TAMD41A and MS4 Gear Box - Engine Mount Swap

[bowler]

Hello again,

Having made some progress on my rpm issue I am ready to move on to my last piece of pre season maintenance/upkeep (not including filters).

I am going to replace my engine mounts on my SB engine. It has a rock at idle and moves forward about an 1/3 of an inch when in when in gear at low rpm. I can also see some play in the mounts which the other engine does not demonstrate. They look like they may have been replaced at some point. Oddly enough, according to my feeler gauges the alignment is ok on this engine but never the less they have to go. The vibration is giving me some shaft seal drips but the shaft is centred in the log at rest. I have ordered R&D mountings based on some internet research for other TAMD41s with the ms4 gear box, part numbers 800-004 and 800-005. I plan to do one corner at a time, jack it up, swap them out and move on. After disconnecting the shaft coupling of course. Then realignment and hey presto. Then check alignment after a few hrs as well?

The top bolts were pretty tough to move but I have managed to get them turning after a good bit of pen fluid and brute force. Haven't had luck with the back two but haven't tried in anger yet.

Sounds too easy, although shifting the nuts is a different story.

Am I missing anything? What about bolts for the bearers - anything in particular beyond stainless?

Thanks in advance,

D.

 

[Mr Googler]

When I did the same with my 61a’s, I jacked up on the opposite mount a bit (to take the weight off) then removed the engine mount bracket. Saved me having to jack that high to get the old mount out and gave better access to the mount nuts. They were a proper pain....every single one!

Could you have found your 200 rpm? Bit of shaft binding?

Good luck with it :encouragement:

 

[bowler]

Ha! Fraid not - this is the other engine!

So you took the bracket off rather than the mount off?

D

 

[Mr Googler]

Undid the top nut on the mount.....lifted the engine to take the load off the mount.....undid the engine bracket.

If I hadn’t removed the bracket, I’d have had to lift the engine quite a bit higher to get the clearance to remove the mount.

Can’t imagine either way is wrong...I just found it easier.

 

[rosssavage]

Exactly the same for my TAMD61 ‘s as well - removed the bracket with mount attached.

Used blocks of wood, beam and bottle jack to lift one end of the engine only a few mm, removed whole assembly - much easier than trying to lift 600kg of engine a full 6”

 

[bowler]

Good food for thought. Will have a closer look this weekend.

Cheers gents.

D.

 

[bowler]

Hello all,

It looks like if I can get it lifted by an inch or two the mounts should slip out. I also read on the ASAP website that there is a minimal distance between the holding nut and top of the mount.

"Clearance between the underside of the height adjusting nut and the top washer of the mounting should not be more than 9mm (0.375")"

Based on where it is currently sitting I think I will need a spacer for under the mounts. A third of an inch is not much and is certainly less then where is sits on the current mounts.

Any tips on where and how to jack this pig up? Don't fancy putting a bottle jack through the floor or the oil pan. I am think a large board on the floor to spread weight but where on the engine itself?

Cheers in advance.

D

 

[bowler]

Update for anyone interested.

Talk about a siege!

I made a gantry out of breeze blocks, HEAVY angle iron and a 2T ratchet strap. Used it to lift the rear of the engine using the lifting ring to take the weight to then remove the engine mount bracket using an impact gun. Also, the mounting top nut one of the aft mounts was serious rusty. So much so the gun broke the stud. 2 weeks of pen fluid did nothing.

Removed that only to discover that the mounts I ordered a fraction too short... :mad-new:

Another issue was the disconnection of the shaft coupling. I have an R&D flexible coupling and had to use heat to get the 4 bolts at the prop flange disconnected. They were tough. Prop shaft would not slide back so I had limited wiggle room (a few mm) and lifting the engine even by 1 inch was out of the question so the bracket off option was the ticket.

Should probably replace the bolts on the flexible coupling after using the torch (nuts will be replaced) but that just isn't going to happen, nuts at the gear box end are not shifting and I don't fancy getting into that any deeper. If they break they break.

Take two this weekend. Jeeeezus...

D.

N.B for anyone changing mounts on a Fairline Corniche with TAMD41 the correct mounts are R&D 800-011 and 800-012!

 

[Mr Googler]

I was wondering how it was going.

Sounds like you’ve broken the back of it :encouragement:

 

[bowler]

I was wondering how it was going.

Sounds like you’ve broken the back of it :encouragement:

My back might disagree

Looking forward to getting them in finally. This job has been on the list for a while!

Quick question - did you have any bother sliding the shaft back?

