Starting out

[Kyle Reese]

Hi All

New joiner here. In a couple of years I will be taking a career break of roughly 5 years.
I have no set plans yet but I am starting to look into how to best spend that time.

I want to travel as much as possible, ideally spending as little time in the UK as I can. Just me and the wife no kids. We would probably rent our house.

Boating around the med is something that has come onto my radar, not for the duration but perhaps 2-3 years. This would allow me to travel around from April to October along the med and then travel long haul during winter when the boat is out of the water. I think it could work very well for me.

However before I go getting excited and spending a lot of time doing research I have a few questions which I hope you can help me with.

On the day to day costs front, this will be maybe 2 or 3 summer seasons. What basic costs should I be considering on say a 45 foot motor boat. Insurance, fuel, berthing, utilities, repairs etc. I appreciate this is a long list but so far after some brief research perhaps a ball park of £2000 per month should cover everything? Is this realistic?

Winter costs, not really looked into this yet but I guess the boat will need to come out of the water for inspection and repairs.

Licences. I don't have much knowledge and even less time at the wheel so I would need to do a few courses. I am quite adaptable though and learning is something I enjoy and am well used too. I have done some research and should allow perhaps up to £1000 for training?

Depreciation. I have a budget of about £150k to buy a boat if we did go that route. Again I know its hard to put numbers on things but how much of that am I likely to get back? I would ideally like to keep the depreciation to a minimum.

Lastly, what is life generally like in berth? Is it possible to stay fairly short term say a month or two then move on or you do have to commit? Are most owners around 7 days a week or is it very much a weekend play thing for people?

I think that's it for now... go easy on me!!

 

[AndieMac]

There are a number of reasonable Vlogs on YouTube of folks doing the sea-change thing all over the world, some of its absolute, annoying rubbish, but some of it’s quite good and informative, like Sailing Yacht Ruby Rose for example, a London dentist and his partner.
Get an ICC and rent a boat in the Med as a start, after you have done all the inshore skipper training, to see how you both can cope being on board for long periods and dealing with all the day to day issues like weather, berthing and other boaties

 

[MapisM]

In a couple of years I will be taking a career break of roughly 5 years.

I wouldn't call anything with a time horizon of 5 years a "break", to start with. "Life change" is more like it.
And it ain't just a semantic difference, because it implies one important consequence you'd better be aware of, before even starting doing any math.
If you go that route, you will either love or hate the lifestyle.
And if the first, I very much doubt that after 5 years you will be willing to go back to whatever your current career is (assuming it isn't boat-related).
Otoh, if the latter, more than likely you will want to end your "break" well before spending 5 years on it.
Just saying. Good luck anyhow! :encouragement:

 

[Kyle Reese]

There are a number of reasonable Vlogs on YouTube of folks doing the sea-change thing all over the world, some of its absolute, annoying rubbish, but some of it’s quite good and informative, like Sailing Yacht Ruby Rose for example, a London dentist and his partner.
Get an ICC and rent a boat in the Med as a start, after you have done all the inshore skipper training, to see how you both can cope being on board for long periods and dealing with all the day to day issues like weather, berthing and other boaties

Thanks yes I have been looking at the rental option perhaps for a few weekends maybe the year after next. Costs seem to vary quite a bit but 500-700 per day seems to be the asking rate is that about right? I assume that's a bare cost so fuel and berthing will be additional .

I have been watching a reading a few vlogs / blogs but if anyone has any more then fire away!

 

[Portofino]

I,ll try and answer each para

Your start place is where you buy the boat , buy one already in the Med fully equipped with a Passerelle, Aircon , generator, Bimini ,good tender , 45 ft ish is nice size for a couple it’s what I have there’s plenty of berths that size and it’s big enough to undertake out of sight of land sea passages carrying plenty of kit like a liferaft .
Two sleeping cabins each with a bathroom should be fine .

April to Oct or May to Nov both work , weather is warmer with the latter as there’s a delay warming up .

Insurance is mostly based on % of value so £150 K ,s worth £1K to £1.2 K ball park pa .
Fuel for a mobo will be your biggest bill by a country mile .
It’s all depends how fast you go .Planning at 25 knots will gobble approx 150/180 L / hr @ €1.35 Spain , €1.55 Fr , €1.80/1.90 Italy , but less than €1 in parts of the Adriatic former Yugoslavia none EU states , if you go there ?

How ever at displacement speeds ( where the boat does not lift up ) below 10 knots in a 45 ftr consumption drops to more palatable 30/40 L / hr .

If it’s calm then D speed works , but if it’s rough and choppy P speed is more comfortable and you arrive , finish it so to speak quicker and enter a port , possibility beating bad weather building up ?

