Sailing under bare poles

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BlueSkyNick

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I have never been in a situation where no canvas was better than some.

Is it realistic to expect that you can steer some sort of course, or is it simply an uncontrolled drift until the weather improves?

Surely it must depend on sea state as well.

Discuss.
 
Once ended up under bare poles, trying desparately to slow down to meet up with a Spanish lifeboat off of Gran Canaria.

We ended up doing about 4 to 5 knots (in the wrong direction) under sprayhood alone and we had no steering, which was why we were waiting for a lifeboat, so I cannot comment on that bit of it. We certasinly did not feel in control, but the seas were quite big.
 
I've run under bare poles in my Gaff cutter about 80 miles N'West of Finisterre. She steered alright running down very big seas but in the early hours ran into the sea ahead. Frightened the life out of me, so I streamed 4x 18mm warps, just eyes in the ends, not in bights, which slowed her down, and I'm still here so it worked for me. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
We ran under bare poles from Cape Town to Saldahna Bay on South Africa's west coast. Initially we had over 60 knots of wind (the anenometer was pegged at 64knots, Cape Town airport registered gusts of 200 kph, 100knots) but later moderated and we were able to put up a storm jib which restored a sense of control.
Under bare poles we ran dead downwind, parallel to the coast. I tried to make her make a course slightly offshore but she wouldn't do it. This was very worrying because any windshift could make the coast a lee shore.
Anyway, under bare poles we had virtually no control and the course was not of our choosing - we had actually come from Saldahna Bay and were trying to make Hout Bay when the storm hit. We ended up back at Saldahna Bay the next morning! Boat speed varied wildly from a couple of knots up to hull speed in huge seas.
With a storm jib up we had better control.
 
You would expect to be able to steer 30-40° off the dead downwind direction. Attempting to get any closer to the wind could result in ending up beam on with no steerage way.

I have done 9 knots on a beam reach under bare pole - but it's no ordinary pole!
 
You can steer at least 45 degrees either side of downwind on most boats, but in the conditions you are likely to be doing it it is more likely you will want to be going near dead downwind. Try it in a Force 4-5....

Try everything else in a Force 4-5 too, like setting your storm jib etc.
 
When delivering boats I have ‘run’ under bare poles on a few occasions (3 times twice on deliveries and once on my own boat it is not to be recommended).

You could expect to have some steering when going down wind but not too much rounding up.

I favour using a storm jib to give some forward motion and therefore steering then trail warps or a drogue of some kind. It varies from boat to boat and also on the conditions.
 
I once did 8kn under bare poles (72' ketch) in a southerly gale in the Clyde. As I recall we were able to steer and maintain a heading through an arc of about 10-15 degrees either side of dead downwind.
 
Completely different- I've picked up mooring bouys under bare poles when practising picking up buoys in wind against tide situations, with no engine, where the genoa alone (even if partly furled) would give too much drive.. it works and yes you do have steerage.
 
No ordinary pole...that's a valid point because I suppose it's not only keel shape etc: but what you have aloft (without sails) that affects how the boat behaves. With a double fall main halyard, gaff halyard and ratlines port and starboard my boat carried so much windage aloft she would sail without canvas almost (usually when the wind was off the jetty when I was trying to get alongside).. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Done it quite a few times and you get a surprising amount of steerage. In a big boat with deep full keel and lots of masts and string, we were able to point at 90 degrees to the wind, not the same as tracking 90 degrees of course, but surprisingly good control.

The danger is that when it is really rough, a nasty wave can occasionally spin you round dangerously, so either a drogue or a storm jib or both is usually advisable!
 
I used to leave the pier and pick up my mooring provided the boat never had to come closer than 90 degrees to the wind. No need for engine or sails, but a very easily driven classic hull. Once the wind was forward of the beam she would stop.

Have run down wind at 3 or 4 knots in 30+ knots of wind down Norwegian Fjords under bare poles and complete control.
Have yet to need to do so offshore though . . .
 
a corribee sails quite well under bare poles. I suspect most boats driven downwind will have control for a little while once they turn across the wind... and then the bow will stall/bear away again.
 
I have done it a few times and I think whether one has much steerage or not depends on the type of boat, the sea state and the direction of waves in relation to the wind.

Wide arsed light SAD racing boats will often sail pretty well around 120 degrees to the wind and be very steerable. The trick seems to be not to go too fast but to have the boat sufficiently under control to avoid a pitch pole. But too many warps seem to leave the boat in for a hell of a bashing.

A racing cat can make 15kts downwind under bare poles in say 40 - 50kts! I did 10+kts in the solent once in 55kts from the NW which produced a sea height mid solent of only 0.5-1m. Quite fun really but might have been more worrying trying to enter Cherbourg!
 
I tried to run under bare poles off Finisterre. Unfortunately the wind generator mounted aft would spin the boat round into wind when we got to the top of a wave.

I had a bit of headsail showing to keep the boat pointed downwind and towed a milk crate to keep the speed under control.

P
 
I think that perfectly illustrates the point that each boat must be settled on a case by case basis. The only generalization I would make is that the newer surfing hulls are better with a bit of speed and this gives much better steerage but reuires much more work.
 
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