PhillM
Well-Known Member
Found out last week that Ginger biscuits cure hangovers too 
Pump them full of Stugeron
- Thread starter Amulet
- Start date
ianabc
Well-Known Member
Most of the drugs quoted are on the list of
anticholinergic drugs
that peer reviewed reaseach has indicated contribute to dementia
see Dr Gray's paper published in the JAMA (Journal of the American Medical Association) Internal Medicine
refered to here:
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/838788
Even Low Doses Implicated
But people taking just the minimum effective dose of these agents for prolonged periods qualified as having high use and were found to be at greater risk for dementia compared with those not taking such medicines.
"This is not excessive use," Dr Gray said. "Many of these agents are used chronically, and chronic use — even at low doses — would put you in the highest risk category."
LIST
https://www.uea.ac.uk/documents/330...inergics/088bb9e6-3ee2-4b75-b8ce-b2d59dc538c2
anticholinergic drugs
that peer reviewed reaseach has indicated contribute to dementia
see Dr Gray's paper published in the JAMA (Journal of the American Medical Association) Internal Medicine
refered to here:
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/838788
Even Low Doses Implicated
But people taking just the minimum effective dose of these agents for prolonged periods qualified as having high use and were found to be at greater risk for dementia compared with those not taking such medicines.
"This is not excessive use," Dr Gray said. "Many of these agents are used chronically, and chronic use — even at low doses — would put you in the highest risk category."
LIST
https://www.uea.ac.uk/documents/330...inergics/088bb9e6-3ee2-4b75-b8ce-b2d59dc538c2
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shan
Well-Known Member
Found out last week that Ginger biscuits cure hangovers too
Especially when they are covered in dark chocolate.....yummmm
andygc
Well-Known Member
A link that doesn't require membership of Medscape http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4358759/
The research studied cumulative use in people over 65 - that is, people who were taking anticholinergic drugs daily for prolonged periods - years. The group who took an anticholinergic daily for up to one year for treatment other than for depression had no increase in risk of dementia or Alzheimer's disease, The study is not relevant to somebody taking a few pills for seasickness every now and then. In any event, the drug in this thread, cinnarizine, isn't listed in the drugs considered in the study, presumably because it didn't meet the criteria for inclusion ("strong" anticholinergic effect).
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Thistle
Well-Known Member
First Aiders are just that. Specifically, they are not qualified to either prescribe or dispense drugs. The general advice to First Aiders, therefore, is not give any drug to anyone but, where appropriate, to assist casualties to take their own medication.
An exception to this is made for those trained to use the Category C First Aid kit (which does contain drugs for seasickness.) They are advised that they must make sure that for any drug used
* it is for the condition
* it is not out of date
* it is taken as advised
* any precautions are strictly followed
* the recommended dose is not exceeded
* you keep a record of the name and dose of the medication as well as the time and method of administration.
I would suggest that "taken as advised" and "recommended dose" are as stated on the patient information leaflet (PIL) which should be in the box with the drug.
Before a First Aider st sea goes beyond this guideline they should first seek medical advice via the coastguard.
An exception to this is made for those trained to use the Category C First Aid kit (which does contain drugs for seasickness.) They are advised that they must make sure that for any drug used
* it is for the condition
* it is not out of date
* it is taken as advised
* any precautions are strictly followed
* the recommended dose is not exceeded
* you keep a record of the name and dose of the medication as well as the time and method of administration.
I would suggest that "taken as advised" and "recommended dose" are as stated on the patient information leaflet (PIL) which should be in the box with the drug.
Before a First Aider st sea goes beyond this guideline they should first seek medical advice via the coastguard.
andygc
Well-Known Member
Just an afterthought. Amulet, if that is an accurate account of an RYA first aid course tutor's advice, I think you should contact the RYA's training manager with details of which course it was you attended. I doubt that the RYA would be happy with a tutor who advises students to ignore the instructions for use provided with a drug.
alan_d
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the non-Medscape link. I would agree with your view that this research, even if replicated, is irrelevant to the occasional use of anti-cholinergics for motion sickness. It seems almost churlish to point out the typo - the penultimate word in your post should be anticholinergic.
Vanilla
Well-Known Member
Im just the same....slight swell and I'm very ill, F8 ok well as far as sickness is concerned! and despite what lots of people claim, the very worst thing for me is to be put on the helm to solve the sickness. That makes me even worse.
Only solution for me is to go below, lie down and shut my eyes. Sturgeon usually work ok..ish as long as taken hrs before sailing but make me very drowsy. I get motion sick on buses too...��
Seajet
...
I knew an experienced sailor who took the normal recommended dose of Stugeron ' just as a precaution ' - he fell asleep in the cockpit and I was unable to wake him, rather scary at the time.
I've known other people take it and no ill effects, if taken long enough in advance it seems to help against seasickness; but I strongly suggest first trying it when one's awareness is not safety critical, in case it knocks you out as it did my chum.
I've known other people take it and no ill effects, if taken long enough in advance it seems to help against seasickness; but I strongly suggest first trying it when one's awareness is not safety critical, in case it knocks you out as it did my chum.
