SSB not approved in EU

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wilkinsonsails

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We are sailing back from the US this year .Icom 802 ssb installed,by previous
American owners.

Have been told it's not type approved for EU waters?:rolleyes:
What they going to do,? take it away, switch it off,will I suddenly not hear anybody else.
Anyone had this problem.?
Cindy
 
wilkinsonsails said:
We are sailing back from the US this year .Icom 802 ssb installed,by previous
American owners.

Have been told it's not type approved for EU waters? :rolleyes:
What they going to do,? take it away, switch it off,will I suddenly not hear anybody else.
Anyone had this problem.?
Cindy
Click to expand...

When a radio transmitter is designed, it has to then go through rigorous and thorough testing for things like 'out of band emissions', peak power (SSB), Maximum continious power (FM), Adjacent channel power, Transmitter bandwidth, Receiver sensitivity, etc etc.

The European tests, whether Ofcom or any other European Regulatory Authority are far more stringent that the American FCC testing. For example, the Adjacent Channel Power in the FCC test state 20dB down on carrier power whereas the Eurorean test state -54dBm which is one hell of a lot tighter.

Now, The Icon M802 is built to FCC tests and Icom produced the M801 and variants to meet the EU regulations.

If you are importing the yacht (British flagging), then the M802 does not meet current EU regulations and if you use the SSB Tx in European waters, you could forfeit the SSB set and get prosicuted for using illegal equipment.

That said, it is doubtful that you would get caught but if say you used it in a harbour and caused inteference, the full weight of the Enforcement Agency could be brought to bear upon you.

I spent 25 years in Type Approval, Type Testing and Enforcement, working for the DTI RIS, Radiocommunications Agency and later Ofcom.

We did prosecute and seize illegal radio equipment when found and also checked for an operators licence. Often the user wasn't even allowed to operate and regularly did not hold a licence to operate the equipment in the first place.

I find it amazing the number of yachts which are not on the ITU register and have not declared a complete list of transmitters fitted to their yachts. It is an International legal requirement. EPIRBS, hand-helds and even PLB's are often missed as the owner(s) forget to update their onboard radio equipment. Also now, AIS 'B' transmitters (AISTRN) are very regularly missed out:

http://www.itu.int/online/mms/mars/ship_search.sh
 
wilkinsonsails said:
We are sailing back from the US this year .Icom 802 ssb installed,by previous
American owners.

Have been told it's not type approved for EU waters?:rolleyes:
What they going to do,? take it away, switch it off,will I suddenly not hear anybody else.
Anyone had this problem.?
Cindy
Click to expand...

Not going to argue technicalities with Lensman ( never get into a fight unless you can win :D ) but if you are sailing to the UK I would ignore the issue and carry on using the set. The probability of you being caught is very small - there are large numbers of unlicenced radio users here and almost no enforcement of the rules for leisure users. I'm sure that Lensman is right in what he says could happen but I've never heard of it happening to a yottie. Not even once.
 
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Bosun Higgs said:
Not going to argue technicalities with Lensman ( never get into a fight unless you can win :D ) but if you are sailing to the UK I would ignore the issue and carry on using the set. The probability of you being caught is very small - there are large numbers of unlicenced radio users here and almost no enforcement of the rules for leisure users. I'm sure that Lensman is right in what he says could happen but I've never heard of it happening to a yottie. Not even once.
Click to expand...

I think you have to be really unlucky to get 'caught'.
SSB sets are not much of a priority as use is not widespread in Europe.
We have a set fitted and most of the time there's no-one to talk to. Sometimes chat to a friend at Ostend Radio, apart from that... pretty quiet.
 
An easy avoidance strategy is not to use the set on transmit - unless you're an avid SSB-net contributor it's no hardship.

I'm glad to report that the UK Type Approval jobsworths have been given other things to do and type-approval for new sets is by manufacturer.

I'd suggest getting in touch with Icom (UK) and finding out if they can help you towards the necessary modifications to getting it to the 802 spec.
I've always found them very helpful - if you need any contacts (mine are probably out of date) drop me a PM.
 
I thought the 801 was just a ham enabled 802? because of that the 801 is not EU compliant. Dunno but heard that somewhere.
 
just get yourself a ham license. As a licensed ham operator you can own any kind of radios, also self-built. So - you can have a non-CE approved rig on your boat, and as long as you don't use it on marine bands everything is ok. And in case of an emergency - everything is allowed.
 
Wouldn't loose any sleep over it. By all means make sure you have you have your long range cert and that you declare the SSB on you ships radio licence but i wouldn't worry about not having some silly seal on the back of the unit or wherever.
 
wilkinsonsails said:
We are sailing back from the US this year .Icom 802 ssb installed,by previous
American owners.

