Snapdragon tips anyone?

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mr_williams

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Firstly let me say a big thanks to everyone that has helped me so far, it is comforting to find such an active forum, full of wise old (and young) sailors.

I am going to take a look at a few Snapdragon 26 yachts over the weekend so I am wondering if anyone has some tips for me on what I should be looking at most. Any known issues with these types of boat... etc..

I am doing a lot of homework on them as I write this, but my motto is that experience speaks volumes above a paid review.

Thanks again.
 
Most Snapdragons have the standing rigging attached to the u bolts through the hull instead of chainplates. Not a widespread or major problem but here have occasionally been instances of these u bolts failing because they have fractured where they go through the hull and not noticed. Check the underside of the u bolt - if they are difficult to access or glassed over then give them a good going over. If access is easy and any glassing over has been cut away then they have probably been replaced.

On the whole, soundly built boats with few structural problems for their age and not a high incidence of osmosis. Mostly bilge keel although some lifting and fin. There is a PBO report available I think.
 
I have a snappy D26 sail number 172. They are very solid boats with no significant stock problems. Buy a powerful drill if you intend drilling holes as the fibreglass is very thick, these boats were made well before oil increased in price.

The advice about the U bolts is spot on, they might look good on top and below but if they have not been replaced they will be fecked in the middle. The snapdragon owners club have issued a safety notice concerning the U bolts. I intend to replace mine this year.

They only other stock fault is the rudder assembly, the shaft passes through bronze ? spacers and sits in a bronze cup at the bottom of the skeg. After years of use these ware, they can be replaced but you need to cut the skeg and drop the rudder assembly into a hole dugout below the boat. A fairly easy job but cutting the skeg into two takes some courage, you need to have some confidence in your glass fibre skill to put it all back together.

I sail my snappy in the Clyde and have survived several F8’s with no problems. The boat never gives the impression that it is struggling, always feels safe. Just completed the classic malts cruise this summer, 400 M round trip with Skye the furthest point north and west. We were the smallest boat on the cruise but we still managed to visit the same places as the 50 footers etc. Even with four on board the space was fine.

Final note be prepared to spend money upgrading if the boat has not been kept upto date, I reckon I have spent 4K in the last two years replacing wiring, sails, toilets, diesel tanks, batteries etc. This is not a criticism of snappies but applies to any older boat. My accounts show £100 on jubilee clips.
 
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.....After years of use these ware, they can be replaced but you need to cut the skeg and drop the rudder assembly...

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Forgot about the rudders, mines already been done.

If there is a stainless "boot" assembly on the bottom of the skeg holding the bottom bearing, so has the one you are looking at - I have drawings /photos if you want to know more about this conversion.
 
great stuff....

I will take a little time this afternoon to ensure I fully understand what you are saying... Thanks for your post Davie, everyone is telling me that this boat is a good family boat choice and that they are built very well...

Cheers Les.. I would appreciate any information you have on the conversion.. i have private messaged you with my email address...


Cheers again
 
I used to own a Snapdragon 24. As the rest said.. very sound boats.. quite heavy and unbelievable how well they handle rough seas.

Very safe and forgiving.

The only concern i had on mine was that the deck area around the mast was a bit weak and i had a creeping crack which was giving me the shudders.

Have a good luck from the inside as well around the tabernacle area.

Best of luck

Tyrone
 
I agree, great boats and the 26 is huge inside. They won't win any races, and you'll do better sailing a bit free rather than trying to pinch up to windward, but tough and seaworthy.

My 24 did great motoring into a 6 with wind over tide a few weeks ago. We never had a moment's doubt that she'd cope, but I wouldn't bother trying to sail to windward in those conditions.

Look for slop in the rudder - fixable as above, and all the usual ills any 30 year old boat is prone to, few of which are fatal - old rigging, knackered sails, corroded mast, stiff winches, tired engine & drive train, leaky windows and stanchion mounts, etc. Blisters are unlikely, but, given the thicknesss of the layup, a few are nothing to worry about, except for the seller 'cos you can negociate a price reduction!

Do be aware that the gelcoat is likely to be getting a bit thin, so the topsides and deck may need painting,if they haven't been already. Look for pinholes in the gel or a random pattern of thin black lines in areas of wear, but if the price is right, that shouldn't put you off.
 
Re: Snapdragon Assoc ....

Yep .....

Lescargot or Stemar can help you better with contact ... I left them years ago - in fact gave Stemar my burgee !!!

