Raymarine Wind - Port vs Starboard wrong

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dunedin

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I replaced our Raymarine wind transducer (R28170) in July this year. This was after the 10 year old one started to go rather randomly intermittent.

Initially all seemed well. Then the replacement seemed to also go rather random in recent weeks.

Sailing today the wind speed was fine, and the direction in terms of degrees off the bow was fine (beating, reaching, broad reach etc).
BUT it was showing the wind on the wrong side (ie confused port and starboard).

I could see that the vane at the masthead was aligned and swinging correctly. I could also see that the wind direction was wrong on all of the ST70+ instrument and both chart plotters. Hence not a display issue, but presumably wrong data going onto the network.
The wind vane connects into a Raymarine box marked Wind (E22108) then into the SeaTalkNG network.

I tried redoing the calibration (motoring round in slow circles) and re-aligning the vane. This made no difference.

Any suggestions ?
Thanks
 
Failing wind transducer pod (the E22108) or a bad connection somewhere between the wind transducer and the pod sound like the most likely explanation if 2 wind transducers show the same problem. I doubt you can buy an E22108 now, not even a used one. An iTC-5 will do the job instead which would make a depth pod and log pod redundant if you have them.
 
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There’s no way that the wiring could have been disconnected and put back together the wrong way round?
 
AngusMcDoon said:
Failing wind transducer pod (the E22108) or a bad connection somewhere between the wind transducer and the pod sound like the most likely explanation if 2 wind transducers show the same problem. I doubt you can buy an E22108 now, not even a used one. An iTC-5 will do the job instead which would make a depth pod and log pod redundant if you have them.
Click to expand...
Great thanks.
Unfortunately the kind folks who fitted the new vane when I was away binned the previous vane (it had some newish parts I could have salvaged). Hence currently I don’t know if the new vane has developed a fault, or if it is elsewhere.
I don’t really do 19m masts easily, so not a trivial job to bring down to test it.

Yes I did wonder about doing my usual looking on eBay and trying a differnt Wind Pod (E22108) but you, as ever, are annoyingly correct - none seem to be available second hand.
Thanks for pointing out the modern equivalent iTC-5. But at £275 it is a pricey buy unless / until know the existing box is the issue. (The Airmar speed depth seems to link straight to STng unless I have missed something.)

Is there any way to diagnose the fault without removing the vane?
What sort of wiring fault might end up with an accurate wind direction but offset to the wrong side?

PS. Google has sent me off towards PGN 130306 as the standard for N2K wind data but not what it actually is
 
Could be a couple of wires the wrong way around.

I think direction and speed are both calculated as the product of 3 wires - not direction on one and speed on the other.

MeLRl5F.jpeg

Board is not a Raymarine, but transducer is the same.​

You should probably do the calibration first though: https://support.raymarine.com/s/art...nd-Rudder-angles-different-on-another-display
 
Windspeed is on yellow and direction on blue/green with a varying 90 degree out of phase voltage.

Here's the official Raymarine analog wind vane testing procedure...

https://support.raymarine.com/s/article/Masthead-Wind-Transducer-Test?language=en_US

If you haven't changed any wiring, just the vane, it's unlikely to be the direction wires (blue and green) transposed. If it is a wiring fault it is most likely to be a connection. Check the connections into your interface pod and the deck connector if you have one. One of the blue or green wires not connecting properly will give a strange direction showing.

Here are details of PGN130306:

// - SID Sequence ID. If your device is e.g. boat speed and wind at same time, you can set same SID for different messages
// to indicate that they are measured at same time.
// - WindSpeed Measured wind speed in m/s
// - WindAngle Measured wind angle in radians. If you have value in degrees, use function DegToRad(myval) in call.
// - WindReference Wind reference, see definition of tN2kWindReference
// Output:
// - N2kMsg NMEA2000 message ready to be send.
void SetN2kPGN130306(tN2kMsg &N2kMsg, unsigned char SID, double WindSpeed, double WindAngle, tN2kWindReference WindReference);

where reference is one of...

// Theoretical Wind (ground referenced, referenced to True North; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_True_North=0,
// Theoretical Wind (ground referenced, referenced to Magnetic North; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_Magnetic=1,
// Apparent Wind (relative to the vessel centerline)
N2kWind_Apparent=2,
// Deprecated - We had the typo in older version of the library
N2kWind_Apprent=2,
// Theoretical (Calculated to Centerline of the vessel, referenced to ground; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_True_boat=3,
// Theoretical (Calculated to Centerline of the vessel, referenced to water; calculated using Heading/Speed through Water)
N2kWind_True_water=4,
N2kWind_Error=6,
N2kWind_Unavailable=7

For a wind vane it will always be N2kWind_Apparent
 
dunedin said:
I replaced our Raymarine wind transducer (R28170) in July this year. This was after the 10 year old one started to go rather randomly intermittent.

Initially all seemed well. Then the replacement seemed to also go rather random in recent weeks.

Sailing today the wind speed was fine, and the direction in terms of degrees off the bow was fine (beating, reaching, broad reach etc).
BUT it was showing the wind on the wrong side (ie confused port and starboard).

I could see that the vane at the masthead was aligned and swinging correctly. I could also see that the wind direction was wrong on all of the ST70+ instrument and both chart plotters. Hence not a display issue, but presumably wrong data going onto the network.
The wind vane connects into a Raymarine box marked Wind (E22108) then into the SeaTalkNG network.

I tried redoing the calibration (motoring round in slow circles) and re-aligning the vane. This made no difference.