Have been told it's not type approved for EU waters?:rolleyes:
What they going to do,? take it away, switch it off,will I suddenly not hear anybody else.
Anyone had this problem.?
Cindy
Click to expand...

What Lenseman says is quite correct for a UK flagged vessel however if you yacht is USA flagged then providing you operate only at sea then the UK rules do not affect you however if you are UK flagged then you started breaking the tules the moment you fitted the equipment as it is not approved for a UK flagged vessel .

As others will say, the chances of being caught are very slim and it is not unusual to see non approved equipment on ships and oil rigs which is classed as voluntary fit in addition to the required type approved equipment. IE many Oil rigs have SSB with free running processors to allow them to work sea, land and aeronautical frequencies not licensed for marine use. IE crew change choppers and land based stations at shore bases.
 
wilkinsonsails said:
We are sailing back from the US this year .Icom 802 ssb installed,by previous
American owners.

Have been told it's not type approved for EU waters?:rolleyes:
What they going to do,? take it away, switch it off,will I suddenly not hear anybody else.
Anyone had this problem.?
Cindy
Click to expand...
Load of tooth sucking tripe talked about type approval. Ak yourself this, when was the last time any jobsworth checked any equipment in your home or on your boat for type approval?
That answers your question?
Also when this type of questio comes up on here, everyone gets their knickers in a twist and bile is spewed etc etc.
Plus ask you self, when an American comes over here on his American boat, with his non type approved kit on board, does it turn to dust? does he turn in to a werewolf? does his boat and equipment fail to work? NO NO NO!!
AAAARRGGHHHH!!!
Stu
 
>there are large numbers of unlicenced radio users here and almost no enforcement of the rules for leisure users. I'm sure that Lensman is right in what he says could happen but I've never heard of it happening to a yottie. Not even once.


I agree, that's my experience. To demonstrate the shambles about radios when I filled in the form asking what radio kit you have the SSB tick box said MF. I pointed out it's MF/HF. Don't know if they have changed it.
 
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Bilgediver said:
Do you want to borrow a bigger wooden spoon?????

He might only be visiting!
Click to expand...

Somebody get me a stapler, my sides have split.

Actually, I assumed from the wording of the original post ("sailing back", "previous American owners", etc) that the boat was being imported to Europe. As there are a lot of bargains to be had Stateside, and as I might be looking for a bargain soon, I was interested in the process. Perhaps I should forward future posts to you for approval before posting.
 
pvb said:
Somebody get me a stapler, my sides have split.

Actually, I assumed from the wording of the original post ("sailing back", "previous American owners", etc) that the boat was being imported to Europe. As there are a lot of bargains to be had Stateside, and as I might be looking for a bargain soon, I was interested in the process. Perhaps I should forward future posts to you for approval before posting.
Click to expand...

if you do a search you will find this (very valid) question comes up about every two months in some form or other.

The simple answer is yes, boats imported from US have to comply. Second question is it easy? Answer usually no, but depends on the boat. In some cases it is not physically possible to comply, in others it is not economically viable and in some rare cases not a big deal. The cheap (and usually older) boats available in the US usually fall firmly into the first two categories - which is why they are still in the US and not imported here.

For basic information on RCD (and dreaded VAT/duty) matters go to the RYA website and all (or most) will be revealed.
 
"The European tests, whether Ofcom or any other European Regulatory Authority are far more stringent that the American FCC testing. For example, the Adjacent Channel Power in the FCC test state 20dB down on carrier power whereas the Eurorean test state -54dBm which is one hell of a lot tighter."

I've always had a considerable regard for Icom equipment.

Is it really the case that they specifically manufacture equipment for the huge American market that is designed to be significantly inferior in performance to the same model supplied to the European market?

Strikes me as a very odd thing to do
 
Beadle said:
"The European tests, whether Ofcom or any other European Regulatory Authority are far more stringent that the American FCC testing. For example, the Adjacent Channel Power in the FCC test state 20dB down on carrier power whereas the Eurorean test state -54dBm which is one hell of a lot tighter."

I've always had a considerable regard for Icom equipment.

Is it really the case that they specifically manufacture equipment for the huge American market that is designed to be significantly inferior in performance to the same model supplied to the European market?

Strikes me as a very odd thing to do
Click to expand...

Funnily enough, that was my next question, I totally agree.
 
The CE sticker is just a blank cheque for manufacturers to charge us in Europe about twice what they charge American boaters for the same bit of kit with a different model number printed on it.
 
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