Sheet arrangement for cruising chute

[ithet]

I have been doing some reading to improve our technique because on the few occasions we have used our chute we have not found it that easy to gybe.
The YBM article by John Goode says to run the lazy sheet outside everything and to gybe the chute by flying it out forward of the bow. This method was demonstrated at the boatshow a few years ago. When I have tried this method the chute collapses onto the forestay.
The RYA website, however, suggests runing the lazy sheet between the forestay and tack line so the the chute is gybed by pulling the clew behind the tack. http://www.rya.org.uk/cruising/handling-sail/Pages/Asymmetricschutesandgennekers.aspx

Does anyone have comparitive experience of these methods and which is best? Perhaps it depends on wind conditions?

I am talking about a cruising chute on a masthead cruising yacht with the tack line from the bow roller. I realise that many drop or use the stuffer to gybe, but I am interested in the best sheet setup to keep it flying.

 

[DerekBreth]

We have done both extensively and outside works much better for us. Only reason we used to gybe inside was that the sheets were too short for gybing outside on the last boat. With the right synchronisation between turning, easing and sheeting in, the chute barely collapses, it flies out forward then just re fills on the other gybe.

An afternoon of practice should sort it for you.... Good luck.

 

[Ian_Edwards]

+1 for that, you just have to make sure that the new Lazy sheet doesn't go under the bow, this means you have to control the new lazy sheet as it goes around the outside of the chute, too slack and it drops over the bow, too tight and it stop the chute being trimmed on the new gybe.

 

[srah1953]

I've read a suggestion that if you pull in the main amidships, the boat speed will fall off and the apparent wind increase, with the result that the chute will fly out forward. Worth a try.

 

[lw395]

1) You cannot keep an asymmetric flying through the gybe.
It is simply not like a symmetric kite where it's possible for the kite not to collapse at any point of the gybe.
There is always a point where the leech has to either go through the wind astern of the luff, or if gybing with the sheets outside, the kite is not filled in any useful sense it is flying like a flag.
2) All dinghies with asy's have the sheets inside.
But on a yacht, with no bowsprit, you have drag the body of the sail through quite a small gap between the luff of the kite and the luff of the genoa.
You can make that easier by dumping a few feet of halyard. Or perhaps better, ease the tack line a good amount....
3) Gybing with the sheets outside risks sailing over the sheet.
It might be a good method for some yachts though, if it's hard to get the body of the sail across, and the pulpit and tack strop arrangement make it unlikely that you will sail over the sheet.

4) In light airs, just have one sheet connected, manually take it around the forestay on a dead run, the loads 'should' be low....

A big difference with dinghies is that dinghies will go fast enough that the apparent wind is very low at the point of gybing, or even from ahead.

With either method, the sheets do need to be long for it to work well...

 

[DerekBreth]

You are quite correct, the kite does fly like a flag for a second, but when gybing inside it can often rag for a while and then snap full, whereas gybing outside it seems to be far smoother and has less tendency to fill with a bang. Fortunately we have never sailed over the sheets, as the kite flies forward it seems to pick them up, however if the new sheet has been taken up too fast it has occasionally caught around the anchor which can ba a pain!

 

[Andrew G]

In the good old days, sailing an 18' Jubilee, the common practice (ie not just our boat) was to allow the kite to fly out the bow and to coil the sheet and through throw it around the bow so that the aft crew could retrieve it from the water. The slight drag helped re-set it on the next course and it never went under the boat. Two provisos 1) we could reach the water easily - on a bigger boat you'd need a hook, 2) No motor!
(On my current boat I use the symetric if on a dead run - much easier to jybe (I'm single handed)). Andrew

 

[flaming]

On the 109s I've sailed (A-Sail off a pole) it's inside gybing until it's blowing hard enough for everyone to be a little scared, then outside gybing.

In a cruising boat I'd probably be inclined to make the switch earlier, just because of the space between the forestay and kite being that much smaller as you don't have a pole and have a tighter luff.

You do have to drive the boat smoothly into the gybe, easing the sheet all the way, then pull hard and fast on the new sheet in either case. Gyibing it with the same amount of care as you might a genoa won't work, nor will just throwing the wheel over.

 

[lpdsn]

If you're tacking the cruising chute to the bow roller I'd go for an outside gybe by preference as there won't be much space for'd of the forestay for an inside gybe. If you have a furling genny that'll give more friction to the kite being pulled through than the tuff-luff on a racer.

Sounds like you might be through the gybe before the chute is far enough forward if you're wrapping it around the forestay.

You need to drag the old sheet forward. When racing with an asymetric we usually have a crew member hauling it forward whilst the trimmer hauls on the new sheet. Usually a safe bet to say cruisers have more friction in the system than racers, so this is likely to be even more important for you.

Lead the lazy sheet around inside the pulpit when not in use to stop it going over the bow. I've even raced on a boat that had a stiff little 'shelf' sewn into the luff of the kite so the lazy sheet could be hung on it. Don't know the proper sailmaker's term.

 

[ithet]

Lots of help here thanks. Will try and have a play soon. Seems that outside sheeting is the consensus, together with careful timing and sheet handling.