They are very active East Coast - but South Coast division when I was with them was very poorly managed.

BUT they have all the plans / archives / modifications listed etc. The assoc. book and files they give on joining are best bit ...
 
Thanks Paul...

Looks like you have a great boat there. I have scene it advertised around the place and it looks like you have put some more pictures on since I last saw it as well. If only every seller went to the trouble of showing lots of pics, I am sure boats would sell a lot quicker.

Unfortunately, I am well below your asking price as I am looking to spend 5K max....

I was supposed to look at one last weekend but a "thing" came up and so I am hoping to see it this weekend at the latest.

Best of luck in selling your boat, If I hear of anyone else looking for a family boat I will surely point them your way.

Cheers
 
I had one of these (a 24) for a few years. It showed-but-didn't-go to windward. Thames barges sail closer to the wind. Beating, it went sideways as fast as it went forwards. It griped like hell running, so that you couldn't control it with the autohelm running if you had more than a scrap of sail up. The lack of headroom below (abt 5'8" as I remember) was just enough to make washing up or cooking below excruciating in port and impossible under sail. It had no chart table apart from the pathetic fold up dinette affair and nowhere at all to mount instruments. It was mind bogglingly uncomfortable to sleep in since the bed is on the table when it's put down and is formed of lots of cushions rearranged. The fit out was only reproduced in caravans of the late 60's. It's really a motor sailor with a weak motor (usually YSE8 or similar). There is a vast area under the cockpit which you can't get to, which is aggravating because you are short of stowage throughout. All the years I had it I used to glower past the engine at that empty space ... one day, one day. Apart from that it was perfect. My best advice is that this is one boat best bought with an outboard, which if fitted usually resides in a well (A.K.A. stern locker) That releases a huge amount of stowage. But a boat like that will never sail any good and will frustrate you. Just a look at Paul's pictures will tell you why. There's not much blade sticking into the water. ANy ex-dinghy sailors who stepped aboard one would be shocked.

ps oh, and the area under the tabernacle bends under tension when you're sailing. I seem to remember PBO abt ten years ago did an article on how to strengthen that area. It can be done successfully but is a big job.
 
Thanks Gun,

I understand what you are saying and you have pointed out serveral areas that I will need to consider when thinking of buying this boat.

There must have been a reason why you bought your boat in the first place though?

I am not too worried about the performance issues at the moment. I say this as my misses is pretty scared of the thought of yacht powering along... I think she saw some pictures of yachts running on their side (is this called heeling?) and immediately she thought of the kids and it being dangerous... so a slow old girl should get them all comfortable with just being on the water.

I am looking for stability first and foremost... plus I want to learn to control the boat under sail at a slow pace which if my thinking is correct should be more forgiving.


Am i going down the wrong path here? I am also thinking that every boat, regardless of age and or design has some issues with it somewhere...

Cheers again for all your thoughts.
 
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I am also thinking that every boat, regardless of age and or design has some issues with it somewhere...

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Couldn't agree more...
 
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I am also thinking that every boat, regardless of age and or design has some issues with it somewhere...

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Couldn't agree more...

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And the issues with Snapdragons are well known - mine lives up to it's name.

They are a good starter boat, high volume (mine - 747 - has 5'10 standing room) and forgiving. They are generally owned by people who want their (usually young) family to feel safe and gain confidence, are unlikely to set off if there is talk of 5 or above (although the boat is more than able to cope if caught out) and certainly don't plan to spend any time beating to windward for hours on end.

They are not for everyone, but the majority of owners are happy with them and their limitations. Time comes to move on for a variety of reasons but every ex Snappie owner that I have spoken to remembers them fondly.
 
I can confirm absolutely Lescargot comments ....

I had a Snap 23 and even though a touch lighter, less headroom etc. than the 24 ..... I certainly remember mine with pride and fondness.

My father had one of the original snap 23's that were designed with centre lift keel ( SD01 - SD10 ..... ours was SD09) .... we entered Round Island Race each year and always did reasonably well .... later SD11 and onwards they had a redesign ..... snap assoc etc. say not true - but I assure they did !! The SD10 and before had a slight droop to the deck fwd and were a wet boat .... lighter and quite quick. SD11 onwards had a rise to fwd deck and were dryer ..... heavier and not so quick !! often built with bilge keels as well creating a triple keel arrangement.

Anyway - go look and decide for yourself - there are many snappy owners out there that are more than happy and you could be one of them !

