Reggie - the riding light

[Storyline]

What leds are you looking at using?
I built one myself a while ago and after a lot of time spent researching found these:

http://uk.mouser.com/Search/Product...tualkey57280000virtualkey941-C503DWANCBBDB152

16 mounted in a plastic plumbing pipe end cap.

Very bright! Even at 0.1A.

I notice that they are made by Cree but they do not look like the cree emitters I have seen before which are small rectangular yellow things. I remember when I was living in China 3 or 4 years ago there was a glut of LED's which caused the govt to subsidise the factories to protect employment (hence the availability of cree torches which can be obtained for no more than the cost of the postage).

 

[Storyline]

I wrote about this issue back in January 2012 and it seems little has been done to address it since then:
http://www.saltyjohntheblog.com/2012/01/vhf-radio-interference-from-leds.html

An LED anchor light of the type discussed here, however, is less of a problem because it is usually deployed well away from the vhf antenna.

That is interesting John. It may not be an issue for the VHF of us yachtsmen but could have implications for mobo owners who have their antenna on the cabin roof (or taffrail etc). However as you point out in your article, it could also effect AIS reception and many (inc us) have the antenna mounted at deck level on a rail. Thanks for the heads up

 

[Salty John]

The problem isn't confined to 12v LEDs, it seems to be an issue with 240v LED bulbs also - they can effect hearing aids for instance.

Of course, the problem isn't the LED per se, it's the regulator. Smaller, faster oscillating buck regulators reduce cost but increase interference. Slower oscillating regulators and other regulating methods don't seem to have the same side effect. I would hope someones working on the problem, or maybe they're ignoring it in favour of lower production costs.

 

[RobbieW]

There is considerable support for a wired version (which is what we use now) but the problem with that is knowing how much wire to include. As said before, we, and I have seen others do this, hang the light in the cockpit whereas it should be in the fore triangle. Maybe the answer would be not to include any wire but just a waterproof plug. If this was the case the solar panel would be a bit superfluous and also the batteries.

Maybe the answer is to have two models, wired & wireless, both with auto on/off and high power LED's (two miles).

Any thoughts ?

I would have thought a wired version with a standard length of tinned wire, say 5m, with just bare soldered ends (or not and leave that to the user). The user then extends and connects as suits thier system. Actually 10m of wire doesnt add much to cost and is probably as much or more than most would need.

 

[prv]

There is considerable support for a wired version (which is what we use now) but the problem with that is knowing how much wire to include. [...] Maybe the answer would be not to include any wire but just a waterproof plug.

Bebi used to make them to order with a custom length of wire, but obviously that's not going to work for Chinese mass-production.

One option would be a wire long enough to suit almost any boat, say 10 metres, which can be cut down by the user if required. Although if the length of wire adds significantly to the cost, this could be seen as a waste by some who only need a short piece.

I wouldn't mind having a 6" pigtail of wire to which I could solder my own cable. This is how the Bebi nav lights came. I would want the supplied cable to have an outer sheath, though (ie, not just be a pair of cores twisted round each other) so that adhesive-lined heatshrink could be properly applied to waterproof the joint.

Or how about if the pigtail came with one half of a Superseal connector, and the box contained the other half in disassembled form to fit to your own cable? You can install these adequately with a small pair of pliers, albeit not as fast as using the proper crimp tool.

It does seem as if a wired version may be more popular than a battery one.

Pete

 

[Storyline]

Thanks for all this great feedback
I agree with Pete that a wired version would probably be the better seller and due to the longevity of LED's it may be possible to make one that will last a lifetime or at any rate a considerable length of time. If this was the case then the cable would likely be the weak point and so proper marine tinned stuff would be best. This is probably expensive and would probably be better sourced from a European cable supplier so maybe a pigtail would be best which could be sent to China for assembly. This would mean the internal joint could be properly weatherproofed and good quality sleeved cable used. I presume round cable would be better than oval for heatshrinking onto.

I really feel as though I could clog the forum up with poll after poll viz. wired or wireless, where do people hang them, length of wire required, deck plug used, cold white/warm white, additional downward illumination etc etc

There certainly seems to be some interest and as this is a prerequisite for most crowdfunding platforms there seems to be potential.

 

[prv]

I presume round cable would be better than oval for heatshrinking onto.

Either's fine, there just needs to be a continuous surface for the glue to adhere to. The Bebi nav lights (as distinct from anchor lights) came with a red and black wire twisted together, and it was a bit fiddly to be sure you had a waterproof joint.

