Should boaters be armed?
- Thread starter Major Catastrophe
- Start date
capnsensible
Well-Known Member
Absolutely not.
Dyflin
Well-Known Member
No!
SVB
Well-Known Member
Again - Not a good idea.
As an aside - the article mentions a helicopter pad. How does this work on a yacht with all the rigging or are the 'library pics' of the wrong boat?
As an aside - the article mentions a helicopter pad. How does this work on a yacht with all the rigging or are the 'library pics' of the wrong boat?
Dyflin
Well-Known Member
B175Chris
Well-Known Member
Not the general boating public, but on a boat of that size and especially on a charter with a good amount of guests I would want at least a couple of shotguns on board in a secure place.
LittleShip
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/photos/04/Tiara/
[/ QUOTE ]
It could be fun getting the chopper off the deck with the boom in place /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Guns..................... hmmmmm! undecided. From a personal point of view I think I would like to be able to defend myself against the lowlife of the world. As for the general public...... no!
Tom
http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/photos/04/Tiara/
[/ QUOTE ]
It could be fun getting the chopper off the deck with the boom in place /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Guns..................... hmmmmm! undecided. From a personal point of view I think I would like to be able to defend myself against the lowlife of the world. As for the general public...... no!
Tom
D
Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
Why not? A yacht like this is capable of sailing into some remote places and I would be surprised if there were'nt some firearms stored aboard to deter pirates but, in this case, it sounds like there were taken by surprise or there were too many of them
This kind of piracy happens to big yachts occasionally in places like the Caribbean or Indian Ocean and, if I was the owner, I'd be training a couple of crew members to handle firearms
This kind of piracy happens to big yachts occasionally in places like the Caribbean or Indian Ocean and, if I was the owner, I'd be training a couple of crew members to handle firearms
Nautorius
Well-Known Member
Wow,
No, I do not think we should arm ourselvres unless we are willing to use the weapon and have a weapon used on us.
Paul
/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
No, I do not think we should arm ourselvres unless we are willing to use the weapon and have a weapon used on us.
Paul
/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Nautical
Well-Known Member
Funny how certain mega yachts would never be considered as easy pickings for pirates, imagine trying to board a certain Russian's yacht, I guess they maybe a little out gunned, can just picture it, some low life's board from a rubber boat weilding pistols and a bandy ole AK, ...."give us your money" to be met with about a dozen ex Russian special forces bods loaded to the hilt with the latest in shoot em to a million bits automatic weapons.
Still for us mere mortals mistake to carry a firerarm, chances are the minute they see that they would shoot first and ask questions later.
Still for us mere mortals mistake to carry a firerarm, chances are the minute they see that they would shoot first and ask questions later.
ccscott49
Well-Known Member
No! Definitely not!
BrendanS
Well-Known Member
It depends on who is onboard. If I had someone of your background, and probably another two or three onboard, I'm competent enough with firearms to scare the thieving buggers shitless.
If it was just me that had firearms competency, then no.
If it was just me that had firearms competency, then no.
oceanfroggie
Well-Known Member
Not a good idea, more likely to get shot!
Neddie_Seagoon
Well-Known Member
Absolutely they should if they choose. But they also need to be able to judge when to open the armoury and when to play submissive. Some of the replies above indicate a lack of confidence in using weapons, and for those people the answer must be no, ' coz if you're going to bring weapons into play you need confidence and conviction. For the professional charter skipper of an obviously wealthy vessel it ought to be a no-brainer - carry arms, become competent with them, and be prepared to use them in defence of guests and crew in the very unlikely event that it is necessary.
Unfortunately the UK gov't doesn't look kindly on boaters keeping an SMG on board, even though there is a legal entitlement to do so on ocean-going boats, and many other states don't like you sailing into their harbours carrying arms, so it is a bit inconvenient really, very difficult for the UK based long-distance cruiser who wants to venture into Eastern waters, and rather silly. There are known piracy hotspots out there, arms are sometimes part of a solution, and gov'ts ought to be able to understand that. As it is, I'm not at all sure that cruisers should be venturing into them unless they are prepared for the worst - most of them would have more sense than to venture in to hotspots on land (without adequate preparation and protection), why does being at sea make any difference?
Unfortunately the UK gov't doesn't look kindly on boaters keeping an SMG on board, even though there is a legal entitlement to do so on ocean-going boats, and many other states don't like you sailing into their harbours carrying arms, so it is a bit inconvenient really, very difficult for the UK based long-distance cruiser who wants to venture into Eastern waters, and rather silly. There are known piracy hotspots out there, arms are sometimes part of a solution, and gov'ts ought to be able to understand that. As it is, I'm not at all sure that cruisers should be venturing into them unless they are prepared for the worst - most of them would have more sense than to venture in to hotspots on land (without adequate preparation and protection), why does being at sea make any difference?
nonitoo
Well-Known Member
Don't forget that the ranks of the ungodly would be very likely to be much more practised in the use of firearms than the cruising boater - not only that, but there will probably be many more of them than you and your crew.
While there is a natural gut feeling that being armed will provide protection this is likely to be an dangerous illusion. Unless you are trained in the use of firearms and, more importantly, be willing to actually use them then they are a waste of time.
Basically, if you find yourself in the position where you feel the need to produce the weapon then you must use it, pointing it at the bulk of the opponent and firing repeatedly until he falls. None of this 'hands up or I fire' nonsense. That would merely result in your being disarmed and damaged.
I doubt if many people would be able or willing to behave in such a way.
Tom
While there is a natural gut feeling that being armed will provide protection this is likely to be an dangerous illusion. Unless you are trained in the use of firearms and, more importantly, be willing to actually use them then they are a waste of time.
