johnphilip
Well-Known Member
No, I said that ports and marinas should invest in having both available. Sorry I did not spell it out that this was for commercially used red to be available
Red Diesel Calculation
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No, I said that ports and marinas should invest in having both available. Sorry I did not spell it out that this was for commercially used red to be available
sailorman
Well-Known Member
it could easily be rebated to comercial users via their tax / vat return as for their other vehicles, simple but its all been done to death before
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Ok if i am a marina owner why should i spend thousands on new tanks & pumps etc. where is the incentive .when profit on fuel would be quite low, bearing in mind there is not the turnover as in a roadside filling station.
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johnphilip
Well-Known Member
True you may choose whether to invest in your business or not, but the margin available is greater to a marina than a competitive supermarket forecourt. It is not a valid reason to keep the current dishonesty encouraging regime creaking on.
sailorman
Well-Known Member
Its not dishonesty, its HMRC who have stated what we are allowed to apply & sign for.
Koeketiene
Well-Known Member
As far as I am aware, there are 5 places where you can get diesel on the Orwell.
Serving about 2,000 yachts and and maybe a handful commercial fishermen - if that.
Surely one point of sale for red diesel is sufficient?
tugger
Well-Known Member
But its not just a question of supplying a few fishermen, there are the sea schools, wind cats, survey vessels or anyone else that can justifiably use it commercially. I can't see many marinas willing to give up 100 to 1000ltr sales just like that, compared to the 20 or 30 litres at a time that the majority of yachts take. Besides, the split declaration was put in place for exactly that reason.
And before you jump on the road diesel waggon, just remember the low sulphur and high biomass content of white diesel.
And before you jump on the road diesel waggon, just remember the low sulphur and high biomass content of white diesel.
sailorman
Well-Known Member
As has been stated many many times, how is that our continental cousins have no issues with white over the past 10+ years.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Well not necessarily so. What you might have said is that they have been stuck with it
Offer them cheaper fuel & i cannot imagine them turning it down
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
So you are saying i have to go all along to the one marina that sells it even if i am at the furthest away. That is ok for the 25 litres a year whallas but i am sure i would not be happy with that. Neither would a few others on the forum i suspect
I visited blyth on my 2 round uk trips & they have no fuel facility. To get fuel they have to treck up the Tyne. To me that would be a real pain in the rear
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
When one is having the 60 40 debate ask yourself why a fixed land based house can have cheaper tax rate fuel & a marina based liveaboard not.
Is that fair on the liveaboard person. If you agree it is ( & of course you may not) then why cannot an occassional liveaboard person ( me) have access to the lower duty rate. At what point do we have the split between the haves & have nots ( & yes i do vote conservative in spite of that comment)
Is that fair on the liveaboard person. If you agree it is ( & of course you may not) then why cannot an occassional liveaboard person ( me) have access to the lower duty rate. At what point do we have the split between the haves & have nots ( & yes i do vote conservative in spite of that comment)
duncan99210
Well-Known Member
If even the Greeks can manage to have two tanks, one low tax for commercal vessels and one full tax for the rest of us, the UK market could surely sort that out. And the stuff is all simple road diesel. No one seems to have any greater problems with it than you encounter in UK. And just at the moment, diesel in Greece is selling at about £1 a litre, fully taxed......
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
duncan99210
Well-Known Member
Strangely, the one part of the tax system that does work quite well is that dealing with fuel taxes. It's difficult to dodge round the edges of the system so no one tries very hard to avoid it. Otherwise, you're right. Tax evasion is a national sport.
sailorman
Well-Known Member
continental road fuel is much cheaper than our so called rebated
Surely, that's the way ahead then - next time you cross the Channel...
sailorman
Well-Known Member
yes this summer`s cruise :encouragement:
tugger
Well-Known Member
No, a liveaboard declaring 100% for heating will pay the same tax as a house bound oil usèr, being as it is... 5%. The duty is the variable factor which brings the price out of direct comparison to heating oil. You may also be confusing the fuel used. Heating oil, (Kerosine) is cheaper than Gasoil (red diesel) hence the price difference, but of course there is no reason on earth you cannot fit a kero burning boiler to your boat and pay the lower amount if you think you'd benefit from it.
Infact because the self declaration only covers Gasoil, unlike road fuel that has blanket taxation, it would be interesting to seee what HMRC had to say or indeed what they would do for using Kerosine for propulsion purposes if it takes your fancy, seing as there are oil & coal burning boats still around.
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Stork_III
Well-Known Member
5% is the VAT payable on all marine diesel use and Domestic heating oil. Duty is something else.
awol
Well-Known Member
Adding a cetane improver, something like 2-stroke oil, to 28 sec heating oil will produce a fuel that simple diesels will find quite palatable though I can't say for how long. Difficult buying heating oil in 25 litre quantities though but it has the advantage of no marker.