Sunseeker Mustique 42

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Maritimeman1664

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Ahoy there!
I’m considering investing in the above vessel
It’s running twin Detroit engines and shaft driven. However the cruising speed is 20kts top speed of 25kts this seems a little slow to me and my question is if I change the props could I raise both speeds ?
Also looking at a Martinique which will cruise at 28 Kts and top speed of 38kts
Any help here much appreciated
Gary
 

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Maritimeman1664 said:
It’s running twin Detroit engines and shaft driven. However the cruising speed is 20kts top speed of 25kts this seems a little slow to me and my question is if I change the props could I raise both speeds ?

Gary
Click to expand...

Hi Gary and welcome to the forum.
There several pitfalls(not just money) with changing props in attempts to gain "More Speed" and a bit (rather a lot) of research should go into discovering if in fact the boat has the right props and something else is slowing in down.
You could also damage the engines over time.
What else could be slowing it down. ?.....Let us count the ways !

First things , are both the engines achieving the Revs they should at WOT. ?
The list of things after that is extensive.
Weed would be good place to start and the cheapest to sort.
 
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Hi and Thankyou
Good info here I was a little surprised with over 550 hp so I think a little more research perhaps a chat to sunseeker even
The boats in truly immaculate condition
It’s just the reckoning of the speed that’s a little concerning
 
If it's the one I think it is, I'd be asking the broker to ask the owner what the speed SHOULD be. The speeds in the advert look all wrong. Reputable broker, it's quite possibly a mistake. That boat was also available with smaller Volvos and would have performed pretty well. So the idea that the DD powered one can only manage 24kts is way off.
 
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Looks a good one .
Not wanting to ignite a shaft vs outdrive argument , a shaft will going forwards costs you less in maintenance and hassle than an elderly outdrive .
The outdrives May be quicker and more fuel efficient but unreliable at this age demographic.

I wouldn’t worry or get over fixated with the speed ....in my view it all depends on the hull form , balance ie where the engines are and sea state .
Unless it’s flat as a pancake out there ,
Many outdrive sports cruisers at higher speeds say 26/30 knots can end up slamming in waves anyhow because the stern sections have a lower deadrise .This means the waves hit and slam a flatter section usually about station 5 or 6 .
The rearwards weight makes them ride bow high , and the designer needs a flatter aft section to create more lift at the rear because the CoG is rear biased because of the engines stuffed next to the transoms + legs dangling off .

Mean while the shaft boat could have its engines more central ....the more central the lower the shaft angle and better performance but the more comprised is the accommodation as the engine room starts to eat living space .
Theres extra drag from the shaft and rudders , but more storage behind the engine space .

May be because the Mustique is heavier and carries more deadrise aft to which it can to accommodate its stern gear , has bigger fuel tanks etc its hull drags more does not need as much lift as the lower powered flatter Martinique hence the speed difference .But it will be a better sea boat , better ride less slamming and more capable sea boat .
You do realise the shaft variety will consume more fuel than a outdrive but you offset that ( a known expense) off the outdrives unknown and ongoing unreliability expenses in aged boats .

For me i would test drive them both in a nice sea state and go from there ........which one rides the best .
Test driving in pancake flat seas is pointless btw .

As always get a good engine survey ..an engineer if you are really serious.But writing this I am assuming neither has any mechanical issues to make a decision difference .

The DD ,s sound fantastic btw if you are into that kinda thing .

Depends what you want from your boat ........speed over substance.
 
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Getting significantly different dims too .
Mustique beam 4.0 or even 4.1 from one broker but crucially 11000 kg displacement.
Martinique 3,35 beam and only 7000 kg .

Those stats mean to be fair they are not quite comparable as a pair imho .

The beamier Mustique will feel huge if you step from one to another.
I ,am happy and safe suggesting the Mustique is a better sea boat . (y)
 
Maritimeman1664 said:
Ahoy there!
I’m considering investing in the above vessel
It’s running twin Detroit engines and shaft driven. However the cruising speed is 20kts top speed of 25kts this seems a little slow to me and my question is if I change the props could I raise both speeds ?
Also looking at a Martinique which will cruise at 28 Kts and top speed of 38kts
Any help here much appreciated
Gary
Click to expand...

It will go much faster than that unless it’s faulty. 38 WOT doesn’t sound silly to me.
Detroits sound amazing and are super responsive but they are very thirsty.
Get a survey from someone who knows them and pm some owners.
Whitelighter has them And divemaster has rebuilt his and is a bit of an expert.
 
It’s been a while since I have read a sales pitch like that .
That boat looks like it’s been loved continuous all it’s life , Sunseeker’s that age are normally falling to pieces .

The only point that would put me off is the engines , more the fact that there isn’t a great dealer network in the uk , plus they are noisey and thirsty, the potential buyer would need to see the service history and if possibly retain whoever has maintained it .

Plus the right surveyor to look over it .
 
Hi Agree with VP they are thirty and expensive to run and for parts. There is a squeeker moored close to us with these engines and if he does have a fault it takes them ages to fix. If I remember he sources from the states to save costs which is another delay as some parts are hard to get here.
 
