swaging tool

dylanwinter

dylanwinter

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 Mar 2005
Messages
12,954
Location
Buckingham
www.keepturningleft.co.uk
I need to replace my standing rigging

I can take the sidestays to Pinbar and Bax at Northampton to get them made up

I can also get one end put in the forestay up there

but I need to wait to get the bottom end put in because I really want to thread it through the roller reefing rather than completely dismantling it

and the roller reefing is too long to put on the car

is there anyone near me at Buckingham who has a swaging tool I could borrow


the images of the rigging are here

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/blogs/standing-rigging-replacement/

I think it is 4mm wire

Dylan

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/SANY0027.jpg

http://www.keepturningleft.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/SANY0033.jpg
 
dylanwinter said:
I wonder if Pinbar and Bax could supply me with one for the end of the forestay

is it easy to make a cock up of putting one on

Dylan
Click to expand...

I have used one without much difficulty the wire needs to have a good cut end if the wire is raggy then hard to fit . Once fitted and tightened up fully . if you ever need to take off your supposed to use a new cone before you put back on .
 
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Hi Dylan
Sent you a private message about Terminals. Two types of good quality self fit terminals, Sta Lok and Norseman, I think there are others but in the Marine trade we use both of the above. 1 x 19 4mm wire is correct and as has been mentioned the self fit fittings are easy to fit and also can be checked when on to make sure they are nicely formed.
 
Have used Sta-Loks with great success on two sets of full standing rigging. ZSpars believe in them also (last quote included all Sta-Lok ends as opposed to swagged ones).

Somewhere on the web is an american mag destruction test with Sta-Loks and Norseman tested against swagged ends and it would appear they are stronger.

PT
 
Quickest way to get the job done...

1) Take it all off.
2) Package it up.
3) Send to S3i saying...copy please, apart from one Norseman terminal to be supplied unfitted
4) 2 days later get it all back, poke wire through RR, spanner it tight.
5) Job done. No faffing borrowing swaging kit or running around the place.

I think you need less faff in your life. I am happy to advise.
 
Why are you changing the rigging? Is it actually damaged, or because someone told you it only lasts 10 years (or whatever)? I ask because my rigging probably dates from 1973, which makes it 39 years old & it still holds the mast up. People on here have told that me I am "dicing with death & it will fall down next season" for the last 5 years or so since I first mentioned it.

Look carefully for any damage or staining, especially at the terminals, but unless seriously racing, I would not bother changing just for an arbitary time limit.
 
Searush said:
Why are you changing the rigging? Is it actually damaged, or because someone told you it only lasts 10 years (or whatever)? I ask because my rigging probably dates from 1973, which makes it 39 years old & it still holds the mast up. People on here have told that me I am "dicing with death & it will fall down next season" for the last 5 years or so since I first mentioned it.
Click to expand...

Your trust in old stainless steel that spends its life in a marine environment is quaint, but one day it will catch you out.

attachment.php


I've had 3 stainless fittings failures in 3 years, the bolt the most recent. It all looks lovely and shiny on the outside, but inside, invisible cracks grow. The strength of a brand new M10 A4-170 seems a lot, but slowly slowly the crack works its way across, until you hit that wave or a gust loads the rigging just a bit more than normal, and the pistol like crack as it lets go is the first you know about it.

If you take other people sailing on your boat you have a duty of care to keep it maintained. 39 year old rigging is neglecting that duty. I know that you will come out with your standard answers that it looks fine, it hasn't failed in 5 years, I have a stressed high performance boat, but if you can't afford to replace 39 year old rigging, maybe you can't afford to go sailing at all.

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214378
 
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Searush said:
Why are you changing the rigging? Is it actually damaged, or because someone told you it only lasts 10 years (or whatever)? I ask because my rigging probably dates from 1973, which makes it 39 years old & it still holds the mast up. People on here have told that me I am "dicing with death & it will fall down next season" for the last 5 years or so since I first mentioned it.

Look carefully for any damage or staining, especially at the terminals, but unless seriously racing, I would not bother changing just for an arbitary time limit.
Click to expand...

Yawn!
 
Why do you need a ring on the bottom of your forestay, it looks like it ends in a bottle screw? It also looks like a Plastimo furler. If it is then (certainly on mine) you can take out the plastic pieces that hold the forestay in the centre. They are split so they can be put around the forestay without having to pass fittings through them. They are not held in by anything hidden, they can be just poked out when you remove the top cap and the chainplate.
I got my rigging made up by Jimmy Green. After investigating Norseman etc I discovered that it was cheaper to have professional swages done than it was to buy replacement ferrules and apparently they can only be used once! I also think my shrouds look much neater now they just screw straight into the bottle screws and the horrible talurit eyes that were there before have gone.

