Sailing - Cost per Mile?

awol

awol

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DAKA's recent query on whether sailing is really cheaper than power got me thinking again about how much my boat actually costs each year. My masochistic streak has me compiling a spreadsheet of spend, an activity I would counsel others against - it should also be password protected for matrimonial security!

Last year I ended up with a total cost of just over £2 per nm for a 2000+nm, 9 month season which included running costs - the marginal costs after the fixed and maintenance spend and including gas, diesel, marinas (o'nighters) - of 69p per nm. This year so far I am running at 73p per nm but that includes over 100 hours of running the donk due to a sad lack of wind up here.

So what? Well, apart from knowing how grateful my friends and crew should be, not a lot! However, I do know it is considerably less than it could be, more than I would like it to be and, unlike a mobo, the cost per nm goes down the more I use it.
 
Oooh, that's interesting our current bills for this year, inc haul out, moorings, insurance and fixing broken bits but excluding fuel and overnight fees for marinas are running at about £5000. Mileage so far about 50nm.

Erm, I make that about £100/mile at present. This season, I'm axpecting to do about 1000nm so about £5/mile excluding fuel and marina charges. I expect to fill the tank about 3 or 4 times at about £120 a pop so inc fuel. £6.20/mile

Now, I compare this with my, petrol driven, fishing boat. Costs this year excluding fuel about £2000. Have done abot 200nm so far. That's £10/mile ex fuel. I expect to do also about 1000 miles in the fishing boat at about £2.5 per mile fuel costs. So I'm looking at about £4.5 per mile about two thirds the cost of the yacht (and with no fish to eat at the end!) Mind you on those sums, I'd better off going to Waitrose for my fish.

I wish I'd never started these sums. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
I suggest you re-calibrate your log to read 100% more. Then you will reduce your cost per mile by half.

If I bought more or less nothing other than my mooring fees, haul out, antifoul and essential bits and bobs, it would still cost about £3000 a year. Divide that my number of times I manage to go sailing - maybe 20 times a year? £150 an outing, minimum.

Best not to do the calculations, really /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Well, it's a new to me boat, I've done not many mile in it yet, and spent a lot, so somewhere just under £1000/mile. I expect this to rapidly go done as the season progresses! (Can I add road miles? That would help a lot!) /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
It seems to me philosophically unsound to calculate the costs of a boat kept for pleasure on the basis of mileage. I would calculate the costs of my own indulgence on the basis of expenditure per day spent at, on, with the boat. Thus the happy 4 or 5 days spent in March stablising deteriorating plywood in the cabin coamings and reseating the windows (interspersed with the drinking of tea and watching others struggle with gearboxes) count equally with the same number of days spent last month drifting around in not much wind. The value to me of the experiences is similar and that way I can justify the money I am spending as much less than the cost of playing golf, or not much more than running a couple of motorcycles for pleasure.
 
Reality check.

If I wasn't on the boat spending money, SWMBO or darling daughter 'd be taking me out shopping.

Deducting the saving involved in not going shopping, brings my average cost per mile down to about -£2.57

/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Your title is wrong, it should read:

Sailing - investment per smile?

Answer, priceless. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
When I do calculate the cost of owning the boat I always do it on a "cost per day" rather than "cost per mile" basis.

Almost all the costs of the boat are pretty well fixed costs, the true marginal cost per mile under sail is minimal. Other costs such as transport to/from the boat, and overnight moorings are really per day costs.
 
Leaving aside the question of doing any calculations ...

why cost / mile? After all, your net mileage will probably be zero (most people hope to end up back where the started). Why not calculate cost / hour, cost / day, or cost / outing?

I think that would give a better figure for comparing against other activities. For example, you could legitimately compare it with spending weekends away. Say £5,000 / 10 weekends away = £500 / weekend. Could you do a weekend in Paris with your wife for that?

OTOH, it might just discourage you.
 
