Raymarine Axiom-9 MFD and AIS

[Yellow Ballad]

@alan did you get to the bottom of this? I fired up my new seatalk network with my Quark 032 AIS. Although I don't have an Axiom, my I70 is showing AIS off in the top corner and I can't find a way to turn it on.

I70 is showing the quark, quark is showing AIS over wifi but I can only assume the quark isn't outputting on the NMEA2K network.

 

[PaulRainbow]

I thought i'd try one of these Quark A032 AIS units. Easy enough to intall, although the cables could do with being longer. Set it up to work with OpenCPN on my laptop. AIS works OK as far as i can see. Depth fluctuates from --- to 2.4m to -1000000000.0m (2.4m is correct). Water temp is similar. If i enable the port that my USB GPS is connected to, the data from the Quark is completely lost, intermittently. I've emailed them and had a quick enough response, although the questions asked make no sense to me. Will contact them again tomorrow and see what can be done.

I did some similar testing with a vYacht thing a while back and it was a pain in the backside. There's much to be said for using mainstream products, IMO.

 

[alan]

Yellow Ballad/Paul,
Apologies for the delay in answering. No I never got to the bottom of it. The last thing that was tried by Quark was a new version of firmware which I loaded but the problem was the same - the Axiom can see the A032 and receives (what I suppose are) heart-beat messages every so often. My I70 shows the same as yours but I remember reading some Raymarine stuff which gave me the impression that the I70 receives the data from the Axiom (but am not sure). The I70 manual says that the instrument must be receiving COG and SOG to display AIS - but I took my boat out for a motor a couple of weeks ago and the I70 still does not display AIS.
I have more or less given up on this and am still not sure where the problem lays (Quark or Raymarine) and will use Navionics on my phone for AIS when I need it.

Just from a technical perspective I would like to know what the answer is .................... the last firmware I received from Quark was supposed to correct a possible problem with "NMEA data" (I am not sure which NMEA data they were referring to??).

Good luck to both of you and if I get any more information I will post it up.
Alan.

 

[alan]

I would like to reserect this old thread (from March this year) concerning a Quark A032-AIS converter:

I have a very specific question for anyone who uses a Quark A-032-AIS NMEA0183/NMEA2K converter with Raymarine Lighthouse -3 software running on an Axiom-9 MFD:
Are you able receive AIS data at the Axiom??


I am only able to see "heart beat" messages from the Quark at the Axiom buffer (i.e. no AIS messages) but can receive AIS data via WiFi on my Navionics app on my I-phone. Raymarine recommend using an Actisense converter and have no knowledge of the Quark converter.

Any help with the above question would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Alan.

 

[prv]

I am only able to see "heart beat" messages from the Quark at the Axiom buffer (i.e. no AIS messages)

That seems fairly conclusive that the Quark is not transmitting the AIS PGNs.

If you wanted to be belt, braces, and piece-of-string certain that there wasn't some weird filtering going on in the Raymarine diagnostic display that was dropping AIS PGNs only, then you could connect a CAN analyser for an independent view - the pro ones we use at work are unreasonably expensive, but I think there are some hobbyist options available nowadays at a much more sensible price - but it seems rather unlikely.

Personally I think I'd be returning the Quark thing for not doing what it's advertised to, though appreciate there might be some resistance to that after six months.

Pete

 

[captainboo]

I know that it is not your specific setup i.e. an Axiom MFD but I have a Quark AIS receiver feeding the Quark A-032-AIS NMEA0183/NMEA2K which sends the information over the Raymarine STNG network (as well as wirelessly to Android devices running Navionics).

The AIS is correctly displayed on my Raymarine I70s at the helm identically to what is seen on Navionics. This would surely suggest that the sentences transmitted by the Quark unit must be compatible with Raymarine devices.

 

[KeelsonGraham]

I’ve just installed an Axiom 9 Pro and AIS 700. Didn’t have to do anything to see AIS targets overlayed on the chart. Have you checked the Network tab to confirm that the Axiom can see your device?

