So, broker or no broker?

For advertising consider using Apollo Duck, YBW and the Yacht Market as that will widen your audience. A single website will only be found by those specifically searching for your type of boat and probably 50% of my sales are from buyers who were looking for something else to begin with!

Might be worth noting that the free ApolloDuck ad' doesn't allow links to other websites. My original plan was to build a website, then advertise the website on various sites. The ApolloDuck "Standard Advert" allows linking to your own site, but also allows your own web page on ApolloDuck.
 
I'm fairly new here so by the time YBW have moderated this it will probably no longer be relevant but here goes.....

I really like jonic's style and thank him for bigging up the independent brokers! I try to do everything he lists but believe me it's not always easy, and often it's the buyers who cause the problems.
One thing I'd like to add, with some trepidation, is that the value of boat is quite relevant to whether or not a broker is used. The OP's boat probably falls right on the cusp of should / shouldn't, which makes his original question all the more pertinent.
The ironic thing is that, while with the smaller lower value boats there's obviously much less reason to use a broker i.e. less risk involved, reluctance to let any of the achieved price be lost on comission etc; it tends to be down at this end of the market you get the more difficult buyers! If you're thin-skinned or short-tempered a broker might be a big help to you ;)
I've been trying to diospose of a Mirage 28 at a very low price for a friend on ebay and you wouldn't believe some of the nonsense I've had to put up with.
The OP seems to be web-savvy and all of the advice about making your own website etc. is undoubtedly good. But as jonic has pointed out, getting the leads is only part of the whole thing. With respect, a lot of the strongest proponents of the private website / sale have done it mostly with smaller, lower value boats.
I think the value of the OP's boat is just getting into the bracket where there will be a certain percentage of good buyers who aren't 100% comfortable with giving over that kind of money to a private individual (comments about escrow / conveyancing notwithstanding). Remember a private seller doesn't have a reputation to protect, whereas a broker is nothing without his. Buyers instinctively understand this - remember you were all buyers once!

I find with higher value boats it all changes markedly. Sellers don't have the time, or aren't interested in dealing with buyers. Buyers don't trust private sellers with that amount of money. The people tend to be much more straightforward, and could probably manage fine without a broker. :D But they almost alway use them. Such is life. Make no mistake, brokers have to work extremely hard to get to list high-value boats, and it takes years to built that kind of position in the industry. Which is why it can be dis-illusioning to find that some people hate brokers out of hand anyway: coming from the hands-on side of the marine trade I found this unsettling, but I'm getting used to it! :)

To get right back to the original question, to the OP I'd say with your kind of boat there's every chance you'll get interested, genuine buyers, so if you have the time and inclination to do the viewings, and can make your own website, then go for it without a broker. If you can enlist someone like jonic with a conveyancing-only service (good idea, that ;)) then all the better.
Only sting in the tail is that, in the event that you don't get her sold and run out of time or whatever, brokers tend to be much less keen on boats that have failed to sell privately for ages before being brought to them.
Best of luck,
R.

+1

Nice site too ;)
 
I have not sold a boat yet, but did buy via a broker. I did look at the wider market and would have been happy to purchase privately.

Brokers do have a large network of advertising channels and will proactively push your boat in various listings. They are also on hand to manage visits. They also have a nose for good clients and will filter out the consistent time wasters.

It has been said that Brokers will do other services such as the bill of sale, contract and handle the deposit and final payments. In a way its the same as the estate agent taking on the work of a solicitor as well.

One respondent to this forum claimed that a title search is also carried out. Unfortunately this is not as clear cut as property as there is no equivalent of the land registry where "Charges" against a boat can be registered.

On the whole, brokerage is very honest, but there has been very rare occasions where a brokerage business collapsed and client money has been lost as it was not kept in a client account. Its always best to ensure that some sort of escrow account is put in place so that both parties are protected.

Boats are sold privately every day. You can get a detailed book from the RYA on this which also includes sample sales contract templates.

Setting the price is also fairly simple, all you need to do is thumb through the many yachting ads and you will soon get a feel for what to ask for.

A potential buyer may wish to appoint a surveyor. They will need the boat to be out of the water - but that will not be your problem as its done at the buyers expense. During survey, patches of anti-foul will be removed as they will be looking for stressing and gelcoat crazing. Surveyors have a number of favorite places to look. If you are lifting the boat, I would possibly stop after blasting off the weed (if any).

Promoting your sale may not be as effective as going with a broker, but a good website will help, but you will need to list it in some of the free listings. It may be useful to take out a private ad in YM (couple of lines - serious yacht hunters will see small ads).

Finally, put together a two or three page promotional doc with the yacht details along with the full inventory which is included in the price. Try to ensure that all items not included in the inventory is not on the boat when people come to view.

Good luck!
 
Broker or No Broker

With the market as depressed as it is I believe one should try all avenues. ie Broker, Class Association, personal web page and word of mouth. I am going down all these avenues including absolutely dumping the price as it does not make sense to hold out for what should be the correct price when there are few buyers. On my four previous boats I asked and received the correct market price. I now have a better boat in much better condition and still unable to sell.

http://www.iledere-france.com/white_knight_westerly_oceanlord.html

If anyone has ideas on other ways to move a boat in excellent condition and well maintained I would love to know.
 