Remember - reef early, keep boat reasonably upright ... and leeway / uncomfortable sailing will be a figment of imagination ! Push her over and she'll just slide away to leeward ... with little gain in speed.
The 747 is supposed to sail a little better than its predecessor the 24 ... but I'd argue about that !!

The 26 is a good boat and will survive most you can throw at it ....

(Just a comment .... the photos in the write up for the one for sale are good - but seem stretched a touch lengthwise ? The freeboard and hull depth do not appear right ... have the photos been accidently elongated ??)

Oh neraly forgot ..... a good addition to any boat of this size is a cockpit tent or awning .... make it yourself etc. - adds to the enjoyment .... done really well - can create an extra cabin !
 
Re: I can confirm absolutely Lescargot comments ....

From my experience with Jissel, SD 24, I would say that Gunfleet's experiences were unfortunate. Maybe his sails were knackered.

True, on a beat, most of the boats in the Solent that actually bother to sail closehauled will be going faster and outpointing me (maybe 'cos they're racing!), but we still make reasonable progress to windward. The trick is to avoid pinching. If we're in a hurry, we've always got the donk.

On a reach, we make little leeway and found ourselves in about a 5 recently doing better than 5 1/2kts under full sail, heeling 30+ degrees. Not recommended - with a reef we'd probably have been doing 6kts and been a lot more comfortable, but it was a LOT of fun and leeway was still minimal.

Also, the headroom could be better, but not on many 24 footers. I'm 5' 11" and have no problem below, though my posture's awful after a week on board!

I've thought about that space aft of the engine too, but IMHO, storage is pretty good for a 24 footer. so I don't think I'll bother.

I think you'll struggle to find a 26 for £5000, but you should get a reasonable 24. IMHO, an inboard diesel is worth paying significantly more for than an inboard petrol and I wouldn't consider an outboard powered one unless it was a real giveaway price.
 
Re: I can confirm absolutely Lescargot comments ....

Thanks guys for all the comments and the advice.

I think I will get "that feeling" if the boat is right for me and my family.

Thanks to the comments posted here, I am confident this is the correct choice for my families first boat and hopefully I will find one that is in reasonable condition for the 5 cookies I have to spend.

When I do find it, I will most likely post a series of questions and would very much appreciate all your response.

Cheers again
 
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I am not too worried about the performance issues at the moment. I say this as my misses is pretty

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You rascal! Does she know what you're writing about her ont t'interweb? Seriously I had a sd for six or seven years. Started by loving it, ended by hating it. Why did I buy one? It looked safe, had almost standing headroom (my previous one had kneeling headroom) and was a lot of boat for the money. And I'd never had a bilge keeler, only small lifting keel things before that. I felt, surely it couldn't be so bad if so many people had one? But I was naive. Why is a bilge keel safer than a fin? It doesn't make sense. Whether your boat is a 2ft draft bilgy or a 6ft fin, you still have to do the tidal calc. And if you read between the lines of some of the more positive comments you'l see they're really admitting it's a motor sailor (if we need to get somewhere etc). The SD is sometimes more convenient because you can get over a cill earlier or dry out upright in mud (though don't absolutely rely on drying out in a bk - could end in tears). If you and the pretty missus are under 5'10 none of the interior probs will matter a damn. And if you've already made up your mind, so be it. But put a note in your diary to tell us how you feel in a couple of seasons.
 
Seems Gunfleet has just alienated an entire boat group !!

No problem ..... each to their own.

Many people wouldn't buy my boat .... that's not my problem ..... swmbo and I are happy with it. (It's not a SD by the way ..... just an example).

My SD 23 was very good for the 4 - 5 yrs I had it ..... only changed to get the headroom .... otherwise it was fine.

The SD is a lot of boat for the money ..... and has brought a lot of people into boating .....

The amount of money the guy wants to spend - limits him in getting a reasonable size boat with reasonable headroom ..... so why is he knocked for going for a good compromise ?

I am interested in the drying out comment "dry out upright in mud (though don't absolutely rely on drying out in a bk - could end in tears)." ...... as it would have to be a pretty bad location with some awful lumps / gradient to make drying out with a BK boat end in tears ...... I would much rather take the bottom with a BK boat than any other type of keeled boat unless it be a flat-bottom barge or similar !

I have at present a BK and a lift keel boat .... sold of recently a fin keeler ..... previous boats have included triple keel and BK .... crewed and played on long-keel, dagger boards, lee-boards etc. But still appreciate my Bilge Keels ....

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