If answer is no, can't sell the boat anyway in the current environment, so carry on and enjoy it.
Last year we only used our boat once. Maths very easy, about £5,000 per day. Moral of the story, never work out how much it costs, and don't even mention it to SWMBO.
 
[ QUOTE ]
why cost / mile? After all, your net mileage will probably be zero (most people hope to end up back where the started). Why not calculate cost / hour, cost / day, or cost / outing?

I think that would give a better figure for comparing against other activities. For example, you could legitimately compare it with spending weekends away. Say £5,000 / 10 weekends away = £500 / weekend. Could you do a weekend in Paris with your wife for that?

[/ QUOTE ]

Why cost per mile? Mainly because the data is available easily and both are objective quantities. Cost per hour would require me to have logged hours; cost per day would require me to log days and find a way of equating a 120nm day with a trip round the bay; and cost per outing would again require me to log and count all "outings" and not all would be equal. Oh, and before you ask, I quite often do not log local meanders, races, sitting on the boat fettling, etc. but I do keep score of mileage and engine hours.

Philosophically, it is only a measurement not an attempt at a cost/benefit analysis. For that I would have to find some means of quantifying pleasure, peace of mind, pride, satisfaction, adrenaline rush and a lot more.

As for weekends with my wife in Paris - last one cost me a lot less than £500 and that included business class flights and a 5 star hotel! But then it was funded by some of the airmiles and hotel points won over years of gainful employment and was probably more pleasurable because of its relatively freebie nature.
 
[ QUOTE ]
When I do calculate the cost of owning the boat I always do it on a "cost per day" rather than "cost per mile" basis.

Almost all the costs of the boat are pretty well fixed costs, the true marginal cost per mile under sail is minimal. Other costs such as transport to/from the boat, and overnight moorings are really per day costs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cost per day is a much better indicator I find. It is even better if you also include the number of persons on board.
Went out last week three times with 6 on board each time.

At the end of the day I pay all the bills so the costs are whatever they are, but the payback is when you take your family and their kids out sailing, drop anchor in a secluded bay, have a swim off the back of the boat, a spot of lunch and a sail back. Especially when they ask when can we do it again.
 
Agree cost per day is a better indicator. For example go for a short sail, anchor at a lovely bay and take a leisurely lunch. Another sail in the afternoon, in total around 15 miles covered. Wonderful day.

Another day you go out and sail all day, clock up 60 miles, again a good day's sailing.

If you use cost per mile because of the large fixed costs involved it would appear that the second trip is much more cost effective per mile compared to the first. In reality the costs are similar and both days can give equal pleasure.
 
Again, another fascinating thread with lots of useful information. Thanks everyone.
I am trying to put together a projection of costs, to ascertain which direction I should take in terms of boat size and the like. Ie: What can I afford?

I have broken the costs down into two groups, being 1. Standing costs- ie. what it costs if I dont even go anywhere, which includes capital costs/amortisation/depreciation/return on capital or however you want to express it; plus insurance, berth and other such fixed costs. (In my personal case, as I am going to live on the boat, I have compared these to my present housing costs). With a non-liveaboard, these would probably best be expressed as costs per day of use. A worthy comparison here, is to compare your standing costs against the cost of a comparative charter boat. If your utilisation is low, then it can make financial sense to charter rather than own a boat.

Next, we have "2" which includes all the operating costs, fuel, wear and tare maintenance, marina berths when away and the like. It can make sense to express these as mileage costs.

When you add the two together, it is obvious that the more time you spend with the boat enjoying it, the lower the costs become proportionately.

As stated above, the only thing you can really compare these with as a value judgement, is what you would be spending doing something else you enjoy.

The moral of the story, is that the more time you spend enjoying your boat, the cheaper it gets.

"See you later darling. I'm just going down to the boat to save some more money"
 
Based on 3000 miles over two years, and counting in depreciation and capital costs (aka opportunity cost), around £10 per nm. Having worked that out I resolved never to do it again (work it out, that is), but it was a useful exercise because it has shown me that I cannot criticise the way other people spend their money from a position of strength.
 
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