Removal of old canvas deck

[Castletine]

I have the honour of replacing my worn canvas decks this winter and am seriously considering epoxy over plywood.
Can anyone recommend a good epoxy manufacturer? and any tips to make the job as painless as possible?

 

[AlexHall]

Get hold of the representatives of West system Epoxies (i believe Wessex Resins), MAS Epoxies, and there are a couple of others which you can find in the back pages of Classic Boat Mag, they would usually send you a trial kit and a reasonably comprehensive handbook on how to use.

The best handbook i've seen comes with West System, but I'm sure there are others.

 

[spark]

Hard to ay without seeing it but all the jobs like this that I have seen have needed the deck stripped completely - that's planking as well as canvas - and then there are invariably bits of rot in beams/deck margins to deal with. I would be very wary of merely stripping off the canvas and laying the ply onto the existing planks.

Whatever you do make sure that every edge of ply is completely and unequivocally sealed with epoxy.

Epoxy work needs a dry and warm environment so if you're planning to do the job over the winter do it in a good shed. The West book will tell you the best type of cloth to lay over the ply, etc.

 

[chippie]

I would consider pre saturating the plywood with epoxy well diluted by methylated spirits. It will soak up quite a bit but will help prevent water tracking along the plies if the glass/cloth is ever penetrated.
In practice it is easier to use a roller on full sheets and then cut out.I then seal the edges as recommended by others.
This method is a lot cheaper than proprietary products that do the same thing.
I use whatever brand is on special, but dont mix brands in liquid form.

 

[clyst]

Good idea! Done this job lots of times on various boats. Replace the decks with the most expensive ply you can afford -far eastern will do at a push since the finished job will be completely water-proof.Once the new decks have been fitted coat the whole deck space with epoxy- particulary the end grain. When dry lightly sand decks then, and heres the trick,using WOVEN cloth, lay dry over part of deck to be covered then pour mixed epoxy onto cloth (NOT TOO MUCH,) with piece of plastic, similar to a car body filler spreader,spread epoxy thro' the cloth. Sounds difficult but you will soon get th hang of it. Whilst spreading and forcing the epoxy into the cloth with a hair dry gently WARM the epoxy to enable it to flow better. A messy job till you get the hang of it so don't be too generous with the epoxy until you've seen how far it will go! Well thats the basics of it Good Luck and if you need any further advice expand the thread.
Cheers
Terry

 

[Guest]

Using epoxy will undoubtly strenghten the construction, but some people say there's a possibility that the structure will crack, due to the increased stiffness.

Any comment?

And what about Colean, a German-made product?

Good luck!

 

[Castletine]

Thanks

Thanks to everyone for all your information and advice - I'll be setting to work on stripping the decks shortly and am keeping my fingers crossed on the state of the planking below.

Jonathan

 

[Richard_Blake]

Problem of ply/epoxy over presumably old planked deck is inflexible structure on top of flexible. Suggest repairs to planks, etc, then something like Cuprinol on deck planks, then a flexible glue like Simsons over its own primer with gripfast or equivalent to fix the pre-epoxied plywood. The ply edges at butt joints should be bevelled to make a shallow 'V' at the joint, which will be filled with epoxy/ thickener/chopped mat after the ply is fixed to the deck. Good masking tape on all the bevelled ply edges before fastening the ply to the deck is a fiddly job but well worthwhile as epoxy filler will not adhere to Simson traces. Saves lots of time in the end. Then sand everything fair and use cloth/epoxy as others have advised. Before the job plan carefully around deck edges and joints to cabin - what should be a slightly flexible joint and what can be epoxied? Polyservice in Amsterdam make a flexible epoxy glue paste which is very useful for joints to cabin side. Anyone know if the international manufacturers are doing the same yet? If you want, you could lay a non-slip imitation canvas over the strengthening glass/epoxy layer. Epoxy will turn even an inexpensive lightweight jute material into a very strong surface, attractive and non-slip. Good luck with your water-tight lid!

LowTech

 

[Guest]

We've just done this on Nereis. I'm writing it up for the November issue. We were worried about brittle glass on flexy old decks and so we cushioned the ply onto some Sikaflex decking compound. Then the ply was put on with gripfast nails and we used a heavy cloth with MAS epoxy because it wicks into the cloth so well, and you can alter the flow pattern if you want or have it going off slow or fast quite easily. We slung International fairing compound over this and then rolled on one, and hopefully soon another, coat of epoxy to seal it all off. The whole lot is lipped over the side of the boat, and up into a groove in the coach roof. It looks and feels great, will probably outlast me, and gives, I hope, the right combination of strength and flexibility.

 

[Richard_Blake]

Hi, Dan and Jonathan,
We were concerned about lipping ply or glass cloth over the deck edge because a good collision thump on the rubbing strake was likely to attack epoxy brittleness right where it seems to hurt - from the edge in the plane. So we are holding the ply inside the 1.5 inch rubbing strake (whose top is at the same level as the ply deck covering) and treating the seam between the two the same as a flexibly filled seam, for example, between teak deck covering planks, if you see what I mean! The final layer of deck paint covers epoxy ply deck and deck/rubbing strake filler. We're half way through the job. I'd welcome comments too! On Edith we're also having to work around 3 by 3 oak bulwark stanchions, and we're making sure these also have a bit of anti-thump shock-absorbing Simsons (Sikaflex equivalent) between them and the edge of the ply. About 1/8th inch. Seems there's lots of ways to skin a deck!
R.

LowTech

 

[Guest]

Right so you're going to put a layer of caulking (for want of a better word) between rubbing strake and deck edge, is that right? That sounds quite a good idea.
On Nereis it's lipped over and then we'll cover it with toe rail and rubbing strake. On my last boat Salote, the glassfibre went to the deck edge, but wasn't folded over. The result was an annual dance with a mind-boggling array of materials in tubes (over the years) trying to keep the glassfibre layer from lipping up off the ply deck. The main trick with sheathing (anything) in glassfibre is to keep it integral. Once water is in behind it it seems to lift off like a hot air balloon. But this is better with the epoxy resin than with the polyester resin. Also remember to get the proper cloth, compatible with the epoxy. Polyester isn't waterproof.