Replacing Tricolour - LED or normal fitting with LED bulb

[Tintin]

With the mast down I am going to replace the crazed combined anchor and tricolour, which is an Aqua Signal series 40.

I know I want to go LED to save power but am torn between:

a) getting another Aqua Signal and getting a suitable LED bulb from someone like Boatlamps (of this parish), or

b) go down the NASA route, Lopo being way too xpensive.

Any thoughts or other options?

PS: Even though I normally use a cockpit anchor light I do like having a masthead one for more secluded spots.

 

[Twister_Ken]

Aquasignal supplies a tricolour/anchor light unit using LEDs. Why mix and match?

 

[fireballxl6]

Did this at the start of the season. The top came off our Aqua Signal during a lively force 6-7 at the end of last season - don't know how it happened - maybe hit by a gull?

Anyway, thought a new Aqua Signal with the Quick Fit mount would be an easy replacement but was told that there is more than one type of Quick Fit and so no guarantee that a new one would mount on our existing base. That and the fact that no one was able to source stock of the said Aqua Signal led light pushed us onto the NASA unit.

It needs different wiring and a different switch (supplied) The unit illuminates either the anchor or the tri colour leds depending on what polarity the feed is so the switch is off in the centre, tri to one side and anchor to the other.

Has worked well so far and also has not upset vhf transmission/ reception despite being right next to the vhf antenna.

Cheers

Ed

 

[blackbeard]

I might make myself unpopular here.
The Colregs specify
"The intensities shall decrease to reach practical cut-off between 1 degree and 3 degrees outside the prescribed sectors".
(Annex 1 , 3).
It's far from obvious that LEDs can do this, and I have seen no evidence that they can.
If a tricolour is viewed from ahead, and the red and green don't cut off cleanly, a combination of green and red adding up to something like white could be see, which is not the message you might wish to convey.
An all-round light might be OK, however.
(There are also requirements for spectral content of the light, and I'm not convinced here either, though it might be technically possible.)
Yes, I know that the lights are claimed to satisfy the Colregs. But I just don't see how this is possible.
Has anyone done actual measurements?

 

[VicS]

With the mast down I am going to replace the crazed combined anchor and tricolour, which is an Aqua Signal series 40.

I know I want to go LED to save power but am torn between:

a) getting another Aqua Signal and getting a suitable LED bulb from someone like Boatlamps (of this parish), or

b) go down the NASA route, Lopo being way too xpensive.

Any thoughts or other options?

PS: Even though I normally use a cockpit anchor light I do like having a masthead one for more secluded spots.

I replaced all my lights because the lenses were crazed.

I thought about an LED one for the tricolour but decided against on grounds of cost .... ie to fecking expensive.

therefore fitted another Aquasignal........ latest type ... mods need to bracket cos the fixing holes differently spaced and cable entry different ( old cable only just reached) Fiddly thing compared with the original too.

I had a 10 watt bulb in the old one ( permitted and IIRC suplied with the lantern) but decided to upgrade to the 25 watt bulb supplied with the new one.

Then realised my wiring is a little lighter than it should be for 25 watts.

So the following year I fitted an LED "bulb" ... proper type with red, green and white LEDS. ECSmith one bought from Force 4. Available from most chandlers though.

LED unit came with a replacement holder which was essentail to line up the coloured sectors correctly ...... it would have been a long way way if just fitted in the original holder. Had to power the unit up and mark the front first though as all the LEDs looked the same and it was not marked.

Problem with a white LED in the tricolor is that you need warm white for the coloured sectors but for best performance a cold white for the white sector


For steaming light , side lights and stern light I found some cheap Aquasignal 25 clones in Seateach. About half the price . Lenses actually interchangeable. Terminals a bit poor in them ... Grubscrews tended to cut through the wire unless tinned to make a solid end.


I dont beleive you ever need an anchor light mounted high up. You need it where it will be most easily be seen...... except low down the mast will obscure it from one angle of view no matter where its fitted.
My preference is therefore for one in the fore-triangle and another ( lower) over the cockpit.

Pics of the new holder for the Tricolour:

Old holder in lantern

New holder and LED unit

New and old holders

 

[Tintin]

Aquasignal supplies a tricolour/anchor light unit using LEDs. Why mix and match?

I saw that, but "ouch" on cost.

 

[JomsViking]

The Lopolights are type approved: http://www.lopolight.com/download/qq-med-15-09-01r lopolight med certificate (up to 12 meters).pdf (0-12 meter, but the others are on their site as well) and so I'm told are the Aquasignals built as LED (but no evidence). No clue about the NASA stuff.

