Red Diesel what do I do??

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pcatterall

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Well, I knew that there were issues in Holland but I thought we would be ok in France, now it seems that we may be in trouble wherever we go.
We are preparing the boat for passage down the west coast then along to the Solent across to France and through the French canal system.
We have 100 gall capacity ( in 2 x50 gallon tanks) and about 40 gallons in at this time. Preston Marina sells only red deisel. Somehow I now have to use up or throw away 40 galls and find a way of getting suitable fuel to replace it.
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
I guess that if I find a source of suitable fuel locally then I could carry and fill the 'slave' tank and run down the master tank to about 10 gallons then keep diluting it from the slave tank. This is a bit of a worry as I don't like to run the tank down too low and there will still be residue red for a long time.
Comments on my way forward will be appreciated.
Also clarification of just which white diesel I should be buying?
Also , in France, will I be able to buy the 'correct' diesel for our engine.
Are there additives that I can use to make road diesel suitable for our engine.
I will appreciate your advice as ever.
 
pcatterall said:
Well, I knew that there were issues in Holland but I thought we would be ok in France, now it seems that we may be in trouble wherever we go.
We are preparing the boat for passage down the west coast then along to the Solent across to France and through the French canal system.
We have 100 gall capacity ( in 2 x50 gallon tanks) and about 40 gallons in at this time. Preston Marina sells only red deisel. Somehow I now have to use up or throw away 40 galls and find a way of getting suitable fuel to replace it.
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
I guess that if I find a source of suitable fuel locally then I could carry and fill the 'slave' tank and run down the master tank to about 10 gallons then keep diluting it from the slave tank. This is a bit of a worry as I don't like to run the tank down too low and there will still be residue red for a long time.
Comments on my way forward will be appreciated.
Also clarification of just which white diesel I should be buying?
Also , in France, will I be able to buy the 'correct' diesel for our engine.
Are there additives that I can use to make road diesel suitable for our engine.
I will appreciate your advice as ever.
Click to expand...


We have been in France for 10 years, on and off, we have never had any question of what diesel we are using and for most of that time we have used road diesel. Our marina does not have a pump. We also have an old perkins 4236 of 1978 vintage. It has always started at 1st touch and has no problems at all. Heavily fingers crossed.
 
Digbydog said:
We have been in France for 10 years, on and off, we have never had any question of what diesel we are using and for most of that time we have used road diesel. Our marina does not have a pump. We also have an old perkins 4236 of 1978 vintage. It has always started at 1st touch and has no problems at all. Heavily fingers crossed.
Click to expand...

Yes, but until now HMG has not announced to all and sundry (including French douaniers) that what we're doing is illegal.
 
pcatterall said:
Well, I knew that there were issues in Holland but I thought we would be ok in France, now it seems that we may be in trouble wherever we go.
We are preparing the boat for passage down the west coast then along to the Solent across to France and through the French canal system.
We have 100 gall capacity ( in 2 x50 gallon tanks) and about 40 gallons in at this time. Preston Marina sells only red deisel. Somehow I now have to use up or throw away 40 galls and find a way of getting suitable fuel to replace it.
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
I guess that if I find a source of suitable fuel locally then I could carry and fill the 'slave' tank and run down the master tank to about 10 gallons then keep diluting it from the slave tank. This is a bit of a worry as I don't like to run the tank down too low and there will still be residue red for a long time.
Comments on my way forward will be appreciated.
Also clarification of just which white diesel I should be buying?
Also , in France, will I be able to buy the 'correct' diesel for our engine.
Are there additives that I can use to make road diesel suitable for our engine.
I will appreciate your advice as ever.
Click to expand...


Wouldn't that just cause a tank full of slightly less dyed diesel.
 
Surely, you put all your red diesel in one tank. Put 10l of road diesel in the other, and check that your engine works well on it - it's likely to be OK (if it isn't work out what additives you may need). Then fill up as much as you can easily of road diesel into that clean tank (a few cc of red should be OK - see various other posts). Switch over to red diesel for the trip through the UK, which will probably almost finish it - if not, donate/sell it to another UK boater. Fill up with road diesel, and off you go.
 
Sounds a good plan except, where the hell are you going to find a garage with long emough hoses to pump 100 gal of road diesel into a boat?! Could be a good business opening for someone running a bowser along the sea wall...

The point is, you can't get white diesel anywher near any bit of UK waters!!!

Rob
 
But he doesn't need huge quantities of road diesel till he gets to France, when the marina will sell it. For the UK but, he has enough red diesel. A few cans of road diesel will be enough to test that his engine will cope with it - 10 or 20 litres is not difficult to carry from the car to the boat.

His problem is not that bit - it's if his engine doesn't like road diesel!
 
pcatterall said:
Well, I knew that there were issues in Holland but I thought we would be ok in France, now it seems that we may be in trouble wherever we go.
We are preparing the boat for passage down the west coast then along to the Solent across to France and through the French canal system.
We have 100 gall capacity ( in 2 x50 gallon tanks) and about 40 gallons in at this time. Preston Marina sells only red deisel. Somehow I now have to use up or throw away 40 galls and find a way of getting suitable fuel to replace it.
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
I guess that if I find a source of suitable fuel locally then I could carry and fill the 'slave' tank and run down the master tank to about 10 gallons then keep diluting it from the slave tank. This is a bit of a worry as I don't like to run the tank down too low and there will still be residue red for a long time.
Comments on my way forward will be appreciated.
Also clarification of just which white diesel I should be buying?
Also , in France, will I be able to buy the 'correct' diesel for our engine.
Are there additives that I can use to make road diesel suitable for our engine.
I will appreciate your advice as ever.
Click to expand...