 

[alan]

Thanks for the above replies, and answers below:
Yes, the Quark device is seen by the Axiom but only "heartbeat" messages are being received at the Axiom buffer (no actual AIS data PNGs).
I also have an I70 instrument which also does not display any AIS targets (however I seem to remember reading somewhere in the Raymarine documents that the I70 receives the AIS data via the MFD ..... but am not sure??).

Thanks, Pete, this was also Raymarine's and my conclusion ...... but I do not want to buy an analyser just for this problem!! Do you know if the CAN bus protocol has a communication layer similar to TCP in an Ethernet TCP/IP environment??

However, Quark's customer service is excellent, and they are still working on the problem; my contact was out of the office last week but I am presuming that they have a CAN data analyser and they will eventually come up with a solution. I even get answers/suggestions from them at weekends!! As Raymarine products are widely used then I would expect them to be interested to solve this problem - if in fact the probelm does lie with the Quark.

I will come back when/if the problem is identified, but thanks for the help, guys!

Alan.

 

[Carduelis]

I also have the Axiom 9 and do receive AIS messages via the Quark. However they aren't complete insofar as if I click on AIS info to see e. g. the name of the target vessel, it isn't there.

 

[alan]

I also have the Axiom 9 and do receive AIS messages via the Quark. However they aren't complete insofar as if I click on AIS info to see e. g. the name of the target vessel, it isn't there.

Thanks Carduelis,
Which version of Axiom software are you running?
Which AIS receiver do you have -is that also a Quark?

Thanks in advance,
Alan.

 

[prv]

Yes, the Quark device is seen by the Axiom but only "heartbeat" messages are being received at the Axiom buffer (no actual AIS data PNGs).

Yes - I don't remember the proper terminology, but there's a couple of PGNs that everything is supposed to implement, with which a device announces its presence on the bus and a few bits of information about itself. Presumably that's what you're seeing, and it usefully shows that everything is properly connected and working at the electrical level.

I also have an I70 instrument which also does not display any AIS targets (however I seem to remember reading somewhere in the Raymarine documents that the I70 receives the AIS data via the MFD ..... but am not sure??).

That seems unlikely. If the data is on the STng bus then it's on the bus. The only reason it would go via the MFD is if that MFD had an NMEA0183 input and the AIS was connected to that, with the MFD translating it into NMEA2k and sending it out on the STng bus.

Do you know if the CAN bus protocol has a communication layer similar to TCP in an Ethernet TCP/IP environment??

If you mean does it have a channel-oriented protocol, then not really as far as I know (this isn't really my area of expertise, I just brush up against it occasionally at work). Of course, an application protocol could build one on top of the lower-level packets, but N2K is based on J1939 and as far as I know neither of them do this. The closest they get is to string together a small sequence of packets to carry a larger payload than would fit in a single one.

If you're used to looking at TCP traffic, be aware that Wireshark has support for CAN nowadays, though I can't advise on the best budget way to get packets to it off the wire; the way we do it at work wouldn't be the best choice for you.

Pete

 

[alan]

Thanks a lot Pete. Very useful information. I am retired, so no longer up to speed on the current way of implementing even TCP/IP; also, I was an RF engineer and only occasionally came up against LAN implementation etc.

I am sue that Quark will have all the tools necessary to investigate this a bit deeper.

Alan.

 

[Carduelis]

Thanks Carduelis,
Which version of Axiom software are you running?
Which AIS receiver do you have -is that also a Quark?

Thanks in advance,
Alan.

Afraid I don't know the Axiom version offhand but it was updated in May so fairly recent. The AIS feed comes from a Standard Horizon VHF.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks a lot Pete. Very useful information. I am retired, so no longer up to speed on the current way of implementing even TCP/IP; also, I was an RF engineer and only occasionally came up against LAN implementation etc.

I am sue that Quark will have all the tools necessary to investigate this a bit deeper.

Alan.

