Sail Drive seals

[AIDY]

Has anyone taken the plunge and chaged there saildrive seal by themselves ?

what were the costs involved for parts, and what sort of time should I allow for the boat to be out of the water.

I have no problem with doing the job myself, i love working on engines and replaced the head gasket a couple of months ago.

thanks for any info that you provide. I have a 2040 engine with 120 saildrive leg.

<hr width=100% size=1>/forums/images/icons/wink.gif <font color=blue> Regards Andy </font color=blue>

 

[Piere]

Sorry can't help you but i've got saildrive too.
Look at it an do a visual check every year and get freaked out at the prospect of a total failure. But there are so many of them out there, never heard of one failing yet .

Gonna watch this thread with great interest.

All I know is that it will cost at least £600 or more to have it done by professionals.
Don't think I'd like to do the job myself.


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[AIDY]

I have had quotes for about 1.5K labour. reckon on parts costing only 200 pounds.

<hr width=100% size=1>/forums/images/icons/wink.gif <font color=blue> Regards Andy </font color=blue>

 

[scarlett]

I did it about 12 years ago on a 120 leg with a MD5C. I undid the wrong nuts to the engine maybe but got it off in about 3 hours. I took it home and did the break between the two halves of leg on the kitchen floor. Put it back together in about half an hour under ideal conditions. The following day put the leg back on in about a couple of hours.

I did it in the middle of winter so it was a rotten cold job and wouldn't do it again if I had a choice. I have one on the latest boat, about 5 years old and have fitted a water alarm nearby and planning to leave the seal for as long as possible.

Not worrying about sinking as the boat is an Etap.

Cost less than £200 for parts.



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[JohnL]

Diaphragm Kit £132.38 from Keypart.com they are very helpfull.

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[EdEssery]

I'm doing mine this winter - Volvo 2001 and 120SB. I got the parts from Keypart. There's a good pictorial guide with the new seal and there were DIY articles in Sailing Today in July 2001 and PBO in March 98.

I spoke to a guy on the Volvo stand at SIBS and he told me the trick was to support the sail drive from underneath and make sure the the lip on the seal was correctly positioned under the curved bit of the clamping ring all round and not pinched by it. Somebody also told me that it can sometimes be difficult to separate the engine from the gearbox.

Where abouts are you? Perhaps we can compare notes as we proceed. My boat is in Southampton.

Regards,

Ed

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[Rob_Webb]

Some insurance cos are a bit strict about replacement every 5-7 yrs (there should be a date stamp on the current one). And some are a bit edgy about non-professional replacements. So you might want to double-check in a roundabout way with your insurer what their position is?

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[AIDY]

Thanxs for the info. I had thought i should be able to do it in a couple of weekends, with bringing the leg home mid week to play with.

Spose this would be a good time to change the engine mounts too.

I have the sailing today article, hopefully it should be as straight forward as it says, there is a bit of info in the workshop manual as well.

wish me luck.

<hr width=100% size=1>/forums/images/icons/wink.gif <font color=blue> Regards Andy </font color=blue>

 

[boatmike]

If you are reasonably practical and clear regarding the procedure there is nothing to be afraid of and I am astounded at the labour costs quoted. Access is sometimes difficult. Boats are never built with maintenance in mind! I have replaced dozens of them myself though and would not expect a problem. If you are replacing engine mounts too and have access to a straight lift above the engine I would frankly not split gearbox and engine, I would lift the lot, replace the seal and mounts and put it down again. Thats undoubtedly how it was installed in the first place. A hire shop will have a garage type engine removal rig you can probably mount over the hatch if your boatyard want to charge you unreasonably for a crane. Saves all the grunting and puffing and time wasting of splitting the gearbox!
PM me if you have difficulties.

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[tristan]

I am an engineer for a VP main agent on the south coast.

These are not difficult to change, but are labour intensive, and heavy. The trick is to (hope for good access!) chock up the underside of the engine sump until the weight is just taken off the mounts by about 5-10mm (remove the 4 coach screws/10mm thread bolts holding the mount to the bearer - this is far easier than unscrewing the stud) then undo the 6 bolts holding the gearbox onto the adaptor plate (there is an electrical insulator between the large adaptor plate and the flywheel housing - you do not want to disturb this!) 17mm spanner for the head of these 6 bolts. With a friend, slide the engine forward about 100mm (4") to clear the saildrive spline. (A tip is to use some laminate coated wood under the sump to help it slide).

Then drain the gearbox oil - far easier at this stage (if your smart you will have read this and set it draining at the beginning). Remove the row of 13mm head screws that hold on the retaining plate, remove the rear engine mount, then manoever off the plate for de-rusting and painting (chances are it will need it).

You now need 2 people, some rear access in the engine area, and some rope to lower the saildrive over the side. Remove the outer gaiter (a new one comes in the kit) and discard. Lift up the saildrive until the propsahft contacts the hull, then tilt the saildrive aft until it is approx. 45 deg, it will then come right up through the hull.

IF YOU HAVE NO REAR ACCESS:
With the saildrive still in place on the seal, remove the anode, then using a 6mm allen key, undo the two screws holding the lower bearing carrier on, and remove the bearing carrier (it will need a tap to start moving). Tape over the prop shaft splines with sellotape to prevent catching on the seal and damaging them. Then pull out the propshaft complete with lower gear and store somewher immaculetely clean.
Tape a bin bag or two around the lower unit to prevent oil spills in the boat.
The saildrive will then withdraw vertically (necessary to some Bavaria owners)!
When refitting, don't be mean, use new o-rings, they flatten out over time and are only a quid or so each!