You can of course buy a dedicated D speed boat even with one engine , These generally are less Med summer designed.
In the summer you need lots of outside space not inside .

Basically you could blow £2K on fuel alone in 1 week with a typical med planing boat say a S/Skr Camargue 44 or Portofino 46 , but move 800 miles in 2/3 days in daylight social times .

It’s at this point if ambivalent to which type of boat seriously consider a sail boat any production French 40/45 ftr .Eliminating the fuel bill side , but unable to realistically move 100 miles , more like 50 in a day .

Berthing fees for 14/15 M in the Cote D Azur typically one night €80 , 1 year €16000 and monthly in between.
There are cheaper and more expensive , could be 1/2 or 3 x depending exactly where you go and when .Greece and further E the prices drop .
But France / Spain / Italy , and there dependant islands make up a huge chunk of Med coastline collectively.

Figure about £5 K for essential annual maintenance and minor repairs .
If a fridge packs up there’s no Curry’s it’s a “marine “ version + fitting = grand , €1 k by the time your beers cold again .

There are plenty of places to haul it out in the winter , Italians do this a lot and Italy is pretty central , they put them in hangers indoors .
I don’t know how much guess €400 pcm + lift out and in fees another €400 .
It can be left and basically forgotten about until next year starts .
But something will cease up or prematurely knacker over a regular run up boat sat in the water and loved all winter , So brace yourself for more repairs at the lift in .

Training get some paper work - any - and practice experience particularly “ parking “ it .Perhaps you can negotiate some personal hands on with the boat you buy in the location you pick it up .I did ! Twice both times I bought a Med boat .


Depreciation.
Buy a 10/15 y old that’s already at the bottom of its Dep curve .
It’s possible you may come out square , but if it’s got large hrs some engines ( manufacturers advise ) need big milestone services.Without that “ stamp “ it will take longer to get out .You bear the costs while is sat there waiting to sell and they go down hill like a caravan if neglected further compounding the difficulty to off load .Those biggie engine services are around £10k ++ ?
That’s a huge difference between 2/3 years in a sail boat covering a few thousand miles and a motorboat , the engine hrs and the way the market deals with high hrs .
Say you buy @ 750 hrs then double that in the 2/3 y to 1500 + or end up trying to offload a 2000 hr + Volvo Penta 75 EDC in the two boats I used above to illustrate what you can get for £150 K , for example?

Life in the berth is fine , water , leccy , normally a shower block , launderette, shops , buses etc .
You can stay variable times it’s cheaper per month than each day as already discussed ^^ .A lot depends where you are and obviously summer school hols are the busiest , and yes WE are more busier .
You can spend nights at anchor if the weather permits or you find shelter .
This is when a good generator , tender and all electric boat comes in handy .
Another worthwhile option is a water maker on both types of boats for extended periods aboard and remote anchorages.

£3 K a month when you are on it with the majority on diesel should cover it in the summer .If you go slow at D mostly.
£5 k for maintenance DIY btw .
£5/6 K for winter the hanger

 

[kashurst]

A fast motor boat is great for fastjourneys, however a sailing boat is better for long term live aboard. Sailing boat is not fast but with a decent wind ( pick the day to suite) you can go a very long way for not much cost. Loads of room below decks and quiet and private in harbour. A displacement speed motor boat will do a long journey at similar cost to a sailing boat
but it can't sail on those perfect days. If you can't sail don't worry it's not that hard to learn, and will give you more choices for a long term lifestyle afloat.

 

[Kyle Reese]

Ok thanks for the detailed info. So £35-40k a year. That's a bit more than I was hoping for as my annual budget would be around £40k and was hoping to travel through the winter to the far east, USA etc which I think will push me over budget.. or consider wind power perhaps.

That said I was factoring in 30-40% depreciation so if that's less perhaps the numbers may stack up... but I want to avoid man maths at all costs!

 

[Momac]

For someone with no experience a 45ft motorboat is enormous and possibly too big for two people to handle.
You and your partner should get as much ad possible boating experience well before you intend to start your 5 year break.

 

[petem]

Some good advice above, particularly with regards to a sailing yacht over a motor boat.

A question for the original poster, are you the type of people that like being 'off grid' or do you like being tied up in a marina with access to restaurants, shops, somewhere to walk the dog (if you have one), etc.

Regarding a boat, you need something that's been designed for living aboard so domestic sized fridges / freezers, loads of storage space, washing machine, etc. something like an Elling E3 might work.

Pete

 

[Kawasaki]

Some good advice above, particularly with regards to a sailing yacht over a motor boat.

something like an Elling E3 might work.

