TARGA (37)38 opinions please

Melida

Melida

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TARGA 38 - 40 opinions please

Hi all.

I'm currently (since 2,5 years) owning a Searay 315DA powered with single VP KAD300.
The cockpit and cabin layout, single diesel engine and a few other goodies sold us to this boat.

But it's time to upsize and wife wants the same cockpit layout which only Targas have, L shaped port lounger and just back of it U shaped seating.

I was leaning towards to 32-34ft Searays with twin D4-260 diesels. But T(37)38 seems more attractive and I'm only looking for it.

Searched the forums but couln't find satisfactory info about them.

I'm looking forward to hear from the owners and mechs who have and servicing about what's to check first while surveying, strengths and weaknesses, pros and cons and consumption.

Also would like to know wich power package is the best match, KAD44s, KAD300s, D4-260s, D6-310s ? We always curise a bit heavy with full diesel, full water and min 2+1 people on board. When tanks are full and 5-6 adults onboard and weather gets worse would KAD44s or D4-260s have plenty power to get on plane? At this situation having stern drive engines is disadvantage since the engines are at the aftest point of hull and props are further back of transom.
Any opinions and recommendations are higly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
 
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The Fairline 37 Targa, and newer since 2005 producted 38 Targa are different boats.
This last is wider. The 37 was produced from 1995 till 2000. The first year she was named as 36 with shorter bathing platform.
The older 37 Targa has the deeper of what i know is B.Olsenski hulls with a 20 degrees deadrise aft. The newer 38 has 18 degrees aft, standard recent Olsenski hull medium vee deadrise aft.
Finishing is much better quality in the newer 38, you can see in stainless steel teak etc, better layout of cockpit too. With a large wetbar and fridge.
All teak in old 37 is laminted stuff.
Those Ice chest with cooling motor are trouble items here in the med, and the wasbasin is a joke IMO. Going to the fore deck from the cockpit is also a bit of acrobatic excerise.
If you are looking for the still in prod 38 Targa which with the engines you mention I think you are I would go for a D4-300hp or a D6-310 choice.
I love the new 38 Targa model and is very nice indeed. But I would also have a look at 40 Targa, yes not the cockpit layout you like, but giving a look never harm.
A Princess V40 should also be in your book.
 
PowerYachtBlog said:
The Fairline 37 Targa, and newer since 2005 producted 38 Targa are different boats.
This last is wider. The 37 was produced from 1995 till 2000. The first year she was named as 36 with shorter bathing platform.
The older 37 Targa has the deeper of what i know is B.Olsenski hulls with a 20 degrees deadrise aft. The newer 38 has 18 degrees aft, standard recent Olsenski hull medium vee deadrise aft.
Finishing is much better quality in the newer 38, you can see in stainless steel teak etc, better layout of cockpit too. With a large wetbar and fridge.
All teak in old 37 is laminted stuff.
Those Ice chest with cooling motor are trouble items here in the med, and the wasbasin is a joke IMO. Going to the fore deck from the cockpit is also a bit of acrobatic excerise.
If you are looking for the still in prod 38 Targa which with the engines you mention I think you are I would go for a D4-300hp or a D6-310 choice.
I love the new 38 Targa model and is very nice indeed. But I would also have a look at 40 Targa, yes not the cockpit layout you like, but giving a look never harm.
A Princess V40 should also be in your book.
Click to expand...


Thanks for your reply.

I’m thinking to buy 38 if by wallet permits, if no 37.

I know that, deeper deadrise is better in bad weather. My current boat and (the bigger’s of it) has 21 degrees deadrise at transom. Does the difference between in 18 and 21 degrees makes too much between 9,5m and 12,5m length of boats ?

Googled pics of lots of Targas and saw the interior difference of 37 and 38 as you mentioned, and then decided to buy 38.

In my area there are lots of D4-260s and a few D6-310s. My first choice is D6s.

I looked several ads all over the world and saw that generator is lack of in 38s. Is it optional or standart? Having two air conditioners standart and generator is not is a bit weird.

One other thing is bow thruster is not fitted in every 38. In my current boat I have it (9,47m LOA) and it is a must, at least I’m in a cement pier marina.

Twin stern drives would give enough control in a F4-5 weather and current without having bow thruster?

