Sad

[halcyon]

On local radio news DML at Devonport are planning to qoute for 2 new aircraft carries for the RN, that's good I thought. The story then went on, they are tied up with a French shipyard, that will built the hull, DML will fit electronics.

Sad when we cannot build our own boats anymore.


Brian

 

[rogerroger]

well we'd still be building ships in this country along with cars, planes, motorbikes, TVs etc had it not been for the unions demanding too much for labour.

...oh no, I'm turning into my Dad...

Roger Holden
www.first-magnitude.co.uk

 

[bob_tyler]

DML probably wise. With this govt they will never be built and it's cheaper to quote for just the fit-out. It's probably yet another G Hoon spin!.

 

[Mirelle]

Umm, that quoye would probably stand a better chance of sucess if the French had managed to finish their own carrier - there is a Grade A stink over cost overruns, delay and poor performance of this ship in France at the moment.

Mind you, back in the 1950's the Ark Royal kept Harland and Wolff alive through a lean patch because the Royal Corps of Nava Constructors kept changing their minds - one compartment was rebuilt 17 times!

 

[tony_brighton]

Be interested to see the cost differential (if any) between any UK bid and overseas.

 

[incognito]

Sad old argument...

Some would argue that the failings of UK industry were due to the lack of investment by management, which caused our productivity to fall further behind our emerging competitors (esp Japan and Germany, rebuilt from ground up with Marshall Aid). Lack of productivity meant that profits were squeezed and management squeezed work force more and more - so union activity was very reactionary. UK workforce was far more manual than competitors mechanised systems, and UK workforce always demanding more money for tougher jobs.

Some would argue thus.

 

[incognito]

Oh, I forgot part of the 'some might argue' argument...

With the German competition 'in your face' as it were - the UK worker could see what the German worker was getting, and they wanted parity... parity with a workforce working for profitable well-managed and well-invested companies. They could be forgiven for not realising that combining their militant drive for parity with a grasping underinvesting management ethos was liable to drive their industry under.

 

[halcyon]

Re: Sad old argument...

Not the place really for this thread but, I worked for the second largest private company in the 60's, we were paid morethan average, had benefits that the Japs and Germans still don't have, yet every other week was a strike, over a 10 year period productivity dropped over 30%. The problem was that the workers could spend so much a week, due to the ever increasing wages he had to do less work for the money he required. Then theres the foundry that Maggie paid to have closed to reduce over capacity, no one checked if other UK founderies could take over the order book, and yes no one could, so all the orders that had been won of the Germans went straight back to Germany.

I wonder if we would be happy if UK boats were built to the same standard as some German, ie to not look to close to unfinnished fibreglass in the lockers, locker modules to not quite fit. Remeber Hurley getting flack for building modular internals and fibre glass roof linning. Yet recently I remember a write-up on a Sweedish ? yacht with a moulded roof lineing with a wood chip or similar finish, our 1972 Hurley 27 had a wood chip insert. For some reason we moan about UK products, expecting the quality of top European boats, at the price of there production boats. How often do we here about Rover qaulity not up to BMW, yet we are happy to pay £10,000 more for the BMW, at that price Rover could be the same.

Brian

 

[castaway]

Roger... I think you are sounding like yr Dad... Either that of yr living in a pre Thatcherite era.

The Unions these days consider they,ve done a good days work if they hold back the advances of highly profesional IR and HR managers whos sole object is to have a workforce with lowpay and precious few rights.

The demise of the Old British Industries was as much due to uninspired management and lack of investment as it was due to bad Unions.

As always, one spawns the other.

Regards Nick

 

[jimi]

Its gonna get sadder!

Interesting really, perhaps if the Govt invested the billions they waste in the inefficiencies of the MOD, Civil Service & NHS in education we'd be capable of building our own Carriers in the future . The real reason the French want to close the refugee camp is that it'll soon be full of Brits trying to escape!

 

[yoda]

All is not as it may seem from the press. Don't think that DML are the only people bidding for this work, BAE Systems are also in the running and would use British yards to build the ship. It does however indicate that nearly all sizeable british warships now need to be built by one firm. There is much more to this issue than meets the eye.

Yoda

 

[halcyon]

Yes I think DML are a small player, just the need for a french shipyard that caught my ear.

Brian

 

[oldgit]

Re: Sad old argument...

Just a quick comment .Working on all types of cars as do do in my line of work.We convert cars to do other jobs.I can say that we hate working on Bmw/audi/volks/merc because of the extra work involved in taking then to bits.
They are very well built.
Rover are rubbish.all cardboard and nasty sharp edges ready to take lumps out of you.And as for the last effort the Rover 75...... its like your Grannys front room but with with no leg or headroom.............

And this is summer is it?