Re cutting sails, worth doing?

[Quandary]

Another 'new to me' boat question.
The masthead rigged Moody S31 I recently acquired came with a lot of sails most of which are now in the loft over the garage where they may stay until the boat is sold when they will be put aboard again for a few days, unless I get the chance to go to WHYW again. One of the previous owners must have had aspirations to race because despite being masthead, and having the main traveller in front of the companionway, it has a 24-1 purchase on the backstay.

What I have. On the boat, a used but quite reasonable looking Crusader dacron furling genoa about 140% with a Saturn three reef dacron main, both fine for cruising and should do me my day.
In my loft, the original Lucas fully battened mainsail, described by the broker as 'good' but it feels very soft and I reckon it is well past it. To the skip?
A very nice, hardly used, massive looking Saturn 150 % Mylar composite genoa, obviously bought for racing but hardly used, in a lovely big long zip bag.
A (probably original) Lucas dacron no. 3 jib (about 105 %) shiny white and stiff it looks as if it has never been out of the bag.
A Saturn dacron No. 2/3 genoa, battened, again, no sign of use.
Two serviceable spinnakers one standard and probably original plus a second by Saturn 0.9 oz. both look fine for use if the wife would ever let me again.

I thought I might get a UV strip sewn on the Lucas jib for heavy weather use but the luff is too long to use it with the furler and while the Profurl drum comes off, I do not want to be bothered with that just to do a cruising sail change, is it worth getting it modified with about 1/2metre taken off the luff and the foot reshaped, it wont need padding as it will not be flown partly furled? Or is that going to cost nearly as much as a new furling jib with vertical battens.

The other four sails I will just keep as they are too good to sell at 'used sail junk' prices but while I have a big loft built for just this purpose it is just perpetuating the daft tradition of keeping sails just to get them out and move them on with the boat, I know everyone does it but it makes no sense.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Why not take the lot to Murray at Nicolson-Hughes and ask his opinion? I've done that before and found his advice helpful and pragmatic.

 

[adwuk]

Alternatively take part in WHYW and invite Murray aboard one evening.

 

[William_H]

I would think that modifying the good no 3 might prove a good idea. If it is not too difficult to change jibs ie before you set off ie if you see lots of wind in your voyage you will find that jib works a lot better than the big overlap jib partially furled.
Plus of course it seems like it is a tall short foot so much easier to tack. I reckon you might find you love it. olewill

 

[jwilson]

Modifying the No 3 should not cost too much (far less than a new sail) and provided the cloth is good and heavy enough should give you a useful headsail, provided you actually carry it on board and put it up sometimes. On most boats the problem with the "smaller heavy weather furler sail" is that the full size one is such a pain to stow aboard when you do change.

 

[Norman_E]

You might find that you use the number 3 quite a bit if you get it recut to fit the furler. I knew someone who had a Moody 419 fitted with a high cut yankee that was probably about 100% or slightly bigger, and found it so easy to manage that he, and later the female owner, just used it all the time. The boat went well with it and the mainsail upwind. A cruising chute recut from one of those spinnakers and fitted to a furler mounted ahead of the forestay will give you all you need downwind in light winds.

My own original genoa on a Jeanneau 45.2 was 140% and I found it too big so when I needed a new one I had a slightly smaller one made, estimated about 120%, and have lost nothing in speed. I do wonder whether very large genoas result in the slot between main and genoa being closed too much when going hard upwind.

 

[bitbaltic]

The other four sails I will just keep as they are too good to sell at 'used sail junk' prices

Dunno about that. Consider ebaying them just before easter next year. This is when every man and his dog has promised the grandkids etc that they will finally get a sail on the boat he has been fidling with for months/years and for any parts that are found failed in the week before easter- especially if they have a long lead time on replacements, like sails- shoot up in price on the used market. FOr instance I had a Crusader genoa that came with the boat and didn't fit well. Offered it here midwinter at £120 and no interest. Ebayed it in the week before easter and it got loads of interest eventually selling for nearly five hundred quid- not far off the purchase price of a new dacron I imagine- to a chap who had arranged easter sailing but shredded his genoa in a spring gale. Guess his competitiors were in a similar position also. This theory has worked well for me in the past with other boat bits like winches and electronics. Worth thinking about if you have a huge stash of decent and unwanted sails especially given how popular the boat is and how many owners there will be out there.

