Sadler 32 watermota engine starting problem

Gear reduced starter

I've a Sadler 32 with a mk IV sea panther. It starts easily every time, but when the batteries are low or weak it cranks over pretty slowly. Fresh new batteries can make a big difference. Bad injection pump timing can also make it hard to start.

When the engine is cold I run the pre-heater for about 20 seconds or I see a puff of smoke from the intake.

From what I can tell my starter is a Lucas LRS130 starter, part number 25689F stamped in it, off the ford Essex 3.0L V6 engine.
http://www.lucasee.com/visvare.php?nr=LRS00130&aux=1&menu=omb

I've found a few companies (WOSP, and Powerlite) that make a gear reduced starter that is based on a denso style starter. I've been thinking about trying one of these, but probably won't get around to it until my starter quits. If it fits, it would make starting a lot easier.

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/product/789/category/139

http://www.amp-starters.co.uk/Autom...eduction-Gear-Starter-Motor/p-599-1572-34213/

If anyone tries one I'd be interested to hear how it works.
 
sea panther starting

Hi, I read your Sea Panther 24v starting query with interest, as I have the same arrangement. And on a cold day yesterday it wouldn't start, and of course I've burnt out my 12v starter motor! Did you ever find a better solution I wonder?
Best regards,
Neil Critchley
 
fix to starting problem

Hi Neil,

I found that the starter battery on my Sadler 32 wasn't up to the job so replaced it. Having done so I found that if I hold the heater button in for at least 25 seconds the engine starts within a couple of seconds. if for some reason it fails to start immediately I give it 5 or 10 more seconds on the heater and then try again. SInce then the engine has almost always started first time and only twice needed a second attempt.

Hope that helps.
 
My old BMC 1.5 became a new engine when I fitted a proper new starter battery. It would start with 50% of the recommended preheat even on a cold day. The other thing that made a big difference was a couple of 12 hour motor sails, seemed to give the poor old thing a real new lease of life. My suggestion would be fit a dedicated starting battery, I used a 95AH starter battery from a Mazda Bongo, make sure all the cables are of a good size and the connections are in very good condition. Then try and have a few good long motor sails each season to give the beast a decent clear out inside.
 
solenoid casing to earth on Sea Panther diesel?

Thanks,
Final question! I replaced the 24v 4-terminal solenoid, and all seems to work as it should. However, I've just read that the solenoid casing should go to engine earth. Mine doesn't, though it did on the old one. Is this really necessary? It works anyway, even though I've bolted it to a wooden bulkhead for better access. I'm a bit puzzled about this, can anyone offer advice?
Best regards,
Neil
 
Solenoid casing earthed on Sea Panther?

Hi all,
I did post this earlier but it seems to have gone missing. Anyway, thanks for all the info offered so far. Last question! I replaced my 24v 4-terminal solenoid and mounted it on a wooden bulkhead for better access. Everything seems to work fine. However, I've now read that the solenoid casing needs to be earthed, and in fact before I replaced it it was bolted to the side of the crankcase. Is this right? Anyone know why? I'm afraid I'm not strong on electrics, but trying to learn.
Any advice much appreciated.
Thanks,
Neil
 
Another thought on the starter motor question: last year I doubled up the HD cabling to minimise the possibility of any volt drop (cheaper and easier than replacing with much thicker cables) and also had the starter motor re-wound to give more torque. The guys who did it couldn't be exact with the extra torque they'd achieve but guessed at around 25%.
Result? With exactly the same batteries I've gone from a very slow, very reluctant turnover to a something a lot better, and starting has improved markedly.
If this is interesting I can dig out the same of the rewind company.
PS, I still have an occasional starting issue - see my other post - any thoughts?
:)
 
LongJohn said:
thanks guys. a 24v battery sounds a pretty drastic solution - must make the charging setup pretty tricky. I'll try your suggestions when I'm next down Billjrat.
Click to expand...

I was involved with Exeter University when Sea Panther was being developed. Already pointed out that this was a gasoline base motor and ring gear/starter pinion ratio certainly did not suit the higher compression. In development we used 24 volts on 12 volt starters with no apparent ill effects and production motors were 24 volt when then got Lucas to develop starter. Later reverted to 12 volt when Lucas dropped the 24 volt starter due to poor engine volumes.

Engine is a bitch at low ambients, overquare diesel engines are nuts, poor cranking capacity of starter. Give it plenty of beans on the Thermostart, keep an eye on too many flames coming out of air inlet then bang it over on 24 volts. She will go.
 
sea panther starting

Just another thought re the ring gear/starter pinion ratio question:
I replaced my starter motor recently, having fried the old one with over-zealous cranking in cold weather. The one I took off had 10 teeth on the starter pinion, and the replacements on offer all had 9. Various sources told me that it didn't matter, as "the pitch would have been adjusted to compensate". Anyway I eventually found a 10-tooth one, which seems to work just fine. Anyone know which is the "right" one? Or if the above advice was correct? By the way, the new motor (brand new) really whips the engine over when cold with the same batteries, so I think my original starter (reconditioned - how many times?) was failing for some time and not producing the necessary torque.
Any thoughts anyone?
All the best,
Neil
 
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