The Axion and the Quark both use standard N2K PGNs. |If you have connected the Quark to the N2K network and the Axiom "sees" it, but there is no AIS data, i'd suggest there is a fault with the Quark. Just because it's sending data over wifi, doesn't mean it's sending it over N2K, it does prove that the AIS data is being received though.

I have one of the Quark devices here, i connected it to the N2K network to send data to a laptop, it did send some AIS data, but some other data was not sent correctly. They were supposed to be investigating the problems and i spent time gathering log files for them, they were very difficult to deal with, giving me incorrect instructions for gathering the data and sending me incorrect software to do so. I was sent one firmware update, which partly fixed the problems, but then i didn't hear any more from them. The Actisense device i replaced it with works flawlessly.

 

[alan]

Thanks, Paul. Raymarine also recommended the Actisense.
I hate to leave problems unresolved though and am still hoping that Quark will do some more investigations.

Alan.

 

[alan]

All,
Last word on this subject - I promise!!
After a number of tests fully supported by Quark engineers, It appeared the problem is some sort of incompatibility between the EASY AIS NMEA-0183 data and the Quark 0183 to N2K converter . 0183 data was being converted to WiFi and USB but not to N2K!! Quark did not have an Easy-AIS receiver in their lab to test with.


So, I decided to upgrade my system to a Quark AIS Receiver with built in WiFi converter/N2K converter/0183 converter and USB converter . The unit I purchased is the A-026+.
I received it yesterday and tried it on the boat today and .................................................................................it worked with Lighthouse-3 right off once the GPS had locked.

So, I am not able to fully understand why the A-023 would not convert 0183 data to N2k Data.

But I am happy with Quark's support and also happy with having an AIS receiver/N2K converter all in one box!
Thanks to everyone's input over the last six months and beware about mixing products from different manufacturers even if they are supposed to be compatible. This should be less of a problem in the future with N2K where the physical interfaces are actually defined!!!

Alan.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

I thought i'd try one of these Quark A032 AIS units. Easy enough to intall, although the cables could do with being longer. Set it up to work with OpenCPN on my laptop. AIS works OK as far as i can see. Depth fluctuates from --- to 2.4m to -1000000000.0m (2.4m is correct). Water temp is similar. If i enable the port that my USB GPS is connected to, the data from the Quark is completely lost, intermittently. I've emailed them and had a quick enough response, although the questions asked make no sense to me. Will contact them again tomorrow and see what can be done.

I did some similar testing with a vYacht thing a while back and it was a pain in the backside. There's much to be said for using mainstream products, IMO.

My Vyacht wifi went in the bin after 1 season of faffing.

 

[Yellow Ballad]

After a number of tests fully supported by Quark engineers, It appeared the problem is some sort of incompatibility between the EASY AIS NMEA-0183 data and the Quark 0183 to N2K converter . 0183 data was being converted to WiFi and USB but not to N2K!! Quark did not have an Easy-AIS receiver in their lab to test with.

Good to hear the problem was with the Quark and not the raymarine stuff/AIS Unit. Sounds like the same issue with my SeaTraceR transponder(which is the same as the Comar CSB 200 and the same AIS chip as Em-Trak). Hopefully Quark will work out the issue as I do like their products and the Wifi part if it is an attraction. I don't really want to have to sell it and buy a Actisense unless I really have to.

Can I ask who you were speaking to at Quark? I may have to ask them a message myself.

Tom

 

[alan]

I was talking to Harry Yuan (pricipally).
I find the Quark equipment very competitive on price and they make units that will do most things that you need. Maybe my problem was with the Easy AIS receiver (??) but it worked fine for years on NMEA 0183 connected to a Raymarine C70 plotter; I only had problems when I installed the Axiom and the N2K bus and tried to get it to talk to the Quark 0183 to N2k converter. The easy AIS is quoted to work on NMEA/0183 RS232 (Data +ve and signal ground) and I understand from their docs that Quark use NMEA0183 RS422; but even with a Protocol Bridge from Quark, I was unable to get the conversion to N2K working.

I personally found Quark engineers very helpful and also interested to solve any problems.
Good luck!
Alan.