?

 

[jfm]

Mapism, are you serious? Am I supposed to like that foredeck? It is just about the most horrible foredeck I've ever seen. Look at the hideous stanchion attachments- the ugliest ss work I have seen in many years. What is that ugly raised channel thing that the anchor sits in? And those fender baskets with exposed bolt heads rather than welded construction and the hatch without margin boards. And yes, the straight teak planks are not a fine feature. That really is the worst foredeck I have seen in a long long time. All first world issues of course- it may be otherwise a fine boat.

I don't agree the rest of your post- a plastic superstructure with glued on teak is IMHO better on a ~20m recreational boat than just plastic or a plank-on-beam deck, but each to their own on that I suppose

 

[vas]

very serious first world problems indeed...

to sidetrack you a bit (as I see the handbags getting ready) I have genuine Q: HOW they do the curved teak planks??
This bleeding wood is not the best to work with, cutting it is no joke, fcks up the tools, etc. So how is it bent as I cannot imagine I could get the curvature needed for MiToS foredeck fe, on 40-45mmX10-12mm teak strips.
FWIW, I decided I'll stick to the 2pack white with antislip sand thing on the foredeck and f/b for now and only do the aft deck in teak in spring.

cheers

V.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

very serious first world problems indeed...

Agreed. We are perilously close to a major international diplomatic incident here over the design of some planks of brown wood

 

[Cheery]

This isn't just any brown wood, this is...

 

[MapisM]

Mapism, are you serious? Am I supposed to like that foredeck?

LOL, naah, of course I didn't expect that!

It was just one example of how the ORIGINAL deck of a +100A1 timber boat can look like, after exactly 30 years.
Regardless of whether we like it or not aesthetically, don't you think it's remarkable, and defies the "straight planks=cheap trick" sweeping generalization?

Ref your other comments on that Akhir foredeck, I don't want to start a thread drift that could last forever, but each and every features were rigorously based on the "form follows function" principle, as opposed to most components in modern boat design: solid straight planks are better for structural integrity, the "ugliest ss work" actually isn't ss at all, because it's made of a special alu alloy (believe it or not, more expensive than ss), and so forth.
Besides, BartW could tell us what happens over time, with stanchions attached above the top of a boxed wooden gunwale - a solution which is otherwise undeniably better, from an aesthetic viewpoint.
In fact, it's no coincidence that before indulging to ss on top of gunwales, also Canados used exactly the same system as CdP above, back in their wooden-only days.

I don't agree the rest of your post- a plastic superstructure with glued on teak is IMHO better on a ~20m recreational boat than just plastic or a plank-on-beam deck, but each to their own on that I suppose

Yup, precisely as I said! :encouragement:

 

[MapisM]

I have genuine Q: HOW they do the curved teak planks??

They just don't, V.
Builders nowadays send to Bellotti (or other similar suppliers) the cad file with the panels they need, shaped as they like, and when they receive the panels (not the single planks!) back, they just glue the things in place.

Not that it's impossible to curve a solid 20mm thick teak plank meant to be used for structural wooden construction, but aside from taking a lot of time and skills, it's pointless, because makes it harder to build a perfectly matching and longlasting deck.
In the 80s (and earlier), builders like Cantieri di Pisa neither lacked the skills nor the availability of clients with a money no object approach. But as I said, they used to stick as much as possible to the form follows function principle: dedicating a huge amount of time in shaping mahogany for building triple planked hulls made sense, while curving teak planks to build a king plank shaped deck didn't.

PS: Just to give a better idea in case you might be interested, I found this photo on the website of one of the builders suppliers, which gives a nice idea of the pre-cut panels I was talking about...

 

[jfm]

Erk, I wasn't seeking to create an international incident! The "cheap trick" comment was a return of the ball served by Portfino when he wrote "mucky trick" a few posts above, but no matter.

MapisM we can disagree on the metal work on that CdiP foredeck but I agree the teak is in fine condition, and if it's 30yo then it will have been very fine wood - Burmese I guess. It might have been recaulked and sanded of course - I don't know.

You mentioned above "structural" in relation to teak deck planks - I think but don't know for sure that the pictured CdiP teak is trim/decoration, not structural. I think they made their decks in ply and glued the teak on afterwards, which is perfectly fine of course, no problem at all with that.

