Small sailboats visiting Portsmouth Harbour

[Seajet]

It's possible, perhaps even probable, that Gunwarf wouldn't mind you picking someone up with a dinghy, but where would you anchor? There's a prohibition on the Dockyard side; it's a naval base and they're twitchy about security due to terrorist threats. There's nowhere over that side I'd want to anchor up prior to a swift visit shoreside by Rubby-Dub, whereas you can tie up in Camber for a short while often without charge.

I've never seen anyone anchor in Haslar Creek, although there are places on the Gosport side, past C&N where you could drop the hook for a short while relatively unmolested. If you were planning a raid by dinghy on the ferry pontoon, you might be able to drop the hook in the space between Haslar Marina and the pontoon itself. The LSP used to keep their vessels moored there so it's deep enough at all states of the tide.

The RNSA have moorings inside the RFA fuel pontoon (cold harbour?) that might be "borrowed" for a short time, if vacant. Not strictly "polite" it's true. I've not been in Royal Clarence Yard since it became a Marina and speaking from memory, all the other access in the outer reaches of Forton Lake are bespoke by clubs (the CSSA, Gosport Cruising Club and the RA Yacht club?) all of whom have some sort of security.

Have you tried contacting Gunwarf and asking if they'd allow you to pick up from there? They might be OK with it. At least you'd know.

Topcat47,

good stuff and as you say at least Dan would know, though I don't rate his chances of anything for free around Gunwharf !

As you say, if visiting by tender, where will the mothership be ?

Still seems to me the Gosport ferry is best bet, but if late at night carry something casual like a broadsword & machine gun...

 

[Nicholas123]

The ballast buoy is at the old Camper and Nicholson marina end of the SMALL CRAFT CHANNEL.

As you seem not to know the buoyage or the channel to keep to and mention tacking across the harbour entrance, I'm afraid you are a ripe target for patronizing gits like me, which is nothing compared to the treatment you'd get from QHM and the Modplod !

The small craft channel is about 100 yards wide, on the Western side of the entrance.

Vessels with engines are expected to use them, as it says on the outer buoy; I forget the buoy number but it's about a quarter of a mile outside Portsmouth entrance.

On the way in one leaves the big ship red can buoys close to starboard.

Any further to the West at this point risks running onto the Hamilton Bank shoal which runs parallel to the big ship entrance channel.

You then keep reasonably close to the Western shore heading North - going alongside the apartments which used to be the HMS Dolphin submarine base - in a straight line all the way to the big red can buoy inside the harbour named 'Ballast'.

Nowadays going across the harbour to have a closer look at any warships may result in the seasons' greetings in the form of depleted uranium or other pointy things.

http://www.qhm.mod.uk/portsmouth/regulations/small-boat

Your on another planet seajet.I have never mentioned tacking across the Harbour mouth,small boat channels or Port bouyage.
Your personal vanity is simply quite staggering.
The op can simply enter the Port in the normal way & nip over to that hard no problem as far as I can see,though I'm sure if he listens to you long enough you will convince him that the only way to do it is by helicopter

 

[Seajet]

Your on another planet seajet.I have never mentioned tacking across the Harbour mouth,small boat channels or Port bouyage.
Your personal vanity is simply quite staggering.
The op can simply enter the Port in the normal way & nip over to that hard no problem as far as I can see,though I'm sure if he listens to you long enough you will convince him that the only way to do it is by helicopter

Nicholas123,

I must have dreamt this post of yours then:

What happens if you hav'nt got a radio?I have been sailing out of Portsmouth & have tacked back & forth across there on numerous occasions & never had any trouble from anyone.I should think that hard is perfectly alright & particularly in winter when the traffic won't be anything like as heavy as in the summer.


I think you'll find ( the hard way ) that ferries and ships operate throughout the winter.

The OP DanCrane is a sensible bloke and even if he eventually decides on a boat is unlikely to emulate your to and fro.

I was trying to help you avoid a chat with the Modplod, if you don't believe me ask QHM !