After the saildrive is in the boat, have a break and catch your breath! Then lift the unit up and lower it over the side on the rope. Finally check all the splines on the garbox and drive plate for wear.

The strip and assembly is fairly straight-forward, remember to wire-lock the screws in the centre, and don't use any sealant on the gasket(s), they are self sealing; and keep water, corrosion and gasket particles out of the internals.

The refit is the reversal of the removal, but allow a bit more time for aligning the splines (helps if said friend is under the boat, turning the propshaft with the drive in gear - it always rains at this stage by the way!) Then be methodical in refitting and tightening the parts removed, i have attended numerous "faults" to find it was a well-meaning owner rushing through a job to make the next tide, 10:30 bridge, drinks in the yacht club etc!!!

Good luck, PM me if you need any more help.

P.S - fill the gear oil last, from the bottom if you can, it makes it a little quicker and more accurate, and always, always replace this o-ring (even if it has only been tightened for 2 minutes) - Trust me this is not a lesson to learn the hard way - new sail drive due to water damage - £4500 approx. ouch!

Tristan.

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[AIDY]

Tristan. Many thanx for that. All good stuff.

The boat will be coming out of the water next month. So it will be time for me then to get my hands dirty.

I will keep the forum informed on how I get on with changing it.

Out of interest have you ever seen a seal that was on it's last legs. or is the 7 year lifespan just a safety measure.

Thank you all for your comments.

Best regards

<hr width=100% size=1>/forums/images/icons/wink.gif <font color=blue> Regards Andy </font color=blue>

 

[Will_M]

Tristan do you work in Poole by any chance?



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[scarlett]

Re: Sail Drive seal failure

I too am interested in failures. Not just in seven year old ones - mine seemed unscathed by 10 years on the boat when I removed it. At what age has anyone seen failures of Volvo seals? And if you get a failure, is it a 'weep' or a 'catastrophy' Bearing in mind that my engine was 9 hp and the same seal is used on engines ten times as powerful, do the stresses of greater power have any bearing on their life? .

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[Dipper]

You shouldn’t have too much trouble doing this despite the warning in the Volvo replacement kit that it isn’t a DIY job. I managed without any disasters occurring as a result of my efforts and there has been plenty of good advice given to you so far.

It’s definitely worth checking the engine mountings. There are only three on the saildrive version so if one fails you haven’t a lot of ‘reserve’. Also, weak mountings will allow a lot of play in the leg especially when heeled in rough seas which will put additional strain on the seal.


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[DaveS]

Agree with other posters: fairly straightforward. Three points:

1. If the bottom fairing rubber is OK and securely attached to the hull I'd be tempted to leave it alone. If, as recommended by others, you remove the prop. shaft first then, apart from making the leg lift vertical only and hence much easier, there should be no chance of snagging the bottom rubber. (A new one from VP costs around £30 and in this case it carries no load at all... (see previous thread re. washing m/c price comparisons.))

2. While you have the gearbox and engine apart it is worth taking a look at the splines and if necessary fitting either the Volvo "resiliant" fix or the independent "hex" conversion. When I did this job a year ago the splines seemed OK and I fitted the Volvo kit as a future "preventative". (Someone was advertising one of these recently on the "sales" forum at half price.) The general consensus of previous threads on this subject seemed to be that if the spline wear looks at all significant it is better to send away the gearbox input shaft for machining into a hex and fit a new matching drive plate.

3. If you have the prop. shaft out it is worth checking to see whether new seals would be worthwhile. For all they cost it might be worth changing them anyway.

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[tristan]

The lower gaiter comes in the seal kit, so it is your choice whether you remove it or not, i just know from experiance that if the drive gets snagged when lifting, it is a pain.

Also the spline 'fix' is not applicable to the 120 sail drive, this only affectes the MS2 gearbox on a shaft (the sail drive does not suffer the same torsional vibration problems). The reason for inspection is good engineering practice and to asses for any poosible future problems.

Hope all this information helps.

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[tristan]

Re: Sail Drive seal failure

Good question;

Of all the sail drive inner gaitors i have replaced, none have been split or cracked in any way.
Having said that, a dealer i know has had one occurrence after 15 years and the gaitor split approx 2/3rds of the way round and sunk the boat - so if it does fail it will be major!

On one i knew i was changing, with the owners permission, i stabbed a hole through with a flat bladed screwdriver. This took 3 good, hard stabs and when i withdrew the screwdriver, water only just trickled in. So, a hole in the gaiter would not sink the boat if noticed.

On the subject of longevity, 5-7 years as reccomended by the insurance companies, is over-cautious, but that is insurance companies, and they are only echoing the VP maintanence schuedule. Stricktly a personal guideline would be 10-12 years depending on use, but no more (if it costs £1000 thats not bad going over that time!)

Always try to remember that no-one wants your boat to sink, and expensive as it may be, better that than hind-sight (no harm ever came to any boats that changed there gaitors every 5 years!)

Good luck.


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[tristan]

Yes, do you know me?

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[Will_M]

Next daft question, wont mean bugger all if it wasn't you though!!!

Were you one of a bunch of lads although there were lasses present that visited the Folly Inn for a spot of infamous table dancing on the last Sat or was it Fri, cant remember, of the Southampton Boat Show.

We went over on a Sealine flybridge something or other??



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[DaveS]

Perhaps suppliers differ. I know that when I bought the bits last year the lower rubber was not included and had to be ordered separately.

There was a long thread then on an owners association site (Westerly?) including contributions from VP which established that Volvo fitted the revised drive plate with the resilient inserts to all 2000 series engines in the last few years of manufacture including those fitted to saildrives. Not that Volvo has ever admitted there was a problem, of course!

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