But if you put a White(ish) LED in an old tricolour it is not approved any longer, and probably will have the problem you describe.

I might make myself unpopular here.
The Colregs specify
"The intensities shall decrease to reach practical cut-off between 1 degree and 3 degrees outside the prescribed sectors".
(Annex 1 , 3).
It's far from obvious that LEDs can do this, and I have seen no evidence that they can.
If a tricolour is viewed from ahead, and the red and green don't cut off cleanly, a combination of green and red adding up to something like white could be see, which is not the message you might wish to convey.
An all-round light might be OK, however.
(There are also requirements for spectral content of the light, and I'm not convinced here either, though it might be technically possible.)
Yes, I know that the lights are claimed to satisfy the Colregs. But I just don't see how this is possible.
Has anyone done actual measurements?

 

[prv]

New holder and LED unit

What I don't understand is why, if you have to rewire the thing anyway, they persist in having lightbulb-style springloaded contacts to corrode / get wet / etc. Why not produce a single part that mounts on the plastic housing like the "new holder" does, but contains the LEDs and can be soldered (or supply waterproof crimps etc) straight to the supply wires?

Pete

 

[oldvarnish]

Yes, I know that the lights are claimed to satisfy the Colregs. But I just don't see how this is possible.
Has anyone done actual measurements?

This is what Lopolight quote on their website so I imagine at least one of those bodies mentioned must have put it to some kind of test

"Worldwide typeapproval
Wheelmark/M.E.D. QQ-MED-15/09-01
MCA (UK), USCG (USA)"

 

[VicS]

What I don't understand is why, if you have to rewire the thing anyway, they persist in having lightbulb-style springloaded contacts to corrode / get wet / etc. Why not produce a single part that mounts on the plastic housing like the "new holder" does, but contains the LEDs and can be soldered (or supply waterproof crimps etc) straight to the supply wires?

Pete

Dunno. Let us know when you find out.

 

[Tintin]

I replaced all my lights because the lenses were crazed.

I thought about an LED one for the tricolour but decided against on grounds of cost .... ie to fecking expensive.

therefore fitted another Aquasignal........ latest type ... mods need to bracket cos the fixing holes differently spaced and cable entry different ( old cable only just reached) Fiddly thing compared with the original too.

I had a 10 watt bulb in the old one ( permitted and IIRC suplied with the lantern) but decided to upgrade to the 25 watt bulb supplied with the new one.

Then realised my wiring is a little lighter than it should be for 25 watts.

So the following year I fitted an LED "bulb" ... proper type with red, green and white LEDS. ECSmith one bought from Force 4. Available from most chandlers though.

LED unit came with a replacement holder which was essentail to line up the coloured sectors correctly ...... it would have been a long way way if just fitted in the original holder. Had to power the unit up and mark the front first though as all the LEDs looked the same and it was not marked.

Problem with a white LED in the tricolor is that you need warm white for the coloured sectors but for best performance a cold white for the white sector


For steaming light , side lights and stern light I found some cheap Aquasignal 25 clones in Seateach. About half the price . Lenses actually interchangeable. Terminals a bit poor in them ... Grubscrews tended to cut through the wire unless tinned to make a solid end.


I dont beleive you ever need an anchor light mounted high up. You need it where it will be most easily be seen...... except low down the mast will obscure it from one angle of view no matter where its fitted.
My preference is therefore for one in the fore-triangle and another ( lower) over the cockpit.

Pics of the new holder for the Tricolour:
<snip>

Thankyou for taking the time to post the pics - very helpful.

 

[blackbeard]

The Lopolights are type approved: http://www.lopolight.com/download/qq-med-15-09-01r lopolight med certificate (up to 12 meters).pdf (0-12 meter, but the others are on their site as well) and so I'm told are the Aquasignals built as LED (but no evidence). No clue about the NASA stuff.

But if you put a White(ish) LED in an old tricolour it is not approved any longer, and probably will have the problem you describe.

I stand corrected. That's quite an achievement.

 

[Sans Bateau]

I dont beleive you ever need an anchor light mounted high up. You need it where it will be most easily be seen...... except low down the mast will obscure it from one angle of view no matter where its fitted.
My preference is therefore for one in the fore-triangle and another ( lower) over the cockpit.

