Sailing qualities of Prout Quest 31?

[stibbles]

From stats, this boat seems to fit our requirements very well, but I haven't sailed one before and the broker selling an example we're looking at has (politely) declined a test sail.

I've sailed another cat and am convinced this type of boat is right for our needs, so please I am not wanting to set up another troll on the merits of 1 hull vs 2 (I've read all those before!), but could any forumites describe the sailing qualities of this boat (especially compared with other fairly small catamarans)?

I'm guessing/hoping: "not sparkling performance upwind, reasonably solid sea boat but with bridgedeck slam, lots of space but be careful not to overload it".

Also, any thoughts on advantages/disadvantages of tiller steering would be handy as there is another one out there with feature I hadn't previously considered and frankly find a bit off-putting, but that may be my ignorance!

 

[Scillypete]

The quest 31 is not a bad sailing boat, so long as you do not overload it otherwise it will take a really good breeze to get it to go. Very comfortable motion in most conditions, but will slam a lot when going to windward and yes it does sail to windward.
Ours had wheel steering (most others should have too) and there was no great feel through that. We had an emergency tiller which if used would be quite a heavyweight handful to manage for any length of time. Also the tiller would sweep the afterdeck which is a very useful space for allsorts otherwise.
Speedwise in moderate conditions don't expect much more than you would expect from a modern 32 foot mono, unless you are off the wind, with the wind off the quarter they will go and surf quite readily given a decent breeze. In fact the more wind the better when running.
As a rough guide for channel trips I wouls plan passages based on a 5 knot average.

you may or may not want to watch these:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvBed3OrVCk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB-aFLPHH38&feature=related

 

[snowleopard]

In general, Prouts perform like a reasonable mono of the same length, perhaps not so good on the wind but faster off, if you push it. The small main/big genoa setup is a bit of a s*d for short tacking but gives lots of safe power downwind. Their method of achieving some headroom in the bridgedeck cabin by trailing a nacelle in the water gives a nice low profile when seen from the side but introduces extra wetted surface with the concomitant drag. The sides of the nacelle slam in a cross sea which can be irritating but otherwise it is no great disadvantage.

I presume the one you are looking at has a central engine with steerable leg. They provide pretty good manoeuvrability, not as good as twin props but they are rarely seen in a boat of that size for reasons of space and weight.

You need to look carefully at the layout to decide if it is for you. A lot of Prouts I have seen have the chart table down, something I wouldn't like to live with. A quick dash to the chart table to check your pilotage becomes a bit of a drama - almost as bad as a mono

 

[fireball]

<snip> A quick dash to the chart table to check your pilotage becomes a bit of a drama - almost as bad as a mono

Well - if you didn't have to use your zimmer frame it would be quicker - try getting it built in like a mono!!

 

[smth448]

Don't you think its a bit strange that the Broker has declined a test sail? I would have thought he would be bending over backwards to make a sale in the current climate. I would think very carefully about the whole transaction if I were you. Perhaps I am just being too suspicious and cynical.

 

[stibbles]

you may or may not want to watch these:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvBed3OrVCk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB-aFLPHH38&feature=related

Ah, that's great, really enjoyed the vids. Got to see a bit of the motion and inspiration to see you cross the Atlantic on one.

Re: tiller - this one with a permanent tiller has a sort of frame around the 'sundeck'(?), so it looks like it might not sweep across the space. Did you emergency one just go directly from the rudders to a central point without any angles? Still I'm concerned even with the frame it would impinge on the space. Ideally I like to get my folder Seahopper dinghy on there for fun/tender. I think I really need to go and have a look at it to see how the cockpit/deck space works, but its about a 5 hour drive so will have to wait a bit.

 

[stibbles]

Don't you think its a bit strange that the Broker has declined a test sail? I would have thought he would be bending over backwards to make a sale in the current climate. I would think very carefully about the whole transaction if I were you. Perhaps I am just being too suspicious and cynical.

Yes, I was a bit surprised as I had a test sail in the one other big boat I've bought before, although that was not from a broker. The broker explained that it was impractical as the owner lived a very long way away (would you usually expect to owner to accompany?) Has that been other peoples' experience? Perhaps I came across as a timewaster/fender-kicker?

 

[stibbles]

I presume the one you are looking at has a central engine with steerable leg. They provide pretty good manoeuvrability, not as good as twin props but they are rarely seen in a boat of that size for reasons of space and weight.

Yes, both have this set up, which is not irrellevant for my plans to keep in it in a fast-flowing, tidal ditch (Fosdyke - no disrespect, meant, David). A twin engine cat has been recommended, but my budget would not open up many possibilities and others have said it is viable with caution (eg going in closer to the top of the tide).

 

[Scillypete]

Re: tiller - this one with a permanent tiller has a sort of frame around the 'sundeck'(?), so it looks like it might not sweep across the space. Did you emergency one just go directly from the rudders to a central point without any angles? Still I'm concerned even with the frame it would impinge on the space. Ideally I like to get my folder Seahopper dinghy on there for fun/tender. I think I really need to go and have a look at it to see how the cockpit/deck space works, but its about a 5 hour drive so will have to wait a bit.