You may as well bite on the bullet, you will almost certainly be on 100% road fuel as soon as you hit the mainland.
 
pcatterall said:
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
Click to expand...

There's a lot of scaremongering about use of road diesel in boats, a bit like Y2K bug. In common with tens of thousands of other boats throughout Europe with all makes and sizes of engines, we've been using road diesel with biofuel content for years without any problems whatsoever, in fact there seem to be less fuel bug problems than with UK red.

Suggest you take some cans of white on board and run your red down as low as safely possible before filling with white as it takes ages to get rid of the dye.
 
I agree but the main problems caused by bio diesel / fame, is that it is a very good solvent of the sediment lining tanks and fuel lines.

So what you MUST take are plenty of spare filters and be prepared to change them frequently until the tanks and lines have been flushed clean.

This problem applies to road vehicles as well and there are photos on Millers Oils website of the consequences of bio diesel and diesel bug.
 
ianj99 said:
I agree but the main problems caused by bio diesel / fame, is that it is a very good solvent of the sediment lining tanks and fuel lines.

So what you MUST take are plenty of spare filters and be prepared to change them frequently until the tanks and lines have been flushed clean.

This problem applies to road vehicles as well and there are photos on Millers Oils website of the consequences of bio diesel and diesel bug.
Click to expand...

Our boat is 1988 and as far as I know, the tank has never been cleaned. For 6 years now we've only been using road diesel and I've not even had to drain the sediment bowl in that time. Whilst I'm aware that some people have had problems with dirty fuel systems, I also bear in mind that additive companies use scare tactics to sell their products.
 
GrahamM376 said:
Our boat is 1988 and as far as I know, the tank has never been cleaned. For 6 years now we've only been using road diesel and I've not even had to drain the sediment bowl in that time. Whilst I'm aware that some people have had problems with dirty fuel systems, I also bear in mind that additive companies use scare tactics to sell their products.
Click to expand...

Not Millers.

There are some photos on here of fuel filters and a Shell tanker driver told me that since Shell increased the biodiesel content, even their tanker fleet has needed a filter change once per month until the sediment has been flushed.

The owner of the forecourt where he was delivering to also said he had to change all the filters betwixt storage tanks and pumps.

http://energytuning.co.uk\fuelprobs.htm

Anecdotal this may be, but forwarned is forearmed as they say, and you can hardly call the AA if you breakdown at sea....
 
ianj99 said:
Not Millers.

There are some photos on here of fuel filters and a Shell tanker driver told me that since Shell increased the biodiesel content, even their tanker fleet has needed a filter change once per month until the sediment has been flushed.

The owner of the forecourt where he was delivering to also said he had to change all the filters betwixt storage tanks and pumps.

http://energytuning.co.uk\fuelprobs.htm

Anecdotal this may be, but forwarned is forearmed as they say, and you can hardly call the AA if you breakdown at sea....
Click to expand...

Mine is even older than Grahams, and has several hundred trouble free hours since fuelling on white diesel, mind you wasn't shell magic petrol that had to be withdrawn because it screwed up engines?
 
pcatterall said:
Well, I knew that there were issues in Holland but I thought we would be ok in France, now it seems that we may be in trouble wherever we go.
We are preparing the boat for passage down the west coast then along to the Solent across to France and through the French canal system.
We have 100 gall capacity ( in 2 x50 gallon tanks) and about 40 gallons in at this time. Preston Marina sells only red deisel. Somehow I now have to use up or throw away 40 galls and find a way of getting suitable fuel to replace it.
I understand that ordinary road deisel will not be good for my old perkins and am not certain of what to buy and where from.
I guess that if I find a source of suitable fuel locally then I could carry and fill the 'slave' tank and run down the master tank to about 10 gallons then keep diluting it from the slave tank. This is a bit of a worry as I don't like to run the tank down too low and there will still be residue red for a long time.
Comments on my way forward will be appreciated.
Also clarification of just which white diesel I should be buying?
Also , in France, will I be able to buy the 'correct' diesel for our engine.
Are there additives that I can use to make road diesel suitable for our engine.
I will appreciate your advice as ever.
Click to expand...

Other than the delivery trip from Plymouth to ireland I have only ever put road diesel into my 1975 engine. It has over 4700 hrs on it and runs beautifully.
 
AliM said:
Surely, you put all your red diesel in one tank. Put 10l of road diesel in the other, and check that your engine works well on it - it's likely to be OK (if it isn't work out what additives you may need). Then fill up as much as you can easily of road diesel into that clean tank (a few cc of red should be OK - see various other posts). Switch over to red diesel for the trip through the UK, which will probably almost finish it - if not, donate/sell it to another UK boater. Fill up with road diesel, and off you go.
Click to expand...

Just make sure that the return pipe does not bleed red into the white tank!!!
 
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