I was in your position 2 years ago.

looked extensively into carmague 46 with DD’s

Mustique 42 with CAT 4208’s

Martinique 38 with KAD42’s (bought that one)

I think those Detroit’s are the electronic version which I don’t think are that well thought of Compared to non electronic versions. 6v92 is a robust lump but to get 550 hp out of it they put 2 massive turbos and monster injectors in it. I have 2 great mates who run 46’s with the non electronic versions and although a heavier boat.....they suck 150 -175 litre per hour at 20 knots! I came very close to buying a 46 but it was just too bloody noisy at cruising speed.

expected rebuild on the DD’s is 1-2k hours.....I think Alf, (Divemaster)the forum DD expert reckoned £2k per cylinder but don’t quote me on that.

UK based parts a very very expensive and online support trying to figure out parts is rubbish this side of the pond. I got a quote from Mitchell’s to do a full service and tune up it was £6k from memory.....bugger that....a new outdrive is less than that ?

Mitchells are very knowledgable and would be good to talk to Industrial Engines & Parts Distributor - Mitchells

The Mustique does look very clean and buying any sunseeker from this era is the right thing to do IMHO.....but I am bias ?

Good luck with it.
 
FARSCO said:
I was in your position 2 years ago.

looked extensively into carmague 46 with DD’s

Mustique 42 with CAT 4208’s

Martinique 38 with KAD42’s (bought that one)

I think those Detroit’s are the electronic version which I don’t think are that well thought of Compared to non electronic versions. 6v92 is a robust lump but to get 550 hp out of it they put 2 massive turbos and monster injectors in it. I have 2 great mates who run 46’s with the non electronic versions and although a heavier boat.....they suck 150 -175 litre per hour at 20 knots! I came very close to buying a 46 but it was just too bloody noisy at cruising speed.

expected rebuild on the DD’s is 1-2k hours.....I think Alf, (Divemaster)the forum DD expert reckoned £2k per cylinder but don’t quote me on that.

UK based parts a very very expensive and online support trying to figure out parts is rubbish this side of the pond. I got a quote from Mitchell’s to do a full service and tune up it was £6k from memory.....bugger that....a new outdrive is less than that ?

Mitchells are very knowledgable and would be good to talk to Industrial Engines & Parts Distributor - Mitchells

The Mustique does look very clean and buying any sunseeker from this era is the right thing to do IMHO.....but I am bias ?

Good luck with it.
Click to expand...
Great info here Thankyou
My other option is a Martinique with full recon pentas low hours immaculate and owned by the same surgeon for years
Plenty of service history no osmosis ?
 
volvopaul said:
It’s been a while since I have read a sales pitch like that .
That boat looks like it’s been loved continuous all it’s life , Sunseeker’s that age are normally falling to pieces .

The only point that would put me off is the engines , more the fact that there isn’t a great dealer network in the uk , plus they are noisey and thirsty, the potential buyer would need to see the service history and if possibly retain whoever has maintained it .

Plus the right surveyor to look over it .
Click to expand...
Good info I wish she had 2 cats in !!
 
oldgit said:
Hi Gary and welcome to the forum.
There several pitfalls(not just money) with changing props in attempts to gain "More Speed" and a bit (rather a lot) of research should go into discovering if in fact the boat has the right props and something else is slowing in down.
You could also damage the engines over time.
What else could be slowing it down. ?.....Let us count the ways !

First things , are both the engines achieving the Revs they should at WOT. ?
The list of things after that is extensive.
Weed would be good place to start and the cheapest to sort.
Click to expand...
Seems from the comments that 20 kts and circa 28 wot is about right ?
 
Portofino said:
Looks a good one .
Not wanting to ignite a shaft vs outdrive argument , a shaft will going forwards costs you less in maintenance and hassle than an elderly outdrive .
The outdrives May be quicker and more fuel efficient but unreliable at this age demographic.

I wouldn’t worry or get over fixated with the speed ....in my view it all depends on the hull form , balance ie where the engines are and sea state .
Unless it’s flat as a pancake out there ,
Many outdrive sports cruisers at higher speeds say 26/30 knots can end up slamming in waves anyhow because the stern sections have a lower deadrise .This means the waves hit and slam a flatter section usually about station 5 or 6 .
The rearwards weight makes them ride bow high , and the designer needs a flatter aft section to create more lift at the rear because the CoG is rear biased because of the engines stuffed next to the transoms + legs dangling off .

Mean while the shaft boat could have its engines more central ....the more central the lower the shaft angle and better performance but the more comprised is the accommodation as the engine room starts to eat living space .
Theres extra drag from the shaft and rudders , but more storage behind the engine space .

May be because the Mustique is heavier and carries more deadrise aft to which it can to accommodate its stern gear , has bigger fuel tanks etc its hull drags more does not need as much lift as the lower powered flatter Martinique hence the speed difference .But it will be a better sea boat , better ride less slamming and more capable sea boat .
You do realise the shaft variety will consume more fuel than a outdrive but you offset that ( a known expense) off the outdrives unknown and ongoing unreliability expenses in aged boats .

For me i would test drive them both in a nice sea state and go from there ........which one rides the best .
Test driving in pancake flat seas is pointless btw .

As always get a good engine survey ..an engineer if you are really serious.But writing this I am assuming neither has any mechanical issues to make a decision difference .

The DD ,s sound fantastic btw if you are into that kinda thing .

Depends what you want from your boat ........speed over substance.
Click to expand...
Thankyou for your input we are going to see the Martinique on Monday and the mystique on Tues and go from there
 
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