I have a dock neighbor who has T40, beautiful boat with twin D6s. But the price increases too much from 38 to 40 and V40 is a totally different category and of course higher price.

The last one I'd like to know is the total consumption. Assuming the bottom and props always clean(I regularly dive in winter and every weekend in summer) can I get at cruise total 50 LPH ?

Best regards.
Melida
 
Melida, there will be others along to comment on the engines. My boat is 33ft twin sterndrives (mercruiser diesels) and bowthruster. The bowthruster really comes into its own in cross winds, where the boat pivots around the sterndrives. The thruster just takes the sweat out of mooring, and I personally would not have a boat without one. I know others on here will disagree, but I am talking from my own experience. In some marina's there just is not the room always to get things right first time with the engines only, and I really do not want to clout either my own, or someone else's pride and joy.
 
Is not really a fact that deadrise is better bad weather boat. A better dead rise but give the following advantages
1) make better tracking if you jump on the waves
2) in following seas
When boats become 9 meter plus a hull even if medium dead rise can be very good sea boats. Some super sea boats have very flat aft sections and can handle a sea very well.
Think of Hatteras, they are very good sea boats especially with head seas. Saying all this, 2 degrees between an 18 and 20 want make much big difference. And having helmed the two I think the 38 Targa is actually a better sea boat then the 37. But this last has actually more speed boat type handling.

I still think with D6 310 you will be better off, more torque engine. With D6 260 but comsunption is less and with cruise at around 23/24 knots u migt manage 50lph.
Fairline says it does 33 knots with D4 260, if it does that speed or close (32 knots) then it is ok.
Both bow thruster (I think needed a lot in this size and stern drives), and generator can be fitted later on. The last, do you sleep a lot an anchor for long periods. Then also it is a must. You can follow Fairlines instructions here.

I am surprised as a few weeks ago I was looking to some brokerage quotes and the modern 38 Targa, was more expensive then a 40 T and V42 Mk.II. Especially if powered by D6. If you buy V42 Mk.III the new one with hard top yes that will be more expensive for sure ;)
For cunsumption at 2800 rpm the D6 260 consumes about 27 lph per engine, so you could be quite close at the speed I quoted above or 50 lph target.
 
rafiki_ said:
Melida, there will be others along to comment on the engines. My boat is 33ft twin sterndrives (mercruiser diesels) and bowthruster. The bowthruster really comes into its own in cross winds, where the boat pivots around the sterndrives. The thruster just takes the sweat out of mooring, and I personally would not have a boat without one. I know others on here will disagree, but I am talking from my own experience. In some marina's there just is not the room always to get things right first time with the engines only, and I really do not want to clout either my own, or someone else's pride and joy.
Click to expand...

Rafiki,
Thanks for your reply.
My father have(and had) shaft driven boats 12m-16m and last is 14m. Even in bad weather conditions they don't need bow thruster, just transmissions and sometimes a little throttle handles the boat like parking a car, however shafts react slower then stern drives.
So bow thruster is a must for stern drive boat 12m lenght, at least to feel comfy my self.
My summer marina is suffering from strong NW winds and have cement piers. We have dedicated berths for our boats and there is no room. In winter we are docking backwards and going astern with stern drives looses the control of bow, so bow thurster corrects the bow.
Also, as you mentioned having lots of half million $ € Searays, Cranchi, Fairline, Azimuth, Absolute and other famous brand boats around requires bow thruster.
Best regards.
Melida
 
PowerYachtBlog said:
Is not really a fact that deadrise is better bad weather boat. A better dead rise but give the following advantages
1) make better tracking if you jump on the waves
2) in following seas
When boats become 9 meter plus a hull even if medium dead rise can be very good sea boats. Some super sea boats have very flat aft sections and can handle a sea very well.
Think of Hatteras, they are very good sea boats especially with head seas. Saying all this, 2 degrees between an 18 and 20 want make much big difference. And having helmed the two I think the 38 Targa is actually a better sea boat then the 37. But this last has actually more speed boat type handling.

I still think with D6 310 you will be better off, more torque engine. With D6 260 but comsunption is less and with cruise at around 23/24 knots u migt manage 50lph.
Fairline says it does 33 knots with D4 260, if it does that speed or close (32 knots) then it is ok.
Both bow thruster (I think needed a lot in this size and stern drives), and generator can be fitted later on. The last, do you sleep a lot an anchor for long periods. Then also it is a must. You can follow Fairlines instructions here.

