Red diesel - legal for propulsion or not?

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BigTallTim

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I read with interest the February article on PBO online entitled "Red diesel to be legal only in British waters"; I understand that it is now a requirement for us to state upon purchase that the marked fuel will only be used in UK waters.

http://www.pbo.co.uk/news/530815/red-diesel-to-be-legal-only-in-british-waters

I personally have no problem with that - I'm quite happy plodding our coastline - but the article has left me confused...

In the article the economic secretary to the Treasury, Chloe Smith, is quoted as saying:
"The changes ensure that red diesel can continue to be used as fuel for propelling private pleasure craft in UK coastal waters and on the inland waterways in accordance with current procedures."

This quote was the source of my confusion; It was my understanding that whilst red diesel could be used for heating, power generation etc, we are not allowed to use it for propulsion - please could someone shed some light on the current state of the law in relation to the use of red diesel for propulsion in and around the UK, Ireland and the Isle of Man?

Many thanks and best regards,

Tim
 
I suppose "in accordance with current procedures" is the important part of the quote. You can put red diesel in your tanks, but you have to declare - and pay full duty on - the proportion that you will be using for propulsion.
 
BigTallTim said:
I read with interest the February article on PBO online entitled "Red diesel to be legal only in British waters"; I understand that it is now a requirement for us to state upon purchase that the marked fuel will only be used in UK waters.

http://www.pbo.co.uk/news/530815/red-diesel-to-be-legal-only-in-british-waters

I personally have no problem with that - I'm quite happy plodding our coastline - but the article has left me confused...

In the article the economic secretary to the Treasury, Chloe Smith, is quoted as saying:
"The changes ensure that red diesel can continue to be used as fuel for propelling private pleasure craft in UK coastal waters and on the inland waterways in accordance with current procedures."

This quote was the source of my confusion; It was my understanding that whilst red diesel could be used for heating, power generation etc, we are not allowed to use it for propulsion - please could someone shed some light on the current state of the law in relation to the use of red diesel for propulsion in and around the UK, Ireland and the Isle of Man?

Many thanks and best regards,

Tim
Click to expand...

PCUK is correct
suggest you use the forum search facility & the RYA website
 
BigTallTim said:
I read with interest the February article on PBO online entitled "Red diesel to be legal only in British waters"; I understand that it is now a requirement for us to state upon purchase that the marked fuel will only be used in UK waters.

http://www.pbo.co.uk/news/530815/red-diesel-to-be-legal-only-in-british-waters

I personally have no problem with that - I'm quite happy plodding our coastline - but the article has left me confused...

In the article the economic secretary to the Treasury, Chloe Smith, is quoted as saying:
"The changes ensure that red diesel can continue to be used as fuel for propelling private pleasure craft in UK coastal waters and on the inland waterways in accordance with current procedures."

This quote was the source of my confusion; It was my understanding that whilst red diesel could be used for heating, power generation etc, we are not allowed to use it for propulsion - please could someone shed some light on the current state of the law in relation to the use of red diesel for propulsion in and around the UK, Ireland and the Isle of Man?

Many thanks and best regards,

Tim
Click to expand...

That link is from Feb 2012. the staements made were subsequently withdrawn because they were not true.. Search this forum and RYA site for "proper" information.
 
It was only today i realised how little the saving is. The marina insists on the 60/40 vat deal, so I save 40% of the 20% vat. That is 8%. Road diesel is £1.40 so am i really only saving 11p a litre. Hardly worth it on my 12hp engine. It would be better for the eber just to buy white.

Did i work it out correct?
 
Stevev2 said:
It was only today i realised how little the saving is. The marina insists on the 60/40 vat deal, so I save 40% of the 20% vat. That is 8%. Road diesel is £1.40 so am i really only saving 11p a litre. Hardly worth it on my 12hp engine. It would be better for the eber just to buy white.

Did i work it out correct?
Click to expand...

You choose what split,you sign a declaration, Its nothing to do with the supplier what split ( if any) you take.
 
Stevev2 said:
It was only today i realised how little the saving is. The marina insists on the 60/40 vat deal, so I save 40% of the 20% vat. That is 8%.[...]
Did i work it out correct?
Click to expand...

No.

The tax you're splitting is the "road tax" part, not just the VAT on top. I don't know how much of a litre of diesel is tax, but it's a lot.

The supplier is also not supposed to dictate to you what the split will be. In theory you're meant to work that out for your own particular consumption, though nobody really does and I don't think HMRC really expect it.

Pete
 
Perfectly legal - you try buying undyed diesel afloat. HMRC may require you to prove any usage declaration, but have publicly stated they are unlikely to query anyone declaring 60% for propulsion and 40% for other purposes.

Personally I do not recognise the authority of other European Countries, and certainly nothing this damn European Union (read dictatorship) has ever come up with, as I am a free British Citizen living in Great Britain and abiding by the Sovereign rules of this Country. As I recall this is what my Dad fought for in WW 2, not the German dominance that as just f**ked Cyprus !
 
Last edited:
superheat6k said:
Perfectly legal - you try buying undyed diesel afloat. HMRC may require you to prove any usage declaration, but have publicly stated they are unlikely to query anyone declaring 60% for propulsion and 40% for other purposes.

Personally I do not recognise the authority of other European Countries, and certainly nothing this damn European Union (read dictatorship) has ever come up with, as I am a free British Citizen living in Great Britain and abiding by the Sovereign rules of this Country. As I recall this is what my Dad fought for in WW 2, not the German dominance that as just f**ked Cyprus !
Click to expand...

I think you will find it was Germany`s old enemy who dominated Cyprus, with ill gotten funds
 
This is what happens when you lobby. The RYA lobbied hard to preserve red diesel use in pleasure boats. The politicians gave way and the civil servants should have sorted the detail. Unfortunately our senior civil servants are only really interested in policy work and sorting the detail is both beneth their dignity and above thier capability. So the usual fudge was arranged and this was not compatible with agrements we made with the EU. So then a few of us ventured to the mainland and were told that use of red diesel in pleasure boats is against EU agreements - which it is.
I agree that the saving is not much on yachts and personally I would prefer to use white diesel all the time and not have hassle when I visit the EU. The trouble is how do I buy white diesel. The marina does not stock it and it is illegal & dangerous to haul round large numbers of jerry cans.
So I am stuck with an unsatisfactory situation becuase of the inability of our civil service and politicians to organise practical solutions.
This is another example of the omni - shambles caused by the civil service being run by people with a very high intellect and great ability to pontificate but very poor ability to get things done in the real world. Made worse by career politicians who are not interested in much other than thier own career.
Other examples of this phenomienon are UK Boarder Agency, Child Support Agency, Health Service etc etc
 
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