With the market as depressed as it is I believe one should try all avenues. ie Broker, Class Association, personal web page and word of mouth. I am going down all these avenues including absolutely dumping the price as it does not make sense to hold out for what should be the correct price when there are few buyers. On my four previous boats I asked and received the correct market price. I now have a better boat in much better condition and still unable to sell.

http://www.iledere-france.com/white_knight_westerly_oceanlord.html

If anyone has ideas on other ways to move a boat in excellent condition and well maintained I would love to know.

How are you determining "correct Market price"? As far as I can tell only brokers and owner associations have this information reliably.
 
How are you determining "correct Market price"? As far as I can tell only brokers and owner associations have this information reliably.

Look at all the other boats of its type and age and then pitch in line with those. In my case I have pitched considerably below the perceived/Broker recommended price. I would say that it is certainly not in a Brokers interest to pitch too high otherwise they would not sell any boats.

Valueing a boat is no different than a house. ie other houses in the road ie location and features of that house and condition.
 
Look at all the other boats of its type and age and then pitch in line with those. In my case I have pitched considerably below the perceived/Broker recommended price. I would say that it is certainly not in a Brokers interest to pitch too high otherwise they would not sell any boats.

Valueing a boat is no different than a house. ie other houses in the road ie location and features of that house and condition.

Correct market price is what it will sell for.
 
Correct market price is what it will sell for.

Agreed.

Unfortunately for sellers, many "browsers" see one or two boats offered at a low price and seem to think all the others of the same model are overpriced, regardless of differing levels/ages of equipment and engines.

Having looked at many boats some years ago before purchasing, I was amazed at some of the expensive junk around but the owners thought they were the dogs *ollocks. OTOH, I've been amazed recently at the low prices some very good and well equipped boats have been selling for.

It's a buyers market out there and I think some sellers need to look at how much it's going to cost them in marina fees, insurance and maintenance for every month (or year) their boat doesn't sell.

Many adverts also do very little to persuade a potential buyer why they should go and look at that particular boat v another. A friend has recently set up a boat sales business in Portugal - www.yachtgrot.com - with videos of the boats and it's drawing far more interest than the old ad's did.
 
With the market as depressed as it is I believe one should try all avenues. ie Broker, Class Association, personal web page and word of mouth. I am going down all these avenues including absolutely dumping the price as it does not make sense to hold out for what should be the correct price when there are few buyers. On my four previous boats I asked and received the correct market price. I now have a better boat in much better condition and still unable to sell.

http://www.iledere-france.com/white_knight_westerly_oceanlord.html

If anyone has ideas on other ways to move a boat in excellent condition and well maintained I would love to know.

If you have not done so already, suggest you speak to John Rodriguez who posts on here under the name jonic. He is a broker who specialises in just this sort of boat.
 
Agreed.

Many adverts also do very little to persuade a potential buyer why they should go and look at that particular boat v another. A friend has recently set up a boat sales business in Portugal - www.yachtgrot.com - with videos of the boats and it's drawing far more interest than the old ad's did.

Good luck to him, if he is flexible he should do well.

When we considered selling our boat in Portugal we were quoted 10% fee, when I asked if it was negotiable I was told "No, it doesn't matter if its a dinghy or super yacht " I asked to speak to the director and was politely told he was a very busy man and would not waste his time with people trying to negotiate fees.

The sun bleached adverts in the window tell a story.
 
I havent got past the first page of this thread, but would definitely suggest Appollo Duck and any Owners association website.

Also, put a link to your website in your footer on here - I sold our first boat that way, despite putting her up with Ancasta who achieved the square root of SFA.
 
Good luck to him, if he is flexible he should do well.

When we considered selling our boat in Portugal we were quoted 10% fee, when I asked if it was negotiable I was told "No, it doesn't matter if its a dinghy or super yacht " I asked to speak to the director and was politely told he was a very busy man and would not waste his time with people trying to negotiate fees.

The sun bleached adverts in the window tell a story.

I'm not surprised. The general attitude there is that only rich people have boats. Don't see many Portuguese sailing old Centaurs & MacWesters.
 
With the market as depressed as it is I believe one should try all avenues. ie Broker, Class Association, personal web page and word of mouth. I am going down all these avenues including absolutely dumping the price as it does not make sense to hold out for what should be the correct price when there are few buyers. On my four previous boats I asked and received the correct market price. I now have a better boat in much better condition and still unable to sell.

http://www.iledere-france.com/white_knight_westerly_oceanlord.html

If anyone has ideas on other ways to move a boat in excellent condition and well maintained I would love to know.

She looks great, but she is a very British centric boat priced in £ Sterling and based in a euro zone. With the weak euro she will look too expensive to euro buyers. In euros she is 110,000 euro. Recent sales have been around the 80,000 euros mark for euro zone based Oceanlords being sold to euro buyers.

If you are in a hurry your best bet is to get her back here or bite the bullet and price in euros.
 
She looks great, but she is a very British centric boat priced in £ Sterling and based in a euro zone. With the weak euro she will look too expensive to euro buyers. In euros she is 110,000 euro. Recent sales have been around the 80,000 euros mark for euro zone based Oceanlords being sold to euro buyers.

If you are in a hurry your best bet is to get her back here or bite the bullet and price in euros.

This nicely illustrates my point. Although there may be several being advertised at a higher price (the "correct market price" mentioned earlier), they are actually selling for far less. The price they actually sell for is available only to brokers who have a database of that information. This is where the broker can come in handy if they are smart enough to list for a realistic price and ignore "the market".
 
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