Edit. Just looked closer at the photo and see that the top cap is riveted onto your furler, mine is screwed on. You would have to drill the rivet out if you wanted to remove the split plastic piece. I think Plastimo call the plastic piece the "bearing". I don't know if they are always split like mine, I can't see why they wouldn't be. You will certainly have to take the lower one out anyway as it is all but impossible to poke the forestay through it without doing so. You just take the chainplate off and poke it out from the other side with a long screwdriver or something.
 
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Staloks

I seem to be the only person incompetent enough here to have loused up a StaLok. All worked very well when practicing at home with some scrap wire, but when I actually tried to do it for my new guardwires the fittings wouldn't screw up tight, and then jammed when unscrewing.

The difference may have been at home I carefully cut the wire with a hacksaw, whereas at the boat I just used the "emergency" wire choppers. This inevitably results in a crushed mangled end and I expect that's what caused the problems with the fittings.

I gave up and got the yard to fit swaged guardwires (which worked out cheaper than replacing the staloks I mangled).

On the plus side that means that you're welcome to one of the fittings I didn't use Dylan, let me know if you want it (StaLok eyes, 4mm 1x19).
 
[QUOTE=AngusMcDoon;3552682]Your trust in old stainless steel that spends its life in a marine environment is quaint, but one day it will catch you out.

attachment.php


I've had 3 stainless fittings failures in 3 years, the bolt the most recent. It all looks lovely and shiny on the outside, but inside, invisible cracks grow. The strength of a brand new M10 A4-170 seems a lot, but slowly slowly the crack works its way across, until you hit that wave or a gust loads the rigging just a bit more than normal, and the pistol like crack as it lets go is the first you know about it.

If you take other people sailing on your boat you have a duty of care to keep it maintained. 39 year old rigging is neglecting that duty. I know that you will come out with your standard answers that it looks fine, it hasn't failed in 5 years, I have a stressed high performance boat, but if you can't afford to replace 39 year old rigging, maybe you can't afford to go sailing at all.

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214378[/QUOTE]



I have just replace 14 10mm ss bolts holding shroud stands (they raise the shrouds to tabernackle pivot height for mast lowering) 4 of the 14 sheared with no effort !:eek: 30 years old . The others didnt look healthy so stainless well worth thoughly checking and replacing .


Searush said:
Why are you changing the rigging? Is it actually damaged, or because someone told you it only lasts 10 years (or whatever)? I ask because my rigging probably dates from 1973, which makes it 39 years old & it still holds the mast up. People on here have told that me I am "dicing with death & it will fall down next season" for the last 5 years or so since I first mentioned it.

Look carefully for any damage or staining, especially at the terminals, but unless seriously racing, I would not bother changing just for an arbitary time limit.
Click to expand...


but would agree that if you are really competent and have a good understanding of what your looking at, then some parts may well not need replacing.
 
jamesjeffrey said:
I seem to be the only person incompetent enough here to have loused up a StaLok. All worked very well when practicing at home with some scrap wire, but when I actually tried to do it for my new guardwires the fittings wouldn't screw up tight, and then jammed when unscrewing.

The difference may have been at home I carefully cut the wire with a hacksaw, whereas at the boat I just used the "emergency" wire choppers. This inevitably results in a crushed mangled end and I expect that's what caused the problems with the fittings.

I gave up and got the yard to fit swaged guardwires (which worked out cheaper than replacing the staloks I mangled).

On the plus side that means that you're welcome to one of the fittings I didn't use Dylan, let me know if you want it (StaLok eyes, 4mm 1x19).
Click to expand...


the wires do have to be very clean cuts . Worth having a dremel type thing with a diamond grinder to tidy any ends that look raggy . there has to be no distortion or bends in the individual wires
 
(snip)
attachment.php


I've had 3 stainless fittings failures in 3 years, the bolt the most recent. It all looks lovely and shiny on the outside, but inside, invisible cracks grow. The strength of a brand new M10 A4-170 seems a lot, but slowly slowly the crack works its way across, until you hit that wave or a gust loads the rigging just a bit more than normal, and the pistol like crack as it lets go is the first you know about it.

(snip)
Click to expand...

3 failures in 3 years is a lot, I haven't had a single failure in 25 years, maybe I am just lucky. But then I don't have any bolts in my rigging. They are all clevis pins, a much more easily checked item, far stronger & not under any tensile strain thro possible overtightening either. I'd see if you can replace your bolts with more suitable fittings if I was you.

Probably my highest risk area is the deck fittings which are bolted from below & the nuts are resin covered so they could fatigue crack unseen. But the rigging is designed to not flex them & one letting go probably wouldn't bring the mast down in normal use as I don't sail her on her ear. It should be possible to heave to or tack & set up a temporary repair to get me home, even if I have to motor. I also suspect my old rigging is much better quality than I could buy to replace it.
 
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