 

[doug748]

I can't get a new, large genoa down and bagged on the mooring without a great deal of stress and would not be keen to try it at sea. If contemplating a long trip you might fit an inner forestay and leave the recut sail bagged and hanked on.

As a general rule, I say, never get rid of any serviceable sails, they are a good selling point. The older a boat gets the more it attracts the sort of cheeseparing git like me, who carries sails until they fall into tatters.

A number 3 is taking a fair old lump out of your rig, I might be inclined to fettle up the Saturn No 2/3 as an alternative; with a padded luff it should reef better than the full size item and arguably be more useful generally.

 

[dunedin]

Speak to John Highcock at Saturn Sails. He clearly knows the boat having done three of the sails, and always very helpful.

He might be able to resell the near new sails - certainly he runs a used sails register and better sitting on his listing than in your loft. Laminates with battens sail well, but battened jibs are more hassle than you need for sail changing (ask me how I know).

Personally I wouldn't waste time putting a UV strip on the No.3 - will it be hoisted long enough to matter?
Indeed, personally I wouldn't bother with it at all. If the Crusader 140% genny has a foam luff, it will be best all round solution - and if not invest your money in adding the foam luff.
Life is too short to remove and refit genoas, when a good one with foam luff can work for most of the weather you actually want to be out in (how often will you plan to be doing long upwind legs in F5 upwards, the conditions the No.3 might be useful for)

 

[Quandary]

Points taken, but when we had the Finngulf we had a 105% blade (with vertical battens) made for her on Chris Owens recommendation and one season it was the only headsail we used, but then she was fractional with a very, very big main.
I suppose if you can guarantee a balmy summer??????

 

[dunedin]

Points taken, but when we had the Finngulf we had a 105% blade (with vertical battens) made for her on Chris Owens recommendation and one season it was the only headsail we used, but then she was fractional with a very, very big main.
I suppose if you can guarantee a balmy summer??????

How do the sail plans compare? Suspect the Fingulf had a reasonably generous sailplan and main, the S31 fine with the standard jib but probably under-canvassed most of the time with a blade jib. And don't need balmy with foam luff genny.

PS Aren't you supposed to be avoiding making the boat work too complex / arduous this time round? Changing headsails and lugging anchors on and off the bow seem to be heading in the opposite direction (again) ;-)

 

[Quandary]

Yes, Dunedin, of course you are right, I am beginning to realize I am an obsessive but with a boat you own it for the whole year, sail it occasionally and the rest of the time futer about with it. When I am working on the Canal these thoughts never occur to me, I will have to try harder to develop an interest in the garden.
I was drooling over one of those retro Triumph Bonnevilles the other day but her indoors says 'no way', and anyway you can not change the cams and the pistons the way you could on a real one.

 

[Daydream believer]

I have often wondered if it is necessary to shorten a luff on the jib.
To get maximum sail area could one just have the area of the foot reinforced and a "c" section cut away to fit over or around the furler. A short dynema lashing could be fitted from the top of the furler to the luff of the jib ( a bit like the old cunningham eye we had on early jibs with fixed length wires on OD race sails)so luff tension would go from furler to mast head such that the "C" was still retaining sail shape but not under vertical tension ( rather like not over tensioning a halyard).
When one wants to furl the sail one would unclip the foot below the furler ( snap shackle) & fold the triangle upwards & hold it in place with velcro sewn to the face of the sail. Then furl the sail as normal with halyard tension still retained by the dynema strop to the luff. The triangle would roll in with the sail & as it is a small sail it would not be sailed furled so state of furl is irrelevant.
I originally thought of the idea to get a light wind deck swept racing sail on a furling luff ( but for non furling during racing) but did not blow the cash so did not discuss it with a sail maker.

So if you suggested it to the sail maker it may save some money & start a trend.