KAL
Well-Known Member
We carry Kwells (hyoscine) as they seem to work very quickly and don't cause anywhere near as much drowsiness as cinnarizine (stugeron).
Ginger is excellent, but we have also had great success with large doses of Vitamin C, which seems to work pretty instantly. This idea was from something I read a few years ago. Probably something on web if you google it.
Ginger is excellent, but we have also had great success with large doses of Vitamin C, which seems to work pretty instantly. This idea was from something I read a few years ago. Probably something on web if you google it.
andygc
Well-Known Member
Thank you, corrected.
Seajet
...
Just a couple of non-drug seasickness tips, if suffering;
the mineral water bottles with a teat to suck on are very helpful if being jostled around, they are used by small aircraft aircrew - if being ill with a bucket handy try to have at least sips of water as dehydration is a serious issue, if water is being ' lost ' into the bucket a fair bit of water may be required -
- also re hydration, when not being sick too often ' Dioralyte ' helps replace the lost vitamins, electrolytes, minerals etc; pleasant mild blackcurrant taste, dissolve a sachet in a tumble of water - available off the shelf in chemists, around £4.50 for 4 sachets, well worth having in the First Aid kit.
the mineral water bottles with a teat to suck on are very helpful if being jostled around, they are used by small aircraft aircrew - if being ill with a bucket handy try to have at least sips of water as dehydration is a serious issue, if water is being ' lost ' into the bucket a fair bit of water may be required -
- also re hydration, when not being sick too often ' Dioralyte ' helps replace the lost vitamins, electrolytes, minerals etc; pleasant mild blackcurrant taste, dissolve a sachet in a tumble of water - available off the shelf in chemists, around £4.50 for 4 sachets, well worth having in the First Aid kit.
alan_d
Well-Known Member
While hyoscine generally works faster than cinnarizine, in recommended doses it is also more likely to cause drowsiness. Your experience is clearly at variance with this, which illustrates the problem of recommending motion-sickness medication anecdotally. There is a great deal of individual variation in the dose-response to different drugs, so what works for you (or me) won't necessarily suit someone else, but when selecting a remedy to try it makes sense to start with what is likely to be the case for most people. Most people will experience fewer unwanted effects from a dose of cinnarizine sufficient to prevent nausea than an equivalent dose of hyoscine.
VicS
Well-Known Member
I think Tammany was referring to the simple ones with a bead which presses on the acupressure point
Some help ... I think. The children used themwith some success. For car travel as well
Not tried the electronic gadgets ... to expensive
Sailingsaves
Well-Known Member
I am no medic.
I have only been seasick once. Took stugeon and it as returned quite soon. So took another.
This does work:
Take tablet and bread (or biscuits or anything stodgy) and try to get them to pee.
An empty bladder and full stomach is known to alleviate seasickness. Full bladder and empty stomach is a "no, no".
Let them sleep on deck. Will wake up feeling fine.
Don't let anyone go to sea when they are exhausted, full of alcohol, empty stomach and then hang upside down fixing something down below - that is what made me seasick.
I have only been seasick once. Took stugeon and it as returned quite soon. So took another.
This does work:
Take tablet and bread (or biscuits or anything stodgy) and try to get them to pee.
An empty bladder and full stomach is known to alleviate seasickness. Full bladder and empty stomach is a "no, no".
Let them sleep on deck. Will wake up feeling fine.
Don't let anyone go to sea when they are exhausted, full of alcohol, empty stomach and then hang upside down fixing something down below - that is what made me seasick.
explores
Well-Known Member
I have never been sea sick or even felt like it in all weathers.SWMBO says its because i have no feeling.
kalanka
Well-Known Member
I once sailed with a neurologist who held the view that Stugeron and Kwells operate by entirely separate physiological mechanisms and so can be taken at the same time. Taking first one and then the other seems like a good way of giving the symptoms a double bash and would be a great deal more controllable than taking a bellyful of either compound.
fisherman
Well-Known Member
SWMBO has tried coming to sea with me but it's hopeless, just dry heaving all day. No better on the Brittany ferry. I wondered about sending her on the JST's Lord Nelson, where they leave you to moan for a day and then chase you up the mast.
Seajet
...
I never thought Kwells were potent at anything - more placebo effect, but mixing any drugs seems a Bad Idea to me.
My uncle is in hospital as I type thanks to the anti-sickness pills ( I don't know what ) he was prescribed apparently reacting very badly with all the other anti-prostate cancer stuff he is on.
Seajet
...
Sorry for the double reply everyone-
Fisherman,
I seem to be reasonably bullet-proof re seasickness on sailing boats, by pure luck; however I think the damping effect of the keel beneath and mast above is my main help - my boat has, for her size, tremendous stability in both deep ballast ratio and beam form - but when the mast is down, she is a bit tippy, having lost the roll damping of the rig.
I may not need stugeron on a sailing boat, but I don't fancy my chances on an anchored or drifting fishing mobo...