Pete

Junno Pete
I might have said the same a while back
But having trained some owners on said Ellings and delivered a couple
Cannot knock the build quality but not for me in a seaway
Or for long term livaboard
Just my humble experince
Others will no doubt disagree

 

[markc]

Ok thanks for the detailed info. So £35-40k a year. That's a bit more than I was hoping for as my annual budget would be around £40k and was hoping to travel through the winter to the far east, USA etc which I think will push me over budget.. or consider wind power perhaps.

That said I was factoring in 30-40% depreciation so if that's less perhaps the numbers may stack up... but I want to avoid man maths at all costs!

I think you could get that cost down substantially - Don't forget that spending nights at anchor is free, and although marinas in the Cote D'Azure are expensive lots of the Med isn't and you can find lots of cheaper marinas to keep the boat during the winter. Also with all the time you have, pottering along at displacement speed will dramatically reduce your fuel bills.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

...having trained some owners on said Ellings and delivered a couple
Cannot knock the build quality but not for me in a seaway...

What's the issue you found with the sea keeping? (Semi D)?

 

[DavidJ]

We had our boat in Ostia (Rome) over the winter period about 10 years ago. For us we were coming and going but the marina had dozens of livaboards there so we got to know first hand of the style of life. Firstly almost all were yachts between 30 to 40 ft. You have to be happy lazing around. Sound attractive to busy people but has to be learned, I’m really bad at it. Nice group of international people with lots of advice and stories and always the organiser of music nights, art classes, events etc. The marina dedicated a large room for livaboard activities. Try and find a group especially for the winter. They all split up in the spring so you’re not stuck with them.
Enjoy

 

[Kyle Reese]

Thanks more good info.

If you are anchoring at some random place for a few days are there any regulations in terms of that?

 

[markc]

Thanks more good info.

If you are anchoring at some random place for a few days are there any regulations in terms of that?

Not really, unless mentioned in the charts - all non-anchoring zones are clearly marked on charts. Some areas have local rules such as the restriction in the Balearics for dropping anchor on Poseidon weed but a current almanac will have details

 

[Kyle Reese]

Thanks. I have made a list of a few motor boats that seem quite active and are similar to my own budget, my intention is to keep an eye on them on ship tracker and see where they go, how long it takes, where they drop anchor etc. Hopefully will give me a better idea of the more popular places and routes.

 

[PlanB]

For someone with no experience a 45ft motorboat is enormous and possibly too big for two people to handle.
You and your partner should get as much ad possible boating experience well before you intend to start your 5 year break.

I don't agree. We bought a Princess 435 as our retirement project. No previous experience and it was our first boat and so we had to have instruction from Day 1. We did our Day Skipper practical on our own boat, and then followed that up by months and months of boat handling practice in and around the marina, often with an experienced pal with us for confidence. Driving a 13m boat on twin shafts is quite logical, but with the air draft and a breeze there is a lot that can go wrong quite quickly and you do need to get some experience early on. I cannot emphasise enough the need for knowledge, research and experience if you are going to sea.
We spent three years preparing for our Med trip, delaying by a year at one point as we felt we were not ready. When we set off, it was our retirement trip so we took a whole summer, stopping wherevever we wanted and not moving if we were not happy with the weather or sea state. An experienced and confident skipper could do it in a couple of weeks, but it wouldn’t be much fun, in my view.
We then lived happily aboard in Spain for 12 years.
Portofino's post above has a lot of very valid info.

 

[Kyle Reese]

Great to hear you had a good time and was possible to do it with no xp.

 

[Portofino]

Ok thanks for the detailed info. So £35-40k a year. That's a bit more than I was hoping for as my annual budget would be around £40k and was hoping to travel through the winter to the far east, USA etc which I think will push me over budget.. or consider wind power perhaps.

That said I was factoring in 30-40% depreciation so if that's less perhaps the numbers may stack up... but I want to avoid man maths at all costs!

It’s was £3K per month on board with a reasonable fuel allowance in that to move and do the whole Med during the 2/3 years .
So 18 ( based on 6 months ) + 5 maintenance + 5 winter =£ 28 tops .

If you don’t move much it’s cheaper in a motor boat .
More D speed is cheaper but you don’t get far / day - doable thought .
If you anchor off a lot it’s cheaper .

 

[Assassin]

I would throw a curved ball and suggest something different, how about taking a boating holiday for a week somewhere such as the Norfolk Broads and see if you take to it and to see how you cope in something like a 30 footer as you will learn a lot if you prepare properly.

You will learn how boats react (or not) and you can monitor everything such as fuel consumption, space, mooring, and everything in-between; if the worst comes to the worst and you crash then it will only be at low speeds and you will do little damage, but you will learn a lot.

It will be cheap and you will find out if you could manage OK and possibly find a 35 footer would suffice with the correct layout and its reduced costs, then take it from there.