Steel boat as a long-term liveaboard (in a warm(er) climate).

[Tin Tin]

10 years ago, the wife and I took a year off work and sailed into the sunset.
We crossed the pond to the Caribbean and back.
Upon our return, we kept the boat and continued to sail in local waters (South Coast and later Normandy/Brittany).
If I'm being honest, the boat has gotten too big for us lately (neither of us are spring chickens), but we kept her 'in case the children/grandchildren want to come sailing'. Well, the children have no time/interest and we are still awaiting the arrival of our first grandchild.

I retired last year and the wife will retire next year. What would we do to fill our day? Out of the blue, the wife suggested 'why don't we go sailing again, but this time take our time'. I was pleasantly surprised, it had always been a secret desire to sail into the sunset again, but I thought the love of our life would not be up for it.

Anyway, our current boat is a 46', early 90s AWB. Like I mentioned, she is getting a tad too big for us and some items would need replacing/upgrading if we were to go long-term cruising again. The boat's fine for cruising in local waters when you can pick your window, but rigging would need to be replaced, she could do with a new suit of sails and the electrics could do with an overhaul. Engine's got 4600 hrs on the clock. We have neither the desire/funds to embark upon another project.

A week or so ago, we chatted about our plans with a young French couple who were looking for a boat to liveaboard and eventually go cruising. Long story short: they have offered to buy our boat. Not for as much I would have liked, but we have to be realistic and given the state of the boat and the present market I would have to say that the offer is 'fair'.

For the money we would get, we're looking to buy something in the 36-40' range requiring no (or very little) work.
We both started browsing the usual websites (Yachtworld, Apollo Duck, ... ) and the wife's current favourite is a 39' steel boat.

I have always associated such boats with high latitude cruising. Being allergic to 'cold', I have no desire to go there.
My own experience sailing non-GRP boats is limited to helping a friend move his Ovni from Brest to La Rochelle.

So, anyone have any experience of sailing/living aboard in a warm climate? Caribbean, Mediterranean, ... ?
Do they turn into an oven?
Also, she seems quite heavy - weighing in at 12 tons. Do you find that you're motoring more than sailing?
How about maintenance? What to look out for?

Any reply much appreciated.

 

[Tranona]

Steel was at one time very popular for that job, but seems to have fallen out of favour recently with few new boats being built. You have identified a couple of the downsides - weight and insulation, to which you have to add corrosion, both external and particularly internal. Often worse if you then add teak decks and heavy internal fitout which makes for both easy places for rust to start and difficult to access for treatment. Advocates say if you keep on top of it (like wooden boats) it is not difficult to prevent long term problems - but do you want to spend your retirement doing such jobs?

Depending on budget plenty of choice of good GRP boats, although finding one in "ready to go" condition that you both like may not be so easy.

 

[bluerm166]

How about emailing Susan and Jules of 'Sailing Emerald Steel' you-tube channel.Their 30 year experience of a steel hull liveaboard in all climes and totally hands on experience should be invaluable.

 

[bedouin]

The weight should have little impact on how much you sail - resistance is primarily to do with surface area not weight. However if one of the reasons for giving up your current boat is size is replacing it with a 12tonne boat really a good idea?

 

[Monique]

In my opinion, unless you get a boat built from Corten steel, you will spend the rest of your life doing detective work on rust patches (nasty work). If you want to cruise long distances get a boat that can.... A forty ish Moody, Malo, Swan, Sweden, Nauticat or smaller Amel like the Sharky for instance.

However, what is your budget?? I know a very well equipped 1976 Amel Meltem (52 feet) available for €50000... superb bargain IMO.

 

[Tin Tin]

Often worse if you then add teak decks and heavy internal fitout which makes for both easy places for rust to start and difficult to access for treatment. Advocates say if you keep on top of it (like wooden boats) it is not difficult to prevent long term problems - but do you want to spend your retirement doing such jobs?

Good point. My thinking exactly.

How about emailing Susan and Jules of 'Sailing Emerald Steel' you-tube channel.Their 30 year experience of a steel hull liveaboard in all climes and totally hands on experience should be invaluable.

Will do.
Thanks for the lead.

The weight should have little impact on how much you sail - resistance is primarily to do with surface area not weight. However if one of the reasons for giving up your current boat is size is replacing it with a 12tonne boat really a good idea?

Current boat 46' weighs in at 13.5 tons.
The thing that's becoming an issue is: big boat - big sails, rather than the seize/displacement of the boat.
Occasionally, we find ourselves motoring because neither of us feels up to hoisting the main.

In my opinion, unless you get a boat built from Corten steel, you will spend the rest of your life doing detective work on rust patches (nasty work). If you want to cruise long distances get a boat that can.... A forty ish Moody, Malo, Swan, Sweden, Nauticat or smaller Amel like the Sharky for instance.

However, what is your budget?? I know a very well equipped 1976 Amel Meltem (52 feet) available for €50000... superb bargain IMO.

Budget is £75,000 - but that would have to be 'ready to go'.

 

[Tranona]

Ready to go probably means £60k for the boat which would rule out many of the "quality" boats unless you want to go back 30-40 years. However plenty of centre cockpit boats such as the various 36-38' Westerlys and Moodys would be well within range as would Bavaria 38 Ocean.

From sail handling point of view consider in mast furling, although less common on boats of that vintage, but commonly available on more recent AWBs where there is a bigger choice in that size/price bracket, and mostly aft cockpit.

 

[steve yates]

Sounds like some kind of ketch might suit you guys. Smaller sail areas individually to handle, and easily sailed under mizzen and genoa when rough, saves trying to reef the main.

