Scapa Flow - ponunciation - Scappa or Scarpa

[dylanwinter]

Just working on the script for ktl 8 pt 8 - covering the journey from Kirkwall to Scapa Flow

I have heard it pronounced both ways

enlightenment sought

D

 

[Lyndsey Doyle]

Good evening, it's scarper, as in the cockney rhyming slang, Scapa Flow = go. Another one in that neck of the woods is Cape Wrath, it rhymes with cape moth, broth, goth or cloth. Enjoy the sunshine, LD.

 

[FWB]

This is good !
http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/pronunciation/english/scapa-flow
Speaks it out to you.

 

[pagoda]

This is good !
http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/pronunciation/english/scapa-flow
Speaks it out to you.

My uncle and grandfather spent all WW2 at Scapa. Never mentioned anybody adding an "R"???
Son lives in Kirkwall and says nobody local adds the "R"

It's a strange south of the border -ism I reckon.....

 

[duncan99210]

Personally, I prefer Highland Park to Scapa but that a matter of preference. By the time I've had a few, pronunciation doesn't matter too much.

 

[dylanwinter]

This is good !
http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/pronunciation/english/scapa-flow
Speaks it out to you.

thanks for that

one of the problems with this journey is getting the names right

because in some cases there is no right

locals might call a place one way - outsiders another

if I went up the Seine to Paris and pronounced it Parree people would think I am bonkers

I come from Holloway in London - the locals pronounce it with a glottal stop instead of an H

D

in the end I went with scarpa

https://vimeo.com/152876354

 

[FWB]

I would have bet some one else's money it was scapa. You lives n learns.

 

[NormanS]

It's called an intrusive r, and is practiced by sassenachs who know no better.

People who know, pronounce it as it is spelled. Simple.

 

[dylanwinter]

I would have bet some one else's money it was scapa. You lives n learns.

http://mattcaulfield.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/abraham-lincoln-some-of-the-people.jpg

 

[NorthUp]

It's called an intrusive r, and is practiced by sassenachs who know no better.

People who know, pronounce it as it is spelled. Simple.

...is the correct answer.

 

[iain789]

Or if you want it set to music - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpN7gjrk91g

 

[NormanS]

Dylan, with your ponunciation (sic) please don't head out to the Monachs when you reach the West Coast, but it will be fine if you visit the island of Scarp. (Explanation): The group of islands out west of North Uist, known as the Monachs has no "r", but Scarp, west of Harris does have an " r".

 

[Tradewinds]

Hear it here -

http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/scapa-flow

 

[alan_d]

Good evening, it's scarper, as in the cockney rhyming slang, Scapa Flow = go. Another one in that neck of the woods is Cape Wrath, it rhymes with cape moth, broth, goth or cloth. Enjoy the sunshine, LD.

I would have to disagree with you on both counts. The intrusive southern R has already been dealt with. My wife, who comes from that part of the world, has always impressed on me that Cape Wrath is pronounced to rhyme with math, and differently from the wrath of God. Wikipedia agrees with her:

The name Cape Wrath is derived from Old Norse hvarf ("turning point"). In this context "Wrath" is pronounced /ˈræθ/ (to rhyme with "math"), in contrast to the ordinary English word "wrath", usually pronounced /ˈrɒθ/ in British English (to rhyme with "Goth"). Vikings are believed to have used the cape as a navigation point where they would turn their ships.

 

[Robert Wilson]

Good evening, it's scarper, as in the cockney rhyming slang, Scapa Flow = go. Another one in that neck of the woods is Cape Wrath, it rhymes with cape moth, broth, goth or cloth. Enjoy the sunshine, LD.

As far as I know it is not moth, but Kath.
As always, I stand to be corrected, but as I live up here, have sailed round it, and listen to others "in the same boat" so to speak, I take my cue from locals.

Apparently it takes its name from old Norse and means corner.

Bummer. Beaten to it!!
And I should have written "turning point". Bah!

 

[Neeves]

I had never heard it pronounced in any other way than it is spelt, why complicate it - the Scots are well known for being economical so why add an 'r' in the middle.

But it is interesting in that until, about 100 years ago no-one had ever heard of, nor cared about, Scapa Flow. The people who then made the decision to put it on the map and those who were based there, by and large, came from no-where near there - but they were the ones who would have 'popularised' the word. Though why they would pronounce it 'Scarpa' is a bit of a mystery - if anything 'Scaapa'

Interestingly there is another Scapa - namely Scapa plc. which was, I think, based out of Bolton and made paper making felts (they divested themselves of this and now make adhesive tapes). I only ever heard it, the company name, pronounced as it is spelt. I have no idea why it was called Scapa in the first place.

Jonathan

 

[dylanwinter]

I would have to disagree with you on both counts. The intrusive southern R has already been dealt with. My wife, who comes from that part of the world, has always impressed on me that Cape Wrath is pronounced to rhyme with math, and differently from the wrath of God. Wikipedia agrees with her:

my neighbours are northerners

they insist upon calling the town of Bath with a hard A

however, the locals call it Barth

then we have shrewsbury

I shall see how many people leave rude comments on the films

referring back to norsemen as evidence of pronunciation is interesting

what about these boats

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knarr

 

[dunedin]

Hear it here -

http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/scapa-flow

Not sure I would use an Oxford source to get the definitive pronunciation of Northern Scottish place names
Though seems to avoid the rogue r at least - and perhaps closer than cockney slang as an indication.

 

[FWB]

There was an interesting TV prog several years ago, possibly on an anniversary, about the sinking of the Royal Oak
http://www.scapaflowwrecks.com/wrecks/royal-oak/sinking.php
There was an interview with one of the able seamen survivors. He said that the officers were hated by the men and that they were told not to abandon ship even though they were on the upturned hull....something like that.
I believe that Churchill praised the bravery of the U-Boat Captain, Günther Prien, who I think was later killed in the war.

 

[Nikia]

I blame those bloody BBC newsreaders ?