 

[Nicholas123]

Nicholas123,

I must have dreamt this post of yours then:

What happens if you hav'nt got a radio?I have been sailing out of Portsmouth & have tacked back & forth across there on numerous occasions & never had any trouble from anyone.I should think that hard is perfectly alright & particularly in winter when the traffic won't be anything like as heavy as in the summer.


I think you'll find ( the hard way ) that ferries and ships operate throughout the winter.

The OP DanCrane is a sensible bloke and even if he eventually decides on a boat is unlikely to emulate your to and fro.

I was trying to help you avoid a chat with the Modplod, if you don't believe me ask QHM !

Seajet,where have I said I tack back & forth across the entrance?A claim that you have made repeatedly.
I am starting to wonder seajet if you even know where the entrance is!Though curiously you seem to know where the small boat channel is
I suppose you have actually visited Portsmouth Harbour yourself have you?

 

[Seajet]

Nicholas123,

how about reading your own posts as I repeated above ?!

It might be great 'fun' to come along with you and find out your personal geography of Portsmouth Harbour; I obviously don't have a clue, only having been a regular visitor - and resident on both a mooring in Spider Lake and a flat on Southsea seafront - since 1975.

 

[Enya]

And the poster only wanted to know if there is a cheap way to pick up his mates from the train in Portsmouth Harbour. I have a mooring at the top end of the Harbour and found the proposal of using the Hard near the Station novel. Had to check my chart immediately. I shall look out for it next time I am down that way - presumably April.

I would never use a dinghy near the mouth of the Harbour unless ship wrecked. Might be feasible for a seriously strong boatman.

 

[Seajet]

And the poster only wanted to know if there is a cheap way to pick up his mates from the train in Portsmouth Harbour. I have a mooring at the top end of the Harbour and found the proposal of using the Hard near the Station novel. Had to check my chart immediately. I shall look out for it next time I am down that way - presumably April.

I would never use a dinghy near the mouth of the Harbour unless ship wrecked. Might be feasible for a seriously strong boatman.

Enya,

talking of being shipwrecked, I've always thought ( but not researched which I might do right now ! ) that the ' Spit Refuge' buoy just outside Portsmouth in the entrance channel must originally been just that, a place for sailors to seek shelter if they were forced to swim for it; there's a similar refuge on Plymouth breakwater.

 

[l'escargot]

I wouldn't cross anywhere near the entrance in a dinghy, too much in the way of traffic and cross currents for me. Anyway, all the places that you could leave a boat on the Gosport side are places that visitors could embark having got the ferry across - there is nowhere you could anchor and leave the boat. As for the Hard, it is a generally manky place at anything but HW springs. I would just cough up for a short stay at Haslar Marina - letting the crew embark at leisure and possibly having some refreshment and using the facilities in the Lightship.

 

[Marakei]

I know Portsmouth Harbour a bit, although usually too busy sorting out fenders and dodging Sunsail to have much of a look around.

As others have said, it would not be a good place for shakedown trips in a dinghy because of the traffic and currents and engine-free unfriendliness.

Dan should look elsewhere.

 

[Seajet]

A good friend used to mix with the RN etc during WWII and after; on one occasion a couple tried to row across the entrance after a ball, but the dinghy got swamped - they found her clinging to a buoy outside the entrance, never found the bloke.

If one has a VHF it's always worth listening to QHM channel 11, you can work out quite easily what ships, ferries, fishing boats or hovercraft are setting off, and in the case of car ferries and fishing boats, if they're taking the short cut to the South West at the higher states of tide they'll say " QHM this is ---, request Swashway ".

This shallow channel used to be on alignment between Southsea war memorial and the church spire inland to the NE, but some buffoon built a tower block in the way which didn't amuse the Admiralty !

So now it's a case of ligning up the war memorial and one edge of the machinery room which appears almost black on top of the tower block; I won't give any more detail as though I know it off by heart visually I don't remember more details offhand.

 

[Greenheart]

So many intelligent, informed-sounding recommendations and warnings here, I feel I mayn't have been specific enough.

To those warning of traffic & currents representing serious risk to dinghies and boatmen - I was thinking of arriving in a large sailing dinghy, with the option to use oars if the wind (or harbour regulations) prevent sailing in close proximity to the railway terminal...

...so, attempting to approach that area in the dinghy, wouldn't require that I leave the 'yacht' somewhere else, because the dinghy is, or will be, my yacht.

I'd be happy to tie up or pull the dinghy out at Haslar Marina, having taken care to use the western side of the harbour entrance as advised...and my friends alighting from the train could use the Gosport Ferry, bringing them a short walk from the Haslar Marina too.

But I'm concerned about whatever risk users of the Gosport Ferry encounter...is it so bad, Andy?

On the other hand, Ripvan1's link to Camber Dock: http://bit.ly/TZhngT ...indicates it's the perfect place for a small boat to wait - £4.50 for up to 3 hours...and it wouldn't require use of the Gosport Ferry...and how hard can it be to get in there, on a flood tide?

Isn't it a matter of coming in the west side of the entrance, calling QHM for permission to cross to the Camber Dock, and doing so without lingering in the middle? It's only a couple of hundred metres; assuming I didn't try it on a busy ebb, is it really so worrying?

 

[alahol2]

...

Isn't it a matter of coming in the west side of the entrance, calling QHM for permission to cross to the Camber Dock, and doing so without lingering in the middle? It's only a couple of hundred metres; assuming I didn't try it on a busy ebb, is it really so worrying?

It could be easy or it could be VERY worrying. If you try to sail into Portsmouth with the prevailing SW breeze, you lose the breeze about 20 yards into the entrance because of the wind shadow from Fort Blockhouse. The tide will eventually push you through but now imagine a dozen sail and motor cruisers bearing down on you from both directions. I think even the Victory class dayboats now all use outboards to enter and leave the harbour. If you try it mid-week, the entrance could be empty and not pose a problem at all. The Camber would be fine if you can get over there without too much problem. You could go well north of Ballast pile, cross the harbour (no need for permission) then sail down the eastern side to get into the Camber.

Personally I would beg, borrow or steal a small outboard rather than try to row any where near the entrance to the harbour.
Good luck

PS forgot to mention, if the Pilot boat enters or leaves whilst you are in the entrance make sure you've got big bailers

 

[Seajet]

So many intelligent, informed-sounding recommendations and warnings here, I feel I mayn't have been specific enough.

To those warning of traffic & currents representing serious risk to dinghies and boatmen - I was thinking of arriving in a large sailing dinghy, with the option to use oars if the wind (or harbour regulations) prevent sailing in close proximity to the railway terminal...

...so, attempting to approach that area in the dinghy, wouldn't require that I leave the 'yacht' somewhere else, because the dinghy is, or will be, my yacht.

I'd be happy to tie up or pull the dinghy out at Haslar Marina, having taken care to use the western side of the harbour entrance as advised...and my friends alighting from the train could use the Gosport Ferry, bringing them a short walk from the Haslar Marina too.

But I'm concerned about whatever risk users of the Gosport Ferry encounter...is it so bad, Andy?

On the other hand, Ripvan1's link to Camber Dock: http://bit.ly/TZhngT ...indicates it's the perfect place for a small boat to wait - £4.50 for up to 3 hours...and it wouldn't require use of the Gosport Ferry...and how hard can it be to get in there, on a flood tide?

Isn't it a matter of coming in the west side of the entrance, calling QHM for permission to cross to the Camber Dock, and doing so without lingering in the middle? It's only a couple of hundred metres; assuming I didn't try it on a busy ebb, is it really so worrying?

Dan,

assuming all you mention re permission etc, my real concern would be the wind shadow if trying to sail into the Camber; it's narrow with a lot of high walls and buildings, and while I like to think I could sail something like an Osprey anywhere anytime, I don't fancy my chances at this one !

Something like a 2hp outboard on the end would make the world of difference, a handheld VHF on 11 would be a 'nice to have' too.

Sailing up to the hard you mention would be relatively simple but as others say it's grot !