 

[cmedsailor]

I know a couple in their 75+ age that perfectly handle their Jeanneau SO 42DS. With electric winches and in mast main even bigger boats are easy to singlehandle. OK, probably slightly above your budget (or maybe not) but is a perfect boat for the Med or to cross the Atlantic with the trade winds. But if you insist with the 36-40 range, then many examples like the Jeanneau 39i/ds, a Beneteau Oceanis 393, or 423, Bavaria 38,39,40 and so on. Many examples of fiberglass, easy to keep and maintain, boats perfectly suitable for the Med. Even the boat I have (Beneteau 361) at the lower end of the size your are thinking and lower than your budget could be an example, since the plan is to take it easy (and select the whether).

 

[Tranona]

Sounds like some kind of ketch might suit you guys. Smaller sail areas individually to handle, and easily sailed under mizzen and genoa when rough, saves trying to reef the main.

Really no need for a ketch with today's sail handling gear. Severely limits choice of boat and all the clutter of the mizzen in the aft end of the boat is a real problem in warm climates where you need a bimini and easy access to the stern for boarding, mooring, swimming etc as well as a large clear cockpit for relaxing.

Those are some of the reasons why virtually no ketches are built today - although does not mean that they were not an appropriate solution for easing sail handling in the past.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Fit electric winches including one for the main halyard to your existing boat along with the rest of the refit and it won't be a problem.

 

[GHA]

So, anyone have any experience of sailing/living aboard in a warm climate? Caribbean, Mediterranean, ... ?
Do they turn into an oven?

Nope, the insulation helps both extremes, you see the snow melting first along the frames where they conduct the heat past the insulation and keeps it a little cooler in the summer with a windscoop providing a nice breeze through the boat.

Though unless you are seriously heading off the beaten track then the benefits of steel aren't so obvious, an Atlantic circuit maybe GRP would be a better option overall.

 

[Tin Tin]

Fit electric winches including one for the main halyard to your existing boat along with the rest of the refit and it won't be a problem.

I think I haven't made myself clear.
We haven't got the funds/time to embark on a refit.

Hence our plan to sell the boat 'as is' and used the funds from the sale to acquire a smaller, (older?) ready to go boat.

 

[Tin Tin]

Sounds like some kind of ketch might suit you guys. Smaller sail areas individually to handle, and easily sailed under mizzen and genoa when rough, saves trying to reef the main.

That was my initial thinking too. Looked at some Amel boats.
However, the ones within our budget all looked rather tired and would need work done.
Even the rather promising looking Maramu we went to see in La Rochelle had 'issues'.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I think I haven't made myself clear.
We haven't got the funds/time to embark on a refit.

Hence our plan to sell the boat 'as is' and used the funds from the sale to acquire a smaller, (older?) ready to go boat.

I doubt that you will find what you are looking for, in fact I doubt that there are many boats that are ready to go certainly not in the 40' range at 75K perhaps a 34 or 36 if someone is selling but they don't grow on trees.

 

[TQA]

I cruised for 7 years on an old steel boat. The hull and deck plating was corten steel. I did get some replating done while I owned it. Most of my sailing was in the tropics and it was fine temp wise. Distinctly cooler than anything with teak decks.

I am out cruising again in the Caribbean as a wrinkly and chose a fiberglass boat this time. Definitely less maintenance. Having said that if the steel boat has been properly prepared and painted then the upkeep is not too onerous. Keep rust killer primer and topcoat in nail varnish bottles and apply as required as soon as you spot a chip.

 

[Monique]

Tin Tin,

You have PM...

 

[AndrewB]

Like TQA, I owned, lived, and went blue-water cruising in a 38 foot steel boat for many years. There were several advantages. Thick insulation kept the inside much cooler than comparable GRP boats in hot sunshine, the internal temperature being regulated by the sea. (The decks could get hot of course, but I do not recall this as a particular problem). The strength of the material meant we had no fears of hitting anything or running aground, and that in turn meant we visited many places, specially among atolls, that few GRP boats dared to try.

Three downsides. As you say, steel is heavy, and yachts tend to be slow compared to GRP. The weight also means there can be a stability problem. In order to create the necessary stability, the headroom in a yacht of the size you are considering is often restricted. Beware any steel boat that has been 'modified' to increase the headroom. Finally the maintenance issue. The original epoxy coating on ours held good throughout for 15 years. Thereafter there were increasing problems keeping the rust under control, which is a dirty, unpleasant job, forbidden in many marinas. You cannot have the immaculate, fitted furniture of GRP yachts, because it all needs to be removable for inspection and maintenance. By 30 years old, and with my own advancing age, it simply got too much for me. So if you want to avoid this, make sure you buy a professionally built boat not more than a few years old, and expect to sell by the time it reaches 15.

 

[john_q]

Three downsides.
As you say, steel is heavy, and yachts tend to be slow compared to GRP.

The weight also means there can be a stability problem. In order to create the necessary stability, the headroom in a yacht of the size you are considering is often restricted. Beware any steel boat that has been 'modified' to increase the headroom.

Finally the maintenance issue.
The original epoxy coating on ours held good throughout for 15 years. Thereafter there were increasing problems keeping the rust under control, which is a dirty, unpleasant job, forbidden in many marinas. You cannot have the immaculate, fitted furniture of GRP yachts, because it all needs to be removable for inspection and maintenance.

By 30 years old, and with my own advancing age, it simply got too much for me. So if you want to avoid this, make sure you buy a professionally built boat not more than a few years old, and expect to sell by the time it reaches 15.

As another steel boat owner (ours is now 43 years old, we have had her for 23 year and live aboard in the tropics ) totally agree with all the comments above especially the bit

So if you want to avoid this, make sure you buy a professionally built boat not more than a few years old, and expect to sell by the time it reaches 15

 

[[70521]]

Personally, I'd go for an second hand Ovni.