 

[Portofino]

"Mucky trick " is when they use a router on a single sheet to cut the edging /borders , to make it look like some craftsman has measured,cut and fitted it .
You can tell because the grain is all the same way .
So in a sq - hatch lid -eg- two sides will have the grain oppersite at right angles to the length .
Some builders actually -edge -border it with the grain running the L -it may be a sheet in the middle or Veneer or pre-cut with caulk slot what ever ?
But at least the grain runs L ways pararel to the caulking , in all -apparent pieces

 

[Bouba]

Hang on a minute J, let's distinguish between sacred and profane.

First of all, glad to stand corrected if anyone can show me the opposite, but afaik NONE of the true Itamas, i.e. those built by Mario Amati (RIP) ever came out of the yard with "cheap tricks" of any kind - let alone sticking useless teak planks above a GRP deck which is inherently a thing of beauty, as white GRP Itama decks are, above their blue hulls.
In a sense, gluing a teak layer above GRP decks is something that I would rather call a cheap trick per se, regardless of the planks shape. in fact, what builders have to do nowadays is just order pre-cut panels to their supplier, designed in whatever shape they think is more fashionable, stick them on decks with some sika, and vacuum the thing.
And in this process, just to answer the OP question, what they actually achieve is:
1) increase the boat weight, cost, and maintenance needs - together with worse functionality vs. bare GRP (much higher temperature under the sun and more slippery when wet). And this is the objective part.
2) make the boat more attractive at boat shows, together with a more pleasant feeling on bare feet, at least when the teak is neither hot nor wet. And this is the subjective part, anyway - though it can well be the more relevant for someone, as this thread proves.
And as always, who am I to argue? Each to their own, in this respect!

Secondly, back to straight vs. curved planks, let me throw in a spot the boat: can you name the builder below, which as the pic shows used "the cheap trick of keeping the planks straight"?
Hint: the hull is triple planked mahogany, and the teak deck planks are 20mm thick.
To my knowledge, the yard is the one and only in the history of boatbuilding to get Lloyd's Formée Cross 100A1 classification for wooden built fast vessels.
If we can call cheap a boat as big as yours and capable of almost 40kts with the same power, which those guys used to build 30+ years ago, well, I struggle to think of anything built in modern days that shouldn't be called cheaper...

I like it.
It looks like the working end of a proper boat. Not a place to top up your tan or pretend you are Leonardo D'Cappuccino.
Mind you I also like the interlaced teak look

 

[MapisM]

Erk, I wasn't seeking to create an international incident!
The "cheap trick" comment...

Haha, no worries, no int'l incident at all. As I said, actually I kinda agree on the term "cheap trick" - it's just that I'd use it for ALL modern grp deck covered with teak, regardless of its shape...

Ref structural vs decorative on the Akhir, according to a guy who used to build them, up to when they switched to moulded superstructures, teak planks were indeed designed as structural components - which was one of the reasons for using 20mm thick (yes, Burmese of course, and rigorously striped, not flamed!) teak planks.
Actually, I suppose that the solid wood beams underneath, which were indeed covered with ply panels before the final layer ot teak planks, would have been more than good enough to walk safely on the deck.
But the teak planks were meant to be concurrent to the overall structural deck strength anyway.
And it feels - walking on that deck is akin to walking on a pavement!

But back to the point of this thread, coming to think of it, there's another thing that someone might be interested to consider.
Below is one example of a teak trimmed GRP deck which (I suppose) you might like better than the wooden Akhir one, aesthetically.
The boat is 11 years old, and the deck was covered with pre-cut panels of solid 6mm teak.
Now, it's difficult to tell from the pic, but the thing is already worn out enough to need a replacement very soon.
For scraping and replacing the thing, the quotation from the same folks who built the boat is 30k Eur.
So, as a matter of fact, after someone forked out 15 to 20k Eur more for the teak trim when he specced the boat, if he wants to sell her, he must now be prepared to get 30k Eur LESS than anyone else who didn't.
And that's leaving aside personal preferences: fwiw, if this Mr. someone finds a buyer like myself, I'm actually happy to spend 20k MORE for a boat which was never covered with teak, because it's almost impossible to remove it and re-create a proper GRP non-skid deck, once it has been covered with teak. But that's me, of course...

 

[MapisM]

It looks like the working end of a proper boat.

You can say that again. And you should see the rest... :encouragement: