Slow and heavy steering - use a joystick?

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kcrane

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See earlier post, we tried a Prestige 46 and found the steering quite slow and heavy. It was explained that large flybridge boats without power steering will tend to be like this, especially at speed.

I am wondering about using the autopilot as a quasi-power steering by fitting Raymarine's joystick.

Clicky

Has anyone got any experience of doing this? If you read the joystick manual it looks like this is exactly what it is intended for.
 
It would work , I think, but for cruising, when you don't need the steering much anyway, or could just use auto pilot + and - buttons.

I would want to know how it worked, ie when you push the stick over , do you hold it to keep the turn and then push to straiten or does it return to ahead on release of stick,

mmmm Now I am intrigued to how it would work, if you to get one, can you write it up or can I come and have a play please.
 
The joystick operates in two modes, Normal proportional mode which is the
default and “bang-bang” mode. Both modes are described below. You can select
which mode will be used in Setting up your Joystick

Normal Proportional mode (default)
Proportional mode applies rudder in proportion to joystick movement. The further
the joystick is held over the greater the applied rudder

Bang-Bang mode
Bang-Bang (drive left – drive right) mode applies continuous rudder drive in the
direction of joystick movement. To improve control, the speed of rudder
movement changes with the angle of the lever: for maximum speed push the
lever hardover. If the lever is returned to the center position the rudder will remain
in its current position.
 
jimg is right, it seems a bit more sophisticated than I expected. You push a button on the top of the stick to engage manual mode, and the auto-pilot recognises it. The set-up screens on the pilot then have an option on the type of control you want. I think in proportional mode, when you release the stick it brings the rudders central again. Sounds quite good actually, which left me wondering why doesn't everyone have them (at £350 a pop)
 
[ QUOTE ]
You push a button on the top of the stick to engage manual mode, and the auto-pilot recognises it. The set-up screens on the pilot then have an option on the type of control you want

[/ QUOTE ]

By the time you've been thru that, you've hit whatever you were trying to avoid. As powerskipper says, the +/- buttons will do pretty much the same thing. My boat has heavy steering and, if I want to avoid anything I'll press the + or - buttons. 20 or 30 deg is usually enough
 
Yup, that works. Actually you can do it by hotwiring a sleipner (or other) b/thruster joystick too, if you don't want proportional functionality. Have done this on my brother's boat

In the case of this boat where you're wanting a j/stick to overcome heavy steering, imho the j/stick is the right answer if your problem is horrid steering at marina-manoeuvring speeds, but if it's in open sea you'd be much better fitting the bigger Raymarine a/pilot control head, the one with the click knob, and using that to steer. This does the same as the +/- 10 buttions only you can choose +/- any number, by dialing the knob

600.tn.md.jpg
 
Yes, I did wonder about that pilot head.
I think some other manufacturers have knobs rather than buttons as standard?

I've given everyone to believe the problem was heavy steering (and it was fairly heavy) but more of an issue was the slow reaction to the turn. I've had a few responses saying that in real life the slow response isn't a problem, you get used to it, it avoids throwing everyone over the side in mid-turn, you can slow then turn then speed up and sea-keeping is more important than handling! I didn't get any responses saying, yes, big flybridges are sluggish, give them a miss /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
Yes Simrad (fka Robertson) always had the knobs

The slow reaction could be high geaing (many turns lock to lock) which you'd expect without pas, and that might feel sluggish. Or it could be small/badly designed rudders. Or some feature of the hull/boat weight. Or some friction fault in the steering system? Etc

Sluggish! I dunno, I still dont get all this so called sporty handling stuff. If I jerk the wheel over in my sluggish motorhome it makes people fall over and spill drinks, so does that make the handling sharp? I dunno, cos i dont do it much!
 
And a feature on the Raymarine pilot that is rarely used in power boats.

If you press the -1 and -10 buttons at the same time, the pilot will turn sharply to port (of course +1 and +10 make the turn to starboard). The feature is inherited from the pilot used in a sailing boat as it initiates a "tack". Having read the manual, I suspect that the tack angle for a mobo is 100 degrees which is often too much. When the pilot is used in a sailing boat, the "tack angle" can be adjusted but I dont think you can adjust it when the pilot is set up for use on a mobo.

I have used it though - the feature is quite useful in pilotage when you want to make a sharp trun and want to concentrate on other things (navigation or avoiding something) - gives you time to think.
 
[ QUOTE ]
If you press the -1 and -10 buttons at the same time, the pilot will turn sharply to port

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats something I never knew. Thanks, I'll try that
 
Really? I'd rather check if such weird feature can be disabled, than actually using it....
 
[ QUOTE ]

Really? I'd rather check if such weird feature can be disabled, than actually using it....

[/ QUOTE ]
It isnt something you would hit by accident and is really quite useful when you know its there.

AFAIK everyone with a Raymarine pilot has the facility and you dont hear about it being engaged by accident.
 
Yup mike, that's on all raymarines and has been for years. I use it plenty. It's no different from pressing the 10deg key 4 or 5 times in quick succession, as you might do to make a turn coming out of your port or something. The display says "Tack" for about 10 seconds when you do it. As you say, it's near impossible to do by accident becuase you have to hold both the keys down for 3 seconds or so

New boat has ST70 and I dont know if they will do the same - hope so (haven't fitted them yet, too busy with higher priority items!)
 
[ QUOTE ]
It isnt something you would hit by accident

[/ QUOTE ]Never say never: once I had onboard some friends with a young child who would have been able to reset the whole boat, if she only had a <Alt><Ctrl><Del> feature somewhere!
 
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