Princess 38 or Moonraker or............

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foxgoose

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Advice sought from the wise ones.

Going out to Malta next month to (hopefully) buy a boat.

Choice is limited to the few available with permanent berths in the marina near where we live which include-

1. Ancient plywood Chris Craft which looks scary.

2. Ancient refurbed 50 ft dutch steel job which has a certain romantic appeal but probably totally impractical for heistant newbie like me and probably does 5 knots backwards max with guaranteed mal-de-mer.

3. Slightly less ancient 1977 