Pete

 

[GHA]

+1
I made one up with three small multi- SMD/LED devices in a clear lamp casing- It hardly uses any power, but is VERY bright. It plugs into a deck socket under the canopy, and sits about 8 feet off deck level- at the flag halyard cleat on a stay. I can comfortably say it's visible for several miles, as we've used it to find the boat at night...
They are a blue white rather than "warm white". Our boat was not fitted with a masthead anchor light.

I should have added there's an adjustable regulator in there as well, otherwise they'd be REALLY bright. Just for a moment.

 

[Resolution]

Would it be possible to address the problem of finding one's boat amongst many others in a large anchorage?
As well as the all round white light required by Colregs, could your anchor light also incorporate either a strobe or another colour light that would be visible from a fair distance?
We noticed this summer in the Med that a number of yachts simply go straight to a coloured strobe. One in the gulf of Corinth even had a police red/blue flasher.......

 

[Sailingsaves]

My 'Poros' version is completely automatic. Rechargable batteries from solar power, automatic dawn/dusk switching, 2 mile visibility. We turn it on in May and off in October. Exactly what we want.

I have voted as the majority seem to also, only in case solar power did not charge batteries enough, otherwise option 1.

I cannot understand why so many people would want a dedicated 12V wired version though.

Vyv's sounds ideal.

The less things to get tangled on a boat always gets my vote.

To Vyv:

From photo, I assume solar panel is small and atop the plastic lens?
Do you know what type of batteries are inside and how many or what voltage and capacity is the (single?) battery?

I know you are in sunny climes, but it does sound ideal - just wondering if it would work all night in UK?

 

[vyv_cox]

I have voted as the majority seem to also, only in case solar power did not charge batteries enough, otherwise option 1.

I cannot understand why so many people would want a dedicated 12V wired version though.

Vyv's sounds ideal.

The less things to get tangled on a boat always gets my vote.

To Vyv:

From photo, I assume solar panel is small and atop the plastic lens?
Do you know what type of batteries are inside and how many or what voltage and capacity is the (single?) battery?

I know you are in sunny climes, but it does sound ideal - just wondering if it would work all night in UK?

As I was reading down the thread I had decided that a bit more explanation of my light was needed, as I could not understand why anyone would want a wired one. I have had several before and there is no way I would go back from what I have now. It is completely self contained with a small solar panel on top and a rechargeable battery inside. i have not needed to change it in four years so I don't know what it is. It is mounted on top of the stern pole radar scanner where it is visible all around except for the mast. It is very bright. I turn it on in May, off in October, and in between it is stored inside the boat. I think it is just about the perfect anchor light, and all for €46.

So far as working in UK is concerned, in summer there are more hours of daylight in UK than there are in Greece. Even in the few cloudy and wet days that we have in Greece the light seems to work throughout the following night. It has 6 LEDs and a Ni-MH battery. The box says it will run for 20 hours on a full solar charge.

 

[Storyline]

Would it be possible to address the problem of finding one's boat amongst many others in a large anchorage?
As well as the all round white light required by Colregs, could your anchor light also incorporate either a strobe or another colour light that would be visible from a fair distance?
We noticed this summer in the Med that a number of yachts simply go straight to a coloured strobe. One in the gulf of Corinth even had a police red/blue flasher.......

Food for thought, red & green would obviously be out and if the lights have >2 miles range a flashing option might also be questionable as it may get mixed up with a navigation mark. Shame really as it would be fun to be able to have your own personal light characteristic ! Not sure about a strobe and of course if more than one yacht also used them it would be confusing.

Anyone any ideas ?

 

[Sailingsaves]

Not voted as my anchor light is on masthead, some thoughts though:

If the device could have a removable base that allowed the light to shine downwards as well as horizontally, I would be interested for hanging in the cockpit in the evening.

Anything other than lithium batteries are a dead loss IMO. Need to be protected type, like this: http://amzn.to/1inSyWq

I suggest a loop on the base so it can be steadied if hung below the anchor ball.

Nigel, why do you suggest lithium batteries? I know you know your stuff and that is why I ask, because I thought that although lithium are good for some products, they are a compromise battery (isn't everything a compromise?)- they are small, do not discharge on their own, no 'memory effect'.

But they do not have the longevity of nickle based batteries (the memory effect can be overcome) and lithiums they require special charging - so would that not make the construction of the anchor light more difficult?

 

[Sailingsaves]

Thanks Vyv,
Sounds ideal. Now Storyline can make one for the UK market perhaps?

