sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Yep , but he got there in the end .
Just leave the rest of the forum memebers to follow now . Or maybe the Mod will step in again .
Steel Yachts
- Thread starter Mino
- Start date
Yep , but he got there in the end .
Just leave the rest of the forum memebers to follow now . Or maybe the Mod will step in again .
hpeer
Member
We have 2 Steel yachts, each about 35 years old. A 33’ Ted Brewe design and a 44’ Alan Pape design. I’ve had some corrosion in both, it comes from allowing continuous water contact. I’ve done some small amount of plating which is easily done as long as you can get to both sides.
I don’t think much of ultrasonic testing but can be useful if there are some small areas you want to investigate. It’s far too easy to miss bad spots as they may be quite small. I firmly believe that your best to do your own survey, examine every inch of the hull on the inside with a strong light and a hefty screw driver. If a spot looks suspicious then maybe to an ultrasound test in that area. If you can’t see it then no one else did and it hasent been maintained.
I agree with buying a yard built boat, amature boats can b done well but often are not.
The Brewer is a traditional build with stringers and they cause water retention problems. The Pape has the plates welded to 1” solid round stock, no stringers. This Eli area a lot of opportunity for water to pool.
Rust will happen, you will need to weld to fix. Just know that and move on.
I have also seen really badly rusted hulls. The ones I saw were pretty obvious.
Steel has saved my butt a few times.
2 part epoxy is a PITA for small repairs. We are fooling with a couple of alternatives, both show promise. POR 15 uses a prep solution and then 2 coats. Is a fairly flexible paint. Also Pettit Rust Loc. A very high aluminum content primer. I use 3-7 coats. Each has its advantages.
At one point I blasted and repainted the hull, a nearby refinery deposited stuff on my hull which ruined the paint job. Extreamly frustrating to sand off 5 layers of brand new paint I had just put on. Fixed now but took a helluva long time to figure it out.
I think if your a welder you will recognize a bad hull pretty quickely.
I don’t think much of ultrasonic testing but can be useful if there are some small areas you want to investigate. It’s far too easy to miss bad spots as they may be quite small. I firmly believe that your best to do your own survey, examine every inch of the hull on the inside with a strong light and a hefty screw driver. If a spot looks suspicious then maybe to an ultrasound test in that area. If you can’t see it then no one else did and it hasent been maintained.
I agree with buying a yard built boat, amature boats can b done well but often are not.
The Brewer is a traditional build with stringers and they cause water retention problems. The Pape has the plates welded to 1” solid round stock, no stringers. This Eli area a lot of opportunity for water to pool.
Rust will happen, you will need to weld to fix. Just know that and move on.
I have also seen really badly rusted hulls. The ones I saw were pretty obvious.
Steel has saved my butt a few times.
2 part epoxy is a PITA for small repairs. We are fooling with a couple of alternatives, both show promise. POR 15 uses a prep solution and then 2 coats. Is a fairly flexible paint. Also Pettit Rust Loc. A very high aluminum content primer. I use 3-7 coats. Each has its advantages.
At one point I blasted and repainted the hull, a nearby refinery deposited stuff on my hull which ruined the paint job. Extreamly frustrating to sand off 5 layers of brand new paint I had just put on. Fixed now but took a helluva long time to figure it out.
I think if your a welder you will recognize a bad hull pretty quickely.
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Brent Swain
N/A
On aluminium boats, serious corrosion is usually self evident. On steel boats , how much epoxy was put on the inside, before spray foaming, is critical. Foam alone, is definitely not an effective protection for the inside of a steel boat.
Dragging your fingernails over the foam, you will hear a distinctive hollow sound, where the foam has separated from the steel. Some say you can hear that by slapping the outside of the hull. That is where you should dig the foam out, and have a look at how much epoxy is under it.
No paint there ?
Walk away.
A hammer and centrepunch will let you know where the steel is too thin. If you cant drive the punch thru ,there is plenty of thickness.
Buy one of the cheapie online ultrasound steel thickness gauges, and learn how to to use it, to measure the thickness of any metal, anywhere on a hull, from outside.
