Sealine for sale again

  • Thread starter Thread starter Deleted User YDKXO
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Feel so sad about the news, especially for the people at Kidderminster. The SC29 gave us a great start to boating.

So far I don't think anyone has mentioned what effect the decision to end the relationship with Ancasta might have had on new boat sales.

Let's hope the administrators can keep some part of the business going.
 
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rubberduck said:
I would agree with the comment on red diesel. It has, in my opinion, taken a lot of people, potential Sealine people, out of the market. Another triumph for our masters & the EU twot's.
As for those on here who said it would make no difference, you now have a perfect storm. Prohibitive running costs & difficulty finding anyone with enough money to get started in the 1st place.
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I dont think anyone buying a £250k+ new boat is going to be over worried about fuel costing 20p more a litre.
Add to that, EU only set a minimum price for "red" and define its use, which seems broadly fair enough. The fact that in the UK we load massive tax onto fuel isnt really EU fault.
I think I read in MBM this month that in Spain fuel was about £1.10, for example.
 
petem said:
It's not just red diesel and a poor economy (restrictive lending for businesses and consumers), but **** weather last year and the cost of having to display at two uk boat shows (one of which being held at the back of beyond for much of the uk) which have caused this.

Bit of a perfect storm really.
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It is lots of things, remember that around 80% of Sealine production was export in the 90's, 20 boats a month would be going to Germany, these markets changed, then there was the UK problems on top.

Brian
 
halcyon said:
It is lots of things, remember that around 80% of Sealine production was export in the 90's, 20 boats a month would be going to Germany, these markets changed, then there was the UK problems on top.
Brian
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The constant "churn" in the dealer arrangements didn't help, either.
 
I think Sealine don't have the strength of brand to compete head on with SS, Princess, Fairline or the big Italian yards, especially on larger boats, and they're not cheap enough to compete with the new entrants, Jeanneau, Beneteau, Bavaria etc. I think they probably recognised this some time ago, and made the brave move to try something different with the marmite styling, but I guess it just hasn't had broad enough appeal across the range.

Very sad, like many on here I've also enjoyed owning a Sealine in the past. It's not all bad news for the employees though. I own a manufacturing business in the midlands, and we're finding it very hard to get skilled people, so I suspect most of the Sealine staff will be able to find other work fairly quickly, in fact I wouldn't be surprised if we end up hiring some.
 
This is a very sad time, especially for the staff of Sealine, and those impacted as a consequence. Sealine has made some fantastic boats in its time, and for me currently has 2 best in class, the SC35 and F42. Kidderminster is not the best place to build sea and coastal boats, and I'm sure the location inhibited further hull growth, which clearly has not helped them to compete with Fair/Prin, but over the past couple of years, the weakness of sterling must surely have helped to compete with Bav/Jean/Ben.
This is a really difficult time to sell any boats, and I wonder if the decision to go their own way on the south coast has been the final nail in the coffin?
 
gjgm said:
I dont think anyone buying a £250k+ new boat is going to be over worried about fuel costing 20p more a litre.
Add to that, EU only set a minimum price for "red" and define its use, which seems broadly fair enough. The fact that in the UK we load massive tax onto fuel isnt really EU fault.
I think I read in MBM this month that in Spain fuel was about £1.10, for example.
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I bought a boat worth a lot more than £250k, & apparently am in the top few percent of UK earners. If I was looking now to get into boating, I would think a lot harder.
 
Great shame for all the staff at Sealine, but also for us suppliers who will now have to fight for our money. Yet another after Northshore, and I suspect probably not the last this year.
Sealine was for us, fortunately, a small customer and had historically been pretty poor at paying bills. They also had quite a high quality standard but wanted to pay bottom drawer prices, a tough customer to serve!
We used to do all of their fuel tanks but when Brunswick brought them they moved production to Hungary, Brunswick's instructions. The decision caused the guys at the factory loads of problems with quality and deliveries but ultimately was cheaper I guess.
 
I think the Bavaria Impact has been underestimated. When bavs moved into Sealine Territory and Price range they picked up the German buyers. Then the UK dealers (Ancaster) took them on. Net effect was that Bavaria were matching quality and cost...then they started sorting out their design. Sealine clearly could not compete. Hopefully the key moulds will be bought and put back in use, maybe it would make sense for Princess/SS to take on the SC35 and SC380 as it is all tooled up and has development costs sunk already. The Sealine legacy will live on regardless as they are great boats and good value.
 
rubberduck said:
I bought a boat worth a lot more than £250k, & apparently am in the top few percent of UK earners. If I was looking now to get into boating, I would think a lot harder.
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Because of fuel costing 20p more, or a whole host of other reasons? I can understand the whole host, but not the 20p a litre. Still, I am not you ;)
Surely the fuel part is a grand or two only for say 40ft. That's just scatter cushions, isnt it, on a new boat?
 
