SSR-I can't renew
- Thread starter RichardPerou
- Start date
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Yes, it is a farce - and no doubt ship owners in the past had their favourite surveyors who would minimise their net tonnage to reduce light dues and port fees - or register elsewhere in countries that have "flexible" rules in more ways than one.
KellysEye
Well-Known Member
>But it doesn't show they still own the boat. It shows that the registry think they still own the boat. What if they sold the boat two years ago and didn't update the registration?
What I said is you can get the contact details of the owners on the certificate and contact them and ask if they still own the boat. If somebody is selling a Part One boat they will mention it on the sales details. Part One requires the registration number to be carved into a bulkhead. Since this is not possible on a yacht it's normally carved into hardwood and screwed to a bulkhead which ours was. So if you go to view a yacht and you see the number but it isn't in the sales details then you know it has lapsed.
I agree that a Bill of Sale obviously also proves ownership.
What I said is you can get the contact details of the owners on the certificate and contact them and ask if they still own the boat. If somebody is selling a Part One boat they will mention it on the sales details. Part One requires the registration number to be carved into a bulkhead. Since this is not possible on a yacht it's normally carved into hardwood and screwed to a bulkhead which ours was. So if you go to view a yacht and you see the number but it isn't in the sales details then you know it has lapsed.
I agree that a Bill of Sale obviously also proves ownership.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
But that is NOT what you claimed in post#8 above, nor if my memory serves me right on several occasions in the past.
Again nonsense that seeing a number screwed or carved on the boat but not in the sales details is an indication that registration has lapsed. It could just be an error in the listing. Only the registrar can tell you if it has lapsed, or that the records of when it lapsed are no longer available.
The Bill of Sale does not "obviously also prove ownership" - it is the ONLY proof. It is the certificate that ALSO lists registered owners, but is not proof.
Just to reinforce the point, a boat cannot be registered without the submission of a trail of Bills of Sale firmly establishing legal title to the boat. This has often been a stumbling block in the past when trying to register existing boats for the first time. The registrar will not record a change in ownership WITHOUT a properly executed Bill of Sale, nor can a charge be registered against a boat without, for example, seeing a mortgage deed.
So, accept the registration for what it is (and it is clearly of use) but don't pretend it is proof of ownership.
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GrahamM376
Well-Known Member
Even that isn't 100%. Boats have on more than one occasion been sold to more than one purchaser and any document can be forged. Although we are frustrated by the system in some countries where the boat has to be registered and the sale contract notarised, fraud is less likely.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Difficult to guard against forgery. However the registrar does scrutinise documents in the same way a notary would. A notarised forgery is possible and it is still a forgery.
The big difference is that our system is not compulsory for leisure boats, so it is the poorly executed previous sales, even if legitimate that are often the problem, and no independent record of the transaction as you get with registration.
However there is a cost, as I think I said earlier - 800 euros lawyers fees for the change in ownership of my boat in Greece - but I do have lots of pretty stamps as well as documents in Greek and English!