D

 

[oldgit]

Shaft should be easy to move back if by hand if you rotate it at the same time.
If boat out of water good time to dig out all old packing from stern gland.
Could be years of compacted stuff in there.
This is my coupling on a 41B and MS4 set up, could push back until shaft couping hit stern gland bolts.
Dimensions added by hand were to get pin hole in correct spot when replacement shaft was made up.
Note corrosion on shaft, this was also present inside stern gland.
The stern gland is supposed to drip,many seem to think that about 1 drip per 60 secs is about right.
My boat came complete with a box of preshaped predrilled oblong 4" x 5" stainless steel "shims" which you could use to raise the mounts above engine bearers.
At some point in the dim and distant past the prop had hit something, all holes in the flexible joint were elongated.Bolts however were very easy to remove, did help to have a rather long bar turning the socket.

New flexible joimt from Lancing Marine about £100 plus P&P.

 

[gery w]

Nightmare of a job on the corniche access in that area is poor, I had the same fight last year.

 

[Mr Googler]

My back might disagree

Looking forward to getting them in finally. This job has been on the list for a while!

Quick question - did you have any bother sliding the shaft back?

D

In a word.....no. Both shafts slid back whilst twisting them left and right a bit.

3 years previously mine had new cutlass bearings and the stern gland repacked so that helps no doubt.

 

[bowler]

Thanks for the replies folks. To be honest I never even thought about twisting plus as gery notes the access is poooooor. Also, I was in something of a rage at the time and not thinkin too clearly.

Oldgit, I managed to change the shaft packing last summer while it was in the water. The packing was stuffed and leaking badly. I am sure the dodgy mounts were not helping.

It is getting finished this weekend one way or another. Looking forward to contorting myself in the bilge to tighten up the nuts holding the mounts on the bearers. Not.

Cheers!

 

[oldgit]

sure you have done this but check the oil levels in gearbox.Ideally sparkly and clear.
Generic oil available from motorfactor .Used in lots of other applications.
When you move shaft back nip outside and check any newly exposed shaft outside stuffing box and cutlass.
I found this.


Horizontal corrosion occured inside cutlass rubber sleeve and stuffing box
Boat was probably lying idle for ages (years) without shaft turning.

 

[bowler]

Jeeez. They are rough.

Boat in in the water so not sure i will be able to get a visual on them. I bet the new shafts were not cheap...

Gear oil was crystal clear when i last checked which was around 15 hrs ago. I had bought synthetic gear oil to change but the sb exhaust hose runs over the fill point so just haven't got round to it yet. I found a bottle of semi syth in the locker so i assume that is whats in there at the mo. It is on the to do list though. Once these mounts are out of the way that will be next (plus finding my missing 200rpm)! And heat exchangers due to sb running a bit hot.

Ah the beauty of old boats...

 

[oldgit]

something tells me it should be fully synthetic. ????????.
Shaft cost really does depend on where you buy it.Several long established companies around who know what there are doing but will charge you accordingly.All charge similar prices.
Usually a delay of couple weeks if they are busy and can be bit of a pain/expensive getting your old shaft to them.
They are very reluctant to machine new shaft without sight of old one.
With good reason

We found a local machine shop who did the whole thing in a couple days.
Labour charges considerably less and saved on courier costs.

 

[bowler]

something tells me it should be fully synthetic. ????????.

Indeed. I have fully syn to go in but i think there is semi in there at the moment (based on jar found on board after purchase).

Need to change the oil in the motors as well. And the oil in the cars. And the baby boat...

It never ends!

 

[Andromeda9866]

Just looking at the images of the shaft and coupling can any one point in the direction of how to remove the coupling from the shaft as I have. P330 and need to remove the coupling to remove shaft as one of the bolts has broke off in the stern gland and I need to remove the hole thing to get it drilled out can not see how to get the spring pins out of the coupling.
Only option at the moment seems to be cut the shaft to get the coupling of then have a new shaft made
Any ideas ?

 

[oldgit]

Just looking at the images of the shaft and coupling can any one point in the direction of how to remove the coupling from the shaft as I have. P330 and need to remove the coupling to remove shaft as one of the bolts has broke off in the stern gland and I need to remove the hole thing to get it drilled out can not see how to get the spring pins out of the coupling.
Only option at the moment seems to be cut the shaft to get the coupling of then have a new shaft made
Any ideas ?

the pins are knocked out using a drift.
In theory you are supposed to knock out the smaller inner pin before the larger outer one.
You can buy a proper drift set but made my own.
Sourced 2 bits of steel rod same diameter as pins., "actually 2 x old heavy duty screwdriver shafts ".
Cut to suitable length and reduced end of rod-drifts to fit inside each roll pin.
This is to ensure drift does not move or burr over top of pin making it more difficult to remove. when hammer is bought in to action.

Roll pin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_pin
Block of wood under clamp and applied heat from hot air gun.(no idea if this did any good.)
The hex bolts in shaft clamp will be done up very tight indeed.
I used prop to turn shaft and ease out of clamp.
One pin was a piece of cake the other was a little reluctant. Pins proved to be 1/2 " O/D imperial.
As regards to the broken stern gland stud if you can get a pair of mole grips on, it might come out with a little heat, the casting is bronze.
Might save a great deal of time and trouble.