I wouldn't want to leave a boat I was fond of too long on that hard, but it's pot luck, she'd probably be OK.

Incidentally in the 'Alexander Kent' and 'Douglas Reeman' books ( same author ) the Keppel hotel there gets a few mentions; my Dad has photo's of the area when it was heavily bombed in early WWII, luckily he was only visiting, based in Bembridge IOW.

As for the Gosport ferry, same goes; you'll probably be alright even at 23:30, but if unlucky one is really unlucky !

Then again try the briefest shopping trip or going for a meal around Gunwharf and you'll feel like you've been mugged anyway...

 

[l'escargot]

?..But I'm concerned about whatever risk users of the Gosport Ferry encounter...is it so bad, Andy?...

...Isn't it a matter of coming in the west side of the entrance, calling QHM for permission to cross to the Camber Dock, and doing so without lingering in the middle? It's only a couple of hundred metres; assuming I didn't try it on a busy ebb, is it really so worrying?

I wouldn't worry about either Gosport or the Gosport ferry these days. The only real factor you would need to take into account having traversed the harbour from Ballast Beacon is that both the Wightlink car ferry and fast cats use the entrance to the Camber.

 

[ripvan1]

Sailing into the camber with a paddle as only means of propulsion is foolhardy IMHO as seajet suggests get an outboard on - you may have to move promptly at some stage and with wind funnelling from all directions from except that you need and the tide and eddies b^ggering about as well, gawd knows where you'll end up.

What size is this boat anyway Dan - even this little fellow is using a motor

 

[Greenheart]

And so, it begins...

...perhaps even before I evolve out of dinghies (I've been dithering between the merits of Wayfarers & Ospreys), I must accept that in the modern world, there's next to nothing one can do in a busy tideway without some i/c auxilliary shunt to guarantee velocity...

...or I could just give Portsmouth a miss.

Maybe Waterloo to Wareham, instead? Only 2 1/2 hours, and there'd be the pleasant relative calm of Poole Harbour in which to acquaint my crew to the boat, before ant rough & tumble develops...

Thanks for all the input. Only had 6 hours sleep since I woke up on Christmas Eve...so, I'm off air till tomorrow.

 

[Topcat47]

Dan, this is for you. I've sailed in and out of Portsmouth Harbour in a Victory. I'd not cross the harbour in one. Same said for a Wayfarer, although many have. It's far too busy IMO but then again, I'm a geriatric with a strong sense of self preservation.

I'd recommend picking up from the landward side of the Gosport Ferry Pontoon, after your "guest" had crossed the harbour on the ferry from the Portsmouth side.

Just to satisfy my curiosity, from whence will you come when planning this excursion? If you're planning to launch elsewhere in the harbour, meet your guest by the slip you intend to use. Unless you're leaving from the IOW, I'd recommend this course of action anyway. The taxi from the station to the slip will take less time than your trip from the slip to the harbour entrance.

 

[sailor22]

For a crew pick up, why not drop into Haslar for a short stay. Arrange for your friends to get onto the Gospost Ferry (turn left out of Portsmouth Harbour Station and walk 50 yards to the Ferry). Get off the Ferry at Gosport, turn left, walk 100 yards to the East Gate of Haslar Marina, press the button and announce to the Marina Staff that they are joining boat XYZ, walk down the pontoon to the Visitor Pontoon Mile or Lima, and go sailing.

 

[onesea]

For a crew pick up, why not drop into Haslar for a short stay.

I do not know the charges in Hasler but I can think of one good reason $$$$$.

A couple of times I have picked people up or dropped them off around the Solent I have made it a kiss and go. If not it would cost just sort of a tenner ...

 

[Seajet]

Sailing into the camber with a paddle as only means of propulsion is foolhardy IMHO as seajet suggests get an outboard on - you may have to move promptly at some stage and with wind funnelling from all directions from except that you need and the tide and eddies b^ggering about as well, gawd knows where you'll end up.

What size is this boat anyway Dan - even this little fellow is using a motor

ripvan,

what a lovely boat in your photo !

Any idea of her name and story please ?