Thats it scare the bu$$ers into thinking theres a vessel over 50m at anchor in Newtown

 

[Pye_End]

I have just this week had to replace my series 40 because of a breakage, and have done so with an Aquasignal series 34.

I am more impressed with this unit than other LED units as the vertical angles look better than most, although the anchor light disappears (at least in daylight) when reasonably close to the yacht. Will look at this again in the dark and hopefully it is not an issue.

The bracket for the 34 is apparently identical to some series 40 brackets. The difference seems to be the older light sit over the bracket (couple of lugs holding it on), but the newer ones sit in it.

The wiring is identical, and the screw holes match up. So long as the screws come loose (mine did) it is an easy job to swap them. If the brackets are the same then it is very easy.

The series 34 tricolour uses 1.9w (the online chandler information is incorrect) and the anchor 1w.

£180 odd if you look for the cheapest chandlers.

 

[VicS]

I have just this week had to replace my series 40 because of a breakage, and have done so with an Aquasignal series 34.



The bracket for the 34 is apparently identical to some series 40 brackets. The difference seems to be the older light sit over the bracket (couple of lugs holding it on), but the newer ones sit in it.

The wiring is identical, and the screw holes match up. So long as the screws come loose (mine did) it is an easy job to swap them. If the brackets are the same then it is very easy.

My problem was that i was replacing a 1979 Series 40 ( probably the first version they made) with the latest type. The screw holes were different. and whereas the original cable entry was through the centre of the base It is a side entry on the new one so the cable had to be re-routed.

If you'd been replacing one of the old types you would have had the same "problems" to over come. Minor almost trivial maybe but a fecking nuisance that the new one could not simply be bolted on in place of the old one.

 

[Pye_End]

If you'd been replacing one of the old types you would have had the same "problems" to over come. Minor almost trivial maybe but a fecking nuisance that the new one could not simply be bolted on in place of the old one.

Mine was a 1988 series 40, so it sounds as though there were at least 3 mounts. Thought mine was fairly old before I read this - yours must have done well as I think mine broke largely due to age.

 

[Tempus]

A simple thought if fitting LED lights

Tri-colour lights are not very visible to big ships and tend to get lost in shore clutter close to shore. We all use them because they save power. However, given the huge power saving gained by fitting LED's this argument no longer applies. So why not dispense with the tricolour and just put an all round white anchor light at the mast head, and rely on the Bow and Stern LED's for the nav lights?

BTW we fitted the Aqua signal LED's as Nav lights on our previous boat - can thoroughly recommend. Never got around to changing the masthead, but if I had I'd have followed my advice above/

 

[VicS]

A simple thought if fitting LED lights

Tri-colour lights are not very visible to big ships and tend to get lost in shore clutter close to shore. We all use them because they save power. However, given the huge power saving gained by fitting LED's this argument no longer applies. So why not dispense with the tricolour and just put an all round white anchor light at the mast head, and rely on the Bow and Stern LED's for the nav lights?

BTW we fitted the Aqua signal LED's as Nav lights on our previous boat - can thoroughly recommend. Never got around to changing the masthead, but if I had I'd have followed my advice above/

I think I would still opt for a tricolour that can be used when appropriate as well as having deck level lights for use on occasions when it's not.

It is always going to be visible above the waves. Deck level lights may not be.

There is never any reflection from deck fittings which can be a nuisance with side lights even if not with a pulpit mounted bicolour.

There is no glare from it in misty conditions.

I suppose an all round white could be used but surely a tricolour is preferable.

 

[Tempus]

I think I would still opt for a tricolour that can be used when appropriate as well as having deck level lights for use on occasions when it's not.

It is always going to be visible above the waves. Deck level lights may not be.

There is never any reflection from deck fittings which can be a nuisance with side lights even if not with a pulpit mounted bicolour.

There is no glare from it in misty conditions.

I suppose an all round white could be used but surely a tricolour is preferable.

All good points, and agree about the glare, although the glare from stanchions was almost zero from the more concentrated beam from the Aqua Signal LED's

The all round light was for an anchor light!

 

[VicS]

All good points, and agree about the glare, although the glare from stanchions was almost zero from the more concentrated beam from the Aqua Signal LED's

The all round light was for an anchor light!

While I have deck level lights and a tricolour the boat I crewed had those and an all round white.

Under power we mostly used the all round white in place of the mast head ("steaming") light and stern light, switching back to the steaming light and stern light when the allround white could become invisible against shore lights.

I dont know if it was original or if it was someones "good idea" but we could dim the allround white when ( if !) we used it as an anchor light.