Any suggestions ?
Thanks
Click to expand...
Many years and a couple of boats ago, I had a boat with the anemometer wand facing aft from the masthead and the system could be set up to display correctly for either forward or aft facing mounting. It’s a long shot, but might it be worth checking to see if the setting - if available on your system - is still correct?
 
Goldie said:
Many years and a couple of boats ago, I had a boat with the anemometer wand facing aft from the masthead and the system could be set up to display correctly for either forward or aft facing mounting. It’s a long shot, but might it be worth checking to see if the setting - if available on your system - is still correct?
Click to expand...
You can do that with mine too. Could it be that, during some other setup/change of display data, Dunedin has inadvertently re set the direction the sender faces?
 
Goldie said:
Many years and a couple of boats ago, I had a boat with the anemometer wand facing aft from the masthead and the system could be set up to display correctly for either forward or aft facing mounting. It’s a long shot, but might it be worth checking to see if the setting - if available on your system - is still correct?
Click to expand...
Not seen any setting for that. But the wind direction is perfect when going into or down wind, and when beating it shows c.40 angle from the bow. Just on the wrong side.
And again for clarity, worked fine for a couple of months, now it is confused with no changes made.
 
AngusMcDoon said:
Windspeed is on yellow and direction on blue/green with a varying 90 degree out of phase voltage.

Here's the official Raymarine analog wind vane testing procedure...

https://support.raymarine.com/s/article/Masthead-Wind-Transducer-Test?language=en_US

If you haven't changed any wiring, just the vane, it's unlikely to be the direction wires (blue and green) transposed. If it is a wiring fault it is most likely to be a connection. Check the connections into your interface pod and the deck connector if you have one. One of the blue or green wires not connecting properly will give a strange direction showing.

Here are details of PGN130306:

// - SID Sequence ID. If your device is e.g. boat speed and wind at same time, you can set same SID for different messages
// to indicate that they are measured at same time.
// - WindSpeed Measured wind speed in m/s
// - WindAngle Measured wind angle in radians. If you have value in degrees, use function DegToRad(myval) in call.
// - WindReference Wind reference, see definition of tN2kWindReference
// Output:
// - N2kMsg NMEA2000 message ready to be send.
void SetN2kPGN130306(tN2kMsg &N2kMsg, unsigned char SID, double WindSpeed, double WindAngle, tN2kWindReference WindReference);

where reference is one of...

// Theoretical Wind (ground referenced, referenced to True North; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_True_North=0,
// Theoretical Wind (ground referenced, referenced to Magnetic North; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_Magnetic=1,
// Apparent Wind (relative to the vessel centerline)
N2kWind_Apparent=2,
// Deprecated - We had the typo in older version of the library
N2kWind_Apprent=2,
// Theoretical (Calculated to Centerline of the vessel, referenced to ground; calculated using COG/SOG)
N2kWind_True_boat=3,
// Theoretical (Calculated to Centerline of the vessel, referenced to water; calculated using Heading/Speed through Water)
N2kWind_True_water=4,
N2kWind_Error=6,
N2kWind_Unavailable=7

For a wind vane it will always be N2kWind_Apparent
Click to expand...
Brilliant thanks. I think the PGN 130306 stuff (that I asked about) is above my pay grade !
I will have a fiddle with the below mast wiring box, though with limited expectations as in a nice dry area and not touched for 3 years.
May prod an avo meter in there as well, but won’t tell much with boat on pontoon and fixed wind direction. (Motoring in circles with avo meter below decks might be Darwin Award territory.).
I may need to get vane brought down and borrow the tester device again.
 
PGN130306 is simple. It send 3 values of interest:
- Wind speed in m/s
- Wind angle in radians
- A value that lets you know what the wind angle refers to. For a MHU this will always be boat centreline apparent wind

There's also a sequence identifier but that's irrelevant for a MHU.
 
What's you hang up about going up a 19m mast. Its really no different to going up a 10m mast. You would be a s safe as houses using 2 hayards and a decent harness. I'd do it for you except your pay grade has already been questioned and you'll not accept the travel expenses (and accomodation - though I could camp out on a yacht with a 19m mast).

It would answer a whole lot of questions if you but bite the bullet, or keep your eyes tight shut.

Jonathan
 
Neeves said:
What's you hang up about going up a 19m mast. Its really no different to going up a 10m mast. You would be a s safe as houses using 2 hayards and a decent harness. I'd do it for you except your pay grade has already been questioned and you'll not accept the travel expenses (and accomodation - though I could camp out on a yacht with a 19m mast).

It would answer a whole lot of questions if you but bite the bullet, or keep your eyes tight shut.

Jonathan
Click to expand...
I have been up the mast previously - winched up and on the yard crane.
But the crane is expensive, or needs second person to use winch.
In the absence of assistant I need to pay the riggers to go up.
PS. Training up the grand children but their parents haven’t allowed them up to second spreaders yet.
 
Ignoring the weather there are a number of devices allowing an individual to climb a mast, tape ladders, or ascenders - both of which might be cheaper than the rigger and much cheaper then a cherry picker. I would have thought such devices are essential equipment for all owners - am I wrong?

Jonathan
 
Neeves said:
Ignoring the weather there are a number of devices allowing an individual to climb a mast, tape ladders, or ascenders - both of which might be cheaper than the rigger and much cheaper then a cherry picker. I would have thought such devices are essential equipment for all owners - am I wrong?

Jonathan
Click to expand...
I’m sure that 90% of us are equipped to go up the mast, we certainly are. A bit more comfortable up ours than most moderate sized monos though. And the weather… even in the deep south it’s 6 C and blowing 20-30kn. Not ideal, I daresay it’s much worse north of Hadrian’s wall. They’re tough up there, but not stupid.
 
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