Basically, if you find yourself in the position where you feel the need to produce the weapon then you must use it, pointing it at the bulk of the opponent and firing repeatedly until he falls. None of this 'hands up or I fire' nonsense. That would merely result in your being disarmed and damaged.
I doubt if many people would be able or willing to behave in such a way.
Tom
No Regrets
Well-Known Member
The only possible answer, of course, is that being armed will certainly help some Mariners, and hurt, or kill, some too.
If vessles all carried arms as a matter of course, then the Pirates would simply adopt differing tactics, such as turning up with heavily armed Steel vessels, shotting the boat and occupants up first, and ransacking/ sinking the remains.
There would be no way they would allow people to get away, in case they were harmed, and who can blame them!
Arming yourselves would be just fine as long as you had a permanent radar watch, longer range guns and some kind of armour.
The best, in fact only form of defence is to avoid any potentially bad places in the first place...
If vessles all carried arms as a matter of course, then the Pirates would simply adopt differing tactics, such as turning up with heavily armed Steel vessels, shotting the boat and occupants up first, and ransacking/ sinking the remains.
There would be no way they would allow people to get away, in case they were harmed, and who can blame them!
Arming yourselves would be just fine as long as you had a permanent radar watch, longer range guns and some kind of armour.
The best, in fact only form of defence is to avoid any potentially bad places in the first place...
Neddie_Seagoon
Well-Known Member
UK National Service ceased in 1960, so there is a good chance that a retired UK cruiser went through it and was taught to "shoot". Obviously younger generations don't have that advantage.
I think you'll be surprised at how little shooting the Ungodly get to do, it's a noisy business and not one that can be conveniently practiced if one is on the wrong side of the law. Also getting ammo can be quite tiresome. Obviously the pirates operating out of Somalia etc. are not so hamstrung as those working out of Corsica or Sicily. In the UK the bad guys really don't get much practice, ask an armed Policeman - most gun-toting scrotes can't shoot for tuppence.
As for whether one should use a weapon or not - it has to be down to the individual and the circumstances. There is no point in asking to be shot if you're not under threat of real violence anyway. I simply think that the option to carry and use weapons for defence should be should be unhindered for those law-abiding souls who so choose.
I think you'll be surprised at how little shooting the Ungodly get to do, it's a noisy business and not one that can be conveniently practiced if one is on the wrong side of the law. Also getting ammo can be quite tiresome. Obviously the pirates operating out of Somalia etc. are not so hamstrung as those working out of Corsica or Sicily. In the UK the bad guys really don't get much practice, ask an armed Policeman - most gun-toting scrotes can't shoot for tuppence.
As for whether one should use a weapon or not - it has to be down to the individual and the circumstances. There is no point in asking to be shot if you're not under threat of real violence anyway. I simply think that the option to carry and use weapons for defence should be should be unhindered for those law-abiding souls who so choose.
jfm
Well-Known Member
Yup it's been all over the news here in France Major. Pretty shocking. I've been on Tiara, beautiful boat. Just amazing to hear of this happening in Corsica. no-one would think of being armed down here; must hvae been such a surprise (as well as an ordeal) for the guests and crew
Dave_Snelson
Well-Known Member
Hmm - hopefully not a sign of things to come. There is a cruising yachtsman's web site NOONSITE that is a useful repository of info including piracy. Don't think it features the med though /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
On the question of arms - yes if you can use them competently. Firing a pistol is not like in the movies. The 3 weapons I learned on in a firing range were Tanfoglio 9mm combat pistol a Ruger 44 magnum (real Dirty Harry stuff) and a Sig-Sauer. Different weapons with one thing in common - the kick back. Break yer blimmin wrist they will.
On the question of arms - yes if you can use them competently. Firing a pistol is not like in the movies. The 3 weapons I learned on in a firing range were Tanfoglio 9mm combat pistol a Ruger 44 magnum (real Dirty Harry stuff) and a Sig-Sauer. Different weapons with one thing in common - the kick back. Break yer blimmin wrist they will.
Fire99
Well-Known Member
Hi All,
Well from my perspective its not too clear-cut. I can certainly understand those who say no to guns since i guess 'Violence breeds Violence' springs to mind and i have to agree that if every private vessel carried guns then it could get very messy..
There are some crazy people out there and it would be naive to assume none of those types own boats.
On lighter note, judging how heated it sometimes gets between some 'raggies' and 'stinkes' we could see a return of 'pistols at dawn' /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
On the other side of the coin to the original argument, i don't think we can bury our heads in the sand and ignore the possibly increasing threat of armed piracy in more mainstream areas.
People need to feel safe on their boats and if someone comes onboard armed then i would be very concerned that my only defence would be to hope the 'attacker' had a conscience..
I know i personally would feel safer armed in some territories and IMO would be sensible enough to know when to bring out the gun and when to keep it locked away.. However i could be in a minority..
As i say i honestly don't think the answer is a simple one.
Well from my perspective its not too clear-cut. I can certainly understand those who say no to guns since i guess 'Violence breeds Violence' springs to mind and i have to agree that if every private vessel carried guns then it could get very messy..
There are some crazy people out there and it would be naive to assume none of those types own boats.
On lighter note, judging how heated it sometimes gets between some 'raggies' and 'stinkes' we could see a return of 'pistols at dawn' /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
On the other side of the coin to the original argument, i don't think we can bury our heads in the sand and ignore the possibly increasing threat of armed piracy in more mainstream areas.
People need to feel safe on their boats and if someone comes onboard armed then i would be very concerned that my only defence would be to hope the 'attacker' had a conscience..
I know i personally would feel safer armed in some territories and IMO would be sensible enough to know when to bring out the gun and when to keep it locked away.. However i could be in a minority..
As i say i honestly don't think the answer is a simple one.