Personally I would not bother to look at it. As a permanent set up it would be a nuisance, the tiller set up on these was there as a fallback should the wheel steering fail. The emergency tiller had a built in angle from the rudder head but even with a long lever arm it is surprisingly heavy going to steer with it for any length of time. It doesn't lend itself to comfortable use from the cockpit either. I would expect on the one you are referring to the tiller and frame will render the after deck useless except for a small area in the middle whilst at sea.

As for the broker saying no to a test sail try pestering him a bit more to set it up, I'm sure the owner (no matter how far away he lives) would be glad to do it if he thought there would be a chance of a sale from it. If its still a definite no, then I would suspect them of trying to hide something. One fault to look for in these is the main bulkhead was prone to warping and cracking in the vicinity of the aft cabin doorways, this should have been beefed up by now on most boats but there may be one or two where it has not been done.

 

[TQA]

No test sail = NO SALE

IMHO unless it is so cheap you can factor in some major work.

Make it clear to the broker that this is a deal breaker and get him to pass it on to the seller.

 

[MacMan]

Also, any thoughts on advantages/disadvantages of tiller steering would be handy as there is another one out there with feature I hadn't previously considered and frankly find a bit off-putting, but that may be my ignorance!

I have seen about five 31's (I have a 33 ) I have never seen tiller steering - never heard of one coming out of the factory like that - certainly investigate what this was for and why. Was she fitted out at DIY rather than the factory (can be good or bad) depending on quality of workmanship.

I think the comments you have recieved from other (steady, don't overload, slightly slower than same mono upwind possibly slightly faster down I would think would be about right)

 

[Mudisox]

Other cats in the same price range.

I wouldn't even bother to go and look at a boat if unable to test sail. The tiller steering sounds horendous, probably the reason to avoid the test sail experience.
Look at Commanche cats- similar performance but better layout, or a catalac if you can live with looking at it, and still feel its not a caravan afloat. [Not biased- my father had one.]

 

[Tranona]

The decision of a test sail is entirely with the owner and the broker takes his instructions.

Remember the boat is the other person's private property - he is not a secondhand car salesman desparately trying to shift stock. He is selling a boat on its merits, not on its ability to meet other peoples' needs - that is for them to decide.

Would you put your property at risk with a stranger? So if you do want to try the boat out (and not sure what you can find out in a brief sail that you don't already know) then the owner might want to protect his interest by requiring a professional skipper to be on board if he cannot be there himself.

 

[jonic]

Regarding the test sail. Make an offer subject to test sail and survey, pay the deposit and arrange for a professional skipper. (Check the boat is insured.)

Unlikely anything is being hidden. You would be surprised how many test sails are nothing more than an attempt at a free day's charter. Book four test sails a month and you will soon have a season of free sailing!

Making an offer and having a contract will show you are not just out for some free sailing. A test sail to check over a boat as part of a purchase contract is fine. Test sailing various models to see which one you like is something that should be done on a friends boat or a day charter, which is what the broker is probably trying to avoid on behalf of his client.

However if a test sail is refused even with a contract, a deposit and a skipper because the owner feels he lives too far away, you may consider someone more accommodating would be more deserving of the cheque.

I'm a broker and if it was a genuine deal breaker, would do my best to set it up the test sail.

Most brokerage sales do not have a test sail as the sailing characteristics are often well known and documented. A survey will then find any major faults or indicate if further investigation (such as a test sail) is required. Nearly all the test sails I have taken part in have been for brand new boats.

 

[stibbles]

Thanks for all those comments.

I am particularly grateful for jonic's suggestion about potentially making a test sail a condition of an offer. This seems like a very reasonable compromise on the buyer's part and I think I would wonder if this was not acceptable (not saying it hasn't been in my case - hasn't got that far yet!)

 

[fireball]

Thanks for all those comments.

I am particularly grateful for jonic's suggestion about potentially making a test sail a condition of an offer. This seems like a very reasonable compromise on the buyer's part and I think I would wonder if this was not acceptable (not saying it hasn't been in my case - hasn't got that far yet!)

I did a test sail on the first big boat we bought - was almost pointless in that there was no wind ... did get to see all the sails and test the engine - it was after a deposit was made - so they knew we were serious - and the boat was already in the water.

Didn't bother on the last boat we bought - she was out of the water and we would have to pay for craning both ways, commission and decommission of the engine - and we'd already sailed a similar boat - so happy with that side of things.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

had a Quest 33 for 7 years and would still have if if my wife were deciding. Its an excellent cruising boat and I would echo much of the performance comments of the others - maybe 15% on average (for passage planning) faster than a 32ft mono, excellent ride, good accommodation, reasonable build quality on the factory boats. Lovely boat at anchor, decent cockpit.

Wouldnt go near one with a tiller. The rudders arent balanced so the load on a tiller will be terrible. The hydraulic wheel steering is dead ( it has anti feedback valves) which is both a pain in reducing the enjoyment of helming and a boob in tacking cos you can just put the wheel over and leave it whilst you tend the sheets.

Windward performance is like a bilge keel yacht in flat water. In waves its a motor sailer to windward.

I like the drive leg and would not automatically chose twin engines in preference.

All in all a good cruising boat but not much fun to sail. A sailing motor caravan rather than a sports car.