I am surprised as a few weeks ago I was looking to some brokerage quotes and the modern 38 Targa, was more expensive then a 40 T and V42 Mk.II. Especially if powered by D6. If you buy V42 Mk.III the new one with hard top yes that will be more expensive for sure ;)
For cunsumption at 2800 rpm the D6 260 consumes about 27 lph per engine, so you could be quite close at the speed I quoted above or 50 lph target.
Click to expand...

PYB,

Thanks again for your detailed reply.

It’s good to know that 18-21 degrees don’t make much difference. I lower my drive when in a head sea or passing through a wave of a big boat/ship to benefiting the sharp bow section.

I’ve neither been on a 12m stern drive boat nor on a T38, that size boats around me is always have (had) V-drives. I love the speed and economy of stern drives. Also I have boats with Volvo Penta powered since 5 years and loved them to. Having stern drive makes the aft cabin bigger and smaller fuel tanks due to economy and makes less heavy the boat.

My biggest concern is if I couldn’t find a D6-310 powered T38 D4-260s would be enough power when heavy and bad weather.

I heard that D4s give 24-25 kt cruise and 50LPH and D6s give 27-28kt cruise and 65LPH in best conditions of bottom/gear. I’m expecting to cruise at 25kt at plane. The added weight of D6s, more engine oil because of 2 x 3,6 L - 2 x 5,5L, extra consumption and higher boat value would amortize itself in bad conditions as I’m concerning. So I’m leaning towards to D6s.

In my current boat I have all factory offered extra options and other goodies offered on bigger brothers of mine except generator. The only need of genny occurs in summer on long cruises while my wife and daughter sleeps/stays at cabin to run the air conditioner. I always stay at marinas when I’m away from home port. I have 1500watt sine wave inverter and except air conditioner I can run everything with it.

Another and very important thing I found is T38 and other Targas don’t have galvanic isolator, or it isn’t declared in the info page on Fairline. My previous boat had D4-210-DPH and didn’t have galvanic isolator. The stern drive zinc was disappearing in 3-4 months. Due to lack of it I had to chance props, they were pitted like someone extinguished lots of cigarettes on it.

Also want to know where can I find users manual, part manual, electrical scheme and cabin and engine room layout of T38, couldn’t see on Fairline site. And ofcourse what are the strandart and extra options.

Thanks again.
Best regards.
Melida
 
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As Powe Yacht Blog recommended T40, I enlarged my searched and looked over to Targa 40s.
Saw that even the same year model of 38 and 40 even all T40s have D6-310s and a few D6-350s with generator and pasarelle with same engine hours are cheaper than T38s.
Why ?
Is there some drawbacks about the hull or undepowered engines?
It is weird that more powerful and loaded T40 is €30-40K cheaper than T38 with D4-260s, without generator.
Buying T40 seems more logical than T38 in this situtation.
Can someone enlighten the difference please ?
 
Older model produced since 2000 and stopped in 07.
In my opinion the cockpit does not work and is not as nice as a 38 Targa. But some here may differ.
But on real facts the T40 used to sell better then the 38 until it was stopped in production. Hull performance, and sea handling is better in the 40 Targa.
 
PowerYachtBlog said:
Older model produced since 2000 and stopped in 07.
In my opinion the cockpit does not work and is not as nice as a 38 Targa. But some here may differ.
But on real facts the T40 used to sell better then the 38 until it was stopped in production. Hull performance, and sea handling is better in the 40 Targa.
Click to expand...

Great thanks for the input.
I was thinking the same about cockpit that how almost same lenght boat just canceling half of swim platform gives the same cockpit layout with L shaped lounger and U shaped aft seating. I guess it is cramped than T38.
Don't know exact dimension and wieght differences between 38 and 40, but having the extra volume, cylinders, valves, hp and torque of D6s should perform better than a 38 with D4s.
I'm gonna see a few 38s and 40 then decide which suits to my needs.
One other thing grabed my attention is, doen't the Targas have holding tank for wc? couldn't see in any pic of engine room. Is it option or put in a bank of aft berths ?
 
Holding tank I think is an option on the T38, and if fitted, is under the fwd most aft berth - battery bank is under the aft most one.