As I was reading down the thread I had decided that a bit more explanation of my light was needed, as I could not understand why anyone would want a wired one. I have had several before and there is no way I would go back from what I have now. It is completely self contained with a small solar panel on top and a rechargeable battery inside. i have not needed to change it in four years so I don't know what it is. It is mounted on top of the stern pole radar scanner where it is visible all around except for the mast. It is very bright. I turn it on in May, off in October, and in between it is stored inside the boat. I think it is just about the perfect anchor light, and all for €46.

So far as working in UK is concerned, in summer there are more hours of daylight in UK than there are in Greece. Even in the few cloudy and wet days that we have in Greece the light seems to work throughout the following night. It has 6 LEDs and a Ni-MH battery. The box says it will run for 20 hours on a full solar charge.

 

[Sailingsaves]

I notice that they are made by Cree but they do not look like the cree emitters I have seen before which are small rectangular yellow things. I remember when I was living in China 3 or 4 years ago there was a glut of LED's which caused the govt to subsidise the factories to protect employment (hence the availability of cree torches which can be obtained for no more than the cost of the postage).

The ones in the mouser link are simply "through hole" Cree LEDS.

I think the ones you refer to as rectangular are smd Cree LEDs.

Try soldering this little bugger:

http://www.rapidonline.com/Electron...eps&IncVat=1&gclid=CIj4qOut2cACFdSWtAodG1IAOA

Google images shows lots of variations, some on heatsinks etc.

Cree are even better than Nichia imho.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=c...a=X&ei=sa4RVJzMMMGp7Abs4YGYDA&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAg

 

[lw395]

Food for thought, red & green would obviously be out and if the lights have >2 miles range a flashing option might also be questionable as it may get mixed up with a navigation mark. Shame really as it would be fun to be able to have your own personal light characteristic ! Not sure about a strobe and of course if more than one yacht also used them it would be confusing.

Anyone any ideas ?

A couple of orange leds makes our boat unique in most places...
It's useful to light up the deck a little if you have a dark hull.

But the retro reflective tape on the liferings seems to be the best thing for spotting the boat!

 

[nigelmercier]

Nigel, why do you suggest lithium batteries? ... they do not have the longevity of nickle based batteries (the memory effect can be overcome) and lithiums they require special charging - so would that not make the construction of the anchor light more difficult?

Just my experience that NiMH batteries seem to die just when you need them, and give far fewer cycles than suggested. Perhaps on something that is charged every day, this will not be a problem.

Didn't you make a device to turn on a light in response to a phone call? Now may be a good time to mention it ...

Would it be possible to address the problem of finding one's boat amongst many others in a large anchorage? ...

An idea to fit such a device into the anchor light, perhaps to make it flash?

 

[GHA]

.

Anyone any ideas ?

One reflective tape up the mast works OK, flash your torch around until you spot it.

 

[Storyline]

I had thought of a phone driven 'on demand' system and now Sim cards are so cheap it may be a goer. You can get small tracking devices (for use on pets/model aircraft etc) for around £35 and these also include a gps chip so the cost of the phone bit must be modest. If only I was still living in Shenzhen the whole thing could be built in a week or two such is the dynamism of the micro electronics world there. The advantage of our old Nescafe jar with a 5w bulb soldered on a couple of wires is that it twinkled most attractively and as such looked different to anyone elses. Never had a problem spotting Saumur in a busy anchorage.

As regards the wired/wireless dilemma there does not appear to be a 'one size fits all' type solution. I can see the attraction of Vyv's system but there are also purists who want to hang the light where it should be (not us ) . There are also people (us) who enjoy the ritual of rigging their riding light when safely anchored. I see no other option other than to have two models.

.....
I suggest a loop on the base so it can be steadied if hung below the anchor ball.

Yes, I was thinking of two clips, top & bottom so it could be hung above/below an anchor ball or just used to attach uphaul/downhaul.

 

[BrianH]

As I was reading down the thread I had decided that a bit more explanation of my light was needed, as I could not understand why anyone would want a wired one. I have had several before and there is no way I would go back from what I have now. It is completely self contained with a small solar panel on top and a rechargeable battery inside. i have not needed to change it in four years so I don't know what it is. It is mounted on top of the stern pole radar scanner where it is visible all around except for the mast. It is very bright. I turn it on in May, off in October, and in between it is stored inside the boat. I think it is just about the perfect anchor light, and all for €46.

I have something similar and also cannot imagine a better system. It is German-made, has two LEDs and is very bright with an omni-directional, multi-faceted lens ... and it lasts all night, switches on at dusk and off at dawn - a perfect anchor light. But when I posted about it on here and revealed that its original function was as a garden light, all hell broke loose; I felt banished beyond the pale. I wonder where all those detractors have gone.