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gjgm said:
Because of fuel costing 20p more, or a whole host of other reasons? I can understand the whole host, but not the 20p a litre. Still, I am not you ;)
Surely the fuel part is a grand or two only for say 40ft. That's just scatter cushions, isnt it, on a new boat?
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I agree. Fuel is a relatively small part of the running costs. Depreciation, mooring, maintenance are the top 3.
 
gjgm said:
I dont think anyone buying a £250k+ new boat is going to be over worried about fuel costing 20p more a litre.
Add to that, EU only set a minimum price for "red" and define its use, which seems broadly fair enough. The fact that in the UK we load massive tax onto fuel isnt really EU fault.
I think I read in MBM this month that in Spain fuel was about £1.10, for example.
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ALL the power boat owners I know are VERY aware of the price of fuel and it does affect the way they use - or more properly don't use their boats. And they are in the top 2% of earners in the country. The issue has been growing since red started to climb from around 30p a litre. For example a good pal of mine would spend more on fuel to visit the fuel pontoon than I would spend in a season in my rag boat. They resent every penny spent on fuel, most of them have sold up and don't do boating in the UK. The story is not much different in Italy Greece and Turkey, fuel in Turkey for example is around £1.54 a litre and even the "big boys" struggle to keep their engines running. Add to that the competition from the Italian yards and trading has been difficult for too many years. Lets face it a quick sortie into the net reveals some beautiful second hand powerboats at sub £100,000, one guy I know out here (the med) just sold an 80 footer for 80,000 Euros - he spent more than that on it last year in maintenance alone the new owner has an incredible bargain. With that backdrop who would want to make new boats?
 
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Marsupial said:
ALL the power boat owners I know are VERY aware of the price of fuel and it does affect the way they use - or more properly don't use their boats. And they are in the top 2% of earners in the country. The issue has been growing since red started to climb from around 30p a litre. For example a good pal of mine would spend more on fuel to visit the fuel pontoon than I would spend in a season in my rag boat. They resent every penny spent on fuel, most of them have sold up and don't do boating in the UK. The story is not much different in Italy Greece and Turkey, fuel in Turkey for example is around £1.54 a litre and even the "big boys" struggle to keep their engines running. Add to that the competition from the Italian yards and trading has been difficult for too many years. Lets face it a quick sortie into the net reveals some beautiful second hand powerboats at sub £100,000, one guy I know out here (the med) just sold an 80 footer for 80,000 Euros - he spent more than that on it last year in maintenance alone the new owner has an incredible bargain. With that backdrop who would want to make new boats?
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Very well put.
 
gjgm said:
Because of fuel costing 20p more, or a whole host of other reasons? I can understand the whole host, but not the 20p a litre. Still, I am not you ;)
Surely the fuel part is a grand or two only for say 40ft. That's just scatter cushions, isnt it, on a new boat?
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If it was only 20p I would agree. I have only been boating for three boats & if I recall correctly it has almost doubled. I have no other reasons, & have written the value of the boat off in my head at least, & consider myself fortunate to be able to do so. I would not buy another.The marine industry is just too shaky.
 
Marsupial said:
ALL the power boat owners I know are VERY aware of the price of fuel and it does affect the way they use - or more properly don't use their boats. And they are in the top 2% of earners in the country. The issue has been growing since red started to climb from around 30p a litre. For example a good pal of mine would spend more on fuel to visit the fuel pontoon than I would spend in a season in my rag boat. They resent every penny spent on fuel, most of them have sold up and don't do boating in the UK. The story is not much different in Italy Greece and Turkey, fuel in Turkey for example is around £1.54 a litre and even the "big boys" struggle to keep their engines running. Add to that the competition from the Italian yards and trading has been difficult for too many years. Lets face it a quick sortie into the net reveals some beautiful second hand powerboats at sub £100,000, one guy I know out here (the med) just sold an 80 footer for 80,000 Euros - he spent more than that on it last year in maintenance alone the new owner has an incredible bargain. With that backdrop who would want to make new boats?
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The comment was about red diesel, which I took to be in reference to the 60/40 split.
Ok, if we want to talk about it was a lot cheaper at 30p a litre... but I still say someone buying a new Sealine isn't going to decide not to buy one because fuel is 1.10.
How many mobo owners spend more on fuel than on their berth in the UK? Very few I think.
The issue is not the extra 20p the EU "charged" us, is my point.
I don't doubt that there are a lot of mobos owners who find the increase from 30p to 110p a killer, but then look at your domestic electricity bill, or your car fuel bill, or your food bill...it has all shot up.. and you really cant think 30p a litre to run a guzzling mobo is a reality.
The collapse in mobo prices isn't to due with fuel.. it is to do with the sh*te state of the EU/Uk economy where ,now, too many people cant see the point in throwing hundreds of grand down the drain on a boat. A few years ago, who cared, or who perhaps, who expected to lose it.
Fuel isn't the driver, is my point. Confidence, perhaps.
 
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It's not good to hear about a business failing. From what I understand the Sealine fan base is in the 35ft region where new boat buying is more value driven than elsewhere. There are notable features in the Sealine genre otherwise unavailable, space and appearance, both without peer. Providing costs are managed (boat shows are mad, the fan base will appreciate the free shows that are rightly gaining in popularity, it's good to share common ground) I'd be confident that showroom as already present and a boutique manufacturing operation could be hewn from the core. Keep it simple, special and British and something to value as a result. Bring it on, now who is up for it??
 
petem said:
Hopefully more like "BMW Mini" than "MG Rover".
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If you can crack that one, were into a fortune. How you convince people to buy a car based on a old 1990 Rover design for 50% more than the later model from Rover.

Sealine sorted in one stoke.

Brian
 
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