Being a welder, you would be wise to rig an engine driven 100 amp alternator for welding. I have, and have built everything from anchor winches to windvanes to wood stoves , in my cockpit, at anchor.
Most Yard built boats around here are extremely poorly built ,. zero paint inside, under the foam.Chines and cabin top corners welded outside only, and most of that weld ground off, leaving only the thickness of a beer can holding them together. Eric Hiscock had a yard built boat which had every mistake you can make on a steel cruising boat, built in. There are some amateur built disasters ( quickly self evident), but most are far better built than most yard built boats around here, with some exceptions on both sides.
Yard built boats are much better at hiding their screwups.
A friend had just put a fresh coat of epoxy on, when an idiot in a helicopter landed beside him, throwing up clouds of debris. Luckily ,the fresh paint was on his deck only, and the debris became his non skid.
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A1Sailor
...
Brent, If James follows your advice and makes a hole in the hull of somebody else's boat what do you recommend he does next?
Thanks.
Brent Swain
N/A
If you were buying a wooden boat with a wooden mast, and the owner said
"Don't step there or you might go right thru, and don't lean on that mast ,or it may fall down, but the boat is sound and solid, "how would you react"? Would you buy the boat?
You could ask the seller how thick the plate is. If he says "plenty thick,' and believes it, then he would have no problem with your checking it out . If he doesn't believe it, and wont let you check it out, then he is lying, and thus you owe him zero consideration. You do owe some consideration to whoever he tries to con next. It could be a matter of life and death, possibly to children.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Brent , I not going to join in given you stick as many have here ,
BUT I have to say if I own a steel yacht and was selling it , no way would I let anyone use a punch to check out the thickness , you may just as well let them drill holes in the steel .
My years have been spend around GRP boats and in the same way I wouldn't let anyone remove a sea cock to check out the thickness of the hull which is much less damage then punching it with a punch or wacky it with a hammer , unless they willing to pay for the boat in advance.
GHA
Well-known member
He's actually bang (
) on with the centre punch method, i do the same in the bilges, , though bit tricky on some one else's boat as it will likely damage the paint system. Any worries pre long passage then centre punch and a goog whack, anything more than a dimple then there's big trouble. Nothing like drilling a hole, it's a just good check in suspect areas. Maybe dull the point a little . It works.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
He's actually bang (
He may be bang on and I no doubt it's a good way to test how good you steel is on your own boat , but I doubt any seller would be keen to let you do It on his boat , can you imagine, One guy after another punching dots in the hull , plus punching one place means nothing you would need to do it !n quite a lot of places and then you wouldn't know I felt you miss I bad bit.
I suppose you could then change the name to dotty
A1Sailor
...
I was hoping you might come up with a meaningful reply for a change - instead we get the usual evasiveness. Would you suggest putting a bolt through the hole made or would you need to weld a patch on the inside or the outside?
SlowlyButSurely
Active member
I agree with Brent and GHA on this. You can use a punch with a flat nose and it won't damage the paint. When the time comes to sell our steel boat any prospective purchaser is welcome to use a punch and hammer as I'm confident it's all sound.
Brent Swain
N/A
And if they had paid for it in advance, and the centrepunch went right thru, showing metal as thin as a beer can, what then? A centrepunch below the waterline will have zero negative effect on a steel hull of adequate thickness. Any owner who would have a problem with that, doesn't have any confidence in it having any more thickness than a beer can, a warning you should walk away.
Like a wooden boat sale ,where the owner says "Don't step on the decks. They may be so rotten , you may go right thru." Would you not also take that as a warning sign ,or would you buy the boat anyway?
If your plastic boat is on the hard, and you take a thru hull out yourself ,to show how thick the hull is ,and it is more than adequate ,that would a be a good selling point.
Brent Swain
N/A
Any place where it is thin, any added plate should be set in flush, to eliminate any voids between plates. If the punch goes thru anywhere, it should be then tested over far more doubtful areas of the hull.
I find those steel cutting circular saw blades excellent for cutting without igniting foam. Each is good for about 35 feet of 3/16th plate. Then they can be resharpened. They leave a cut which looks like it was done by a milling machine.
A1Sailor
...
Thank you.