Quality Ocean cruising boats?

wildmail

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We are seeking a good used single hull for ocean passaging (Circumnavigation) - it must be a well known brand and renowned for top quality and yet in the price range up to approx. 340000 USD.

The lenght of the boat is not that important - but we would
need at least three cabins (and preferably 4).

We know brands like Hallbarg Rassy and Swan What else should we look for?
 

LadyJessie

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The proven blue water "go anywhere" cruisers are Najad, Malo (Malö in original Swedish), Sweden Yachts and Hallberg Rassy. Swans are very well built but IMHO make too many compromises towards the racing needs to be really useful as a cruiser.
 

Goldie

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To quote: 'The proven blue water "go anywhere" cruisers are Najad, Malo (Malö in original Swedish), Sweden Yachts and Hallberg Rassy'. Not biased towards Swedish boats then? I agree that those are SOME of the proven blue water boats , but proven boats are not exclusively those (as your post suggests).

I think owners of the likes of Oysters, Rustlers, Nicholsons, Vancouvers, Rival Bowmans (just to mention a few UK built boats) might disagree with you, not to mention myriad other builders around the globe.
 

LadyJessie

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Sorry, I did not express myself very well. You are correct that I gave my personal preferences, knowing that there are other ideas on this issue.

There is no perfect cruising boat. Every boat is a compromise and you have to find the compromise that suits you best. People have gone around the world in basically every known boat type on the market. I would just add my personal opinion that if you choose a boat of a very high build quality, like my favoured ones, you will probably have more peace of mind as a circumnavigation puts a lot of wear and tear on a boat. Build quality matters more to a long distance cruiser than say a holiday Med sailor.

And yes, I have to declare that I own one of those Swedish cruisers and I grew up 30 km from the place where they are all built.
 

TigaWave

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Having sailed a Sweden and a Bavaria on ocean passages personally I'd go with the Bavaria given the choice. As to the original question it really depends what you are looking for and where you want to explore, how much space you want etc etc...
I like Tartans and Bowmans
 

LadyJessie

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[ QUOTE ]
Having sailed a Sweden and a Bavaria on ocean passages personally I'd go with the Bavaria given the choice.

[/ QUOTE ]Very interesting. I have not come across that opinion before. Care to expand?
 

dikhaig

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After looking at loads of different boats and having taught on lots we decided on an Oyster. We felt it gave great value for money a bit cheaper than the equivalent HR or Swan, but with a superb build quality and reputation. We found a 1990 Oyster 55, totally refitted in 2003 for about the price you are looking at.

Best of luck in finding a boat!
 

LadyJessie

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Dikhaig brings up another important point that you need to consider: resale value. I have the feeling that Hallbergs et al keep their value better than Oyster or any of the other named UK boats. I don't have the latest pricelists here but when I was in the market for a new boat I noticed that a similar size Oyster was significantly more expensive than a Hallberg-Rassy 53. But as the poster notes, second hand the Oyster is cheaper than an HR. Great if you are buying a second hand boat, not so great if you want to buy new.
 

jimbaerselman

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OK. my Oyster was pretty small, just a 406. Bought in 1995 for £97,000 (not well maintained). Sold ten years later in very good condition for £97,000 - but readly for a full engine re-build (which cost €3,500). Depreciation - about 1% pa (plus inflation of course, which many choose to ignore!). Not bad.

I don't know how the HR's do, but I'm sure an ex-owner can tell us!
 

Richard10002

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I think mine, (Moody 44), was bought new in 1995 for about £125,000. My father paid £127,500 in 2003, and I bought it off him for £120,000 in 2006, ( we agreed £125,000, so I benefitted from a bit of nepotism <g>).
 

jimbaerselman

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Yes. For size he'd need a 44ft vessel.

One dispassionate way of looking at how robust a (GRP) vessel is likely to be is to compare displacement and rigging diameter for a given length. 40ft HR, Oyster and similar displace some 10 tons, main rigging around 10mm in diameter. A similar sized Bavaria displaces around half that, with 8mm main rigging (same with many Beneteau etc vessels).
 

robmurray

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Controversial alternative idea for you. What about an X412 or X442. Fast and light yes, associated with racing yes, but incredible build quaility and strength. We changed from a Starlight 39 (classic ocean boat) to an X412 and seem to have lost nothing in sea keeping (been in some big seas and gales) and gained amazing performance. We are planning to circumnavigate in ours. Dont forget - most long term cruisers never / rarely see wind over 35Kt - biggest issue is light winds. I know you are all going to disagree!
 

LadyJessie

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Richard and Jim: you did well on price, congratulations. But I guess you bought second hand to start with? The point I was trying to make was that when I looked at the Oyster/HR market some five years ago, it seemed to me to be a pretty large difference between the new price and second hand value of an Oyster. I.e. they lost a lot "being taken out of the yard". This was not the case with the Swedish cruisers I looked at then; second hand value was very often very similar to new price. My present boat (Sweden Yachts) is a case in point: it was six years old when I bought it but the asking price was higher than the listprice from the yard for a new boat. The reason the seller could get away with that was that there was at the time an 18 month wait for a new boat and I did not want to do that. Subsequently I have been offered more for my boat than I paid for it, but I will never know how serious that was because she is not for sale.
 

LadyJessie

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[ QUOTE ]
most long term cruisers never / rarely see wind over 35Kt - biggest issue is light winds. I know you are all going to disagree!

[/ QUOTE ]I agree! The X-yachts are great boats, very similar in design ideas to the Sweden Yachts. It is just that the X is a little more racy and the Sweden a little more cruiser. I totally agree with light wind performance being important; I often sail when heavy cruisers motor. Having said that, heavy weather performance is important as well - you will find yourself in 50-60 kts wind sometime. That is why I would go for some of the boats mentioned above and would never ever go for a Bavaria.
 

npf1

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As pretty much all cruisers spend the majority of the time not at sea, what the boat is like at anchor should also be be high on the list of considerations. Things that spring to mind are pilot house, good ventilation, minimal rolling at anchor, storage etc. Also, a good proportion of the time at sea can be spent under iron sail, 30%-50% at a guess, so fuel capacity etc also comes high on the list.

Ease of maintenance should be near the top of the list too, unless you want your cruising to meet the 'maintenance in exotic places' definition. Teak decks, varnish, watermakers etc all eat into crusing/exploring time.

The last people I would heed are those who make/sell boats - most of what they spew is just the usual marketing guff.

LadyJessie probably summed it up about right. I guess the problem is you need the experience a cruising boat to decide what your ideal one is!!!
 
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