Generator is an option, sits nicely on the area just forward of the engines, with the metal framework for the step sitting just over the top of it.

As for performance, based on a brand new boat & therefore with clean hull and drives, no personal equipment etc and a couple of crew onboard...

D4-260’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 24 knots, burning approx. 64 litres per hour between them
D4-260’s at 3000 RPM gives roughly 26/27 knots, burning approx. 71 litres per hour between them

D4-300’s, at 2600 RPM gives roughly 24/25 knots, burning approx. 65 litres per hour between them
D4-300’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 27 knots, burning approx. 71 litres per hour between them

D6-370’s, at 2400 RPM gives roughly 23 knots, burning approx. 67 litres per hour between them
D6-370’s, at 2600 RPM gives roughly 26 knots, burning approx. 75 litres per hour between them
D6-370’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 30 knots, burning approx. 84 litres per hour between them

Andy
 
Andyroonot said:
Holding tank I think is an option on the T38, and if fitted, is under the fwd most aft berth - battery bank is under the aft most one.

Generator is an option, sits nicely on the area just forward of the engines, with the metal framework for the step sitting just over the top of it.

As for performance, based on a brand new boat & therefore with clean hull and drives, no personal equipment etc and a couple of crew onboard...

D4-260’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 24 knots, burning approx. 64 litres per hour between them
D4-260’s at 3000 RPM gives roughly 26/27 knots, burning approx. 71 litres per hour between them

D4-300’s, at 2600 RPM gives roughly 24/25 knots, burning approx. 65 litres per hour between them
D4-300’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 27 knots, burning approx. 71 litres per hour between them

D6-370’s, at 2400 RPM gives roughly 23 knots, burning approx. 67 litres per hour between them
D6-370’s, at 2600 RPM gives roughly 26 knots, burning approx. 75 litres per hour between them
D6-370’s, at 2800 RPM gives roughly 30 knots, burning approx. 84 litres per hour between them

Andy
Click to expand...

Andy,
It is very interesting that in this size and kind of luxury boat holding tank is an extra option.
Great thanks for the numerical data.
Best regards.
Melida
 
Gonna look to a Targa 40. It's 2002 and have Kad44s.
What performance should I expect from that engines?
Are they enough to get on plane when loaded?
Is 3000rpm should be the sweet spot or have to run always near 3500rpm?
Also curious about the consumption.
Best regards.
Melida
 
jimmy_the_builder said:
Bit of a discussion about T40 performance in this thread:

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=190866

A friend of mine used to have an early T40 with kad44's, and it was never a particularly quick boat. However, the boats themselves are excellent, and unlike PYB I find that the cockpit works very well. Of course, it wasn't designed in Italy... :D

Cheers
Jimmy
Click to expand...

Jimmy,
Thanks for your quick response.
I was thinking also T38 with 260hp engines should be underpowered in bad weather and loaded, so T40 must have KAD300s or D6s.
The boat I mentioned is always used by 2 adults and 2 children and dinghy in the garage. So that load is not affects KAD44s imo.
I liked both 38 and 40. Prefer 38 for bigger seating, but 40 is more boat with less price.
I'm gonna test the boat I've mentioned to have an idea of what KAD44s are doing in it.
Best regards.
Melida
 
PowerYachtBlog said:
You should get 30/31 knots loaded with a T40 with K44s 260hp engines, 32 with an empty boat.
Definitly the T40 (one of Fairlines best), has a better seakeeping hull then a T38.
The T40 runs super with the D6s....
Click to expand...

Thanks PYB.
Does this numbers are cruise or wot ?
I searched the ads in yachtworld and T40 with KAD44s listed 28knots cruise, 36knots wot. Could be real ?
My first choice is T40. It has more options than 38 which attracts me, such as pasarelle and boat garage.Also the price.
In my country there is only 1 T40 for sale which have 44s. Looking abroad like Croatia, Spain and Italy with D6s.
Best regards.
Melida
 
They are WOT. 25 cruise at 3300, and more economic 22 at 3100.
36 knots Max not possible in the Med.
I was looking one in Italy a couple years ago with 44s, 500 hour boat and that is what she did. 31.5 knots. 3/4 diesels, full water and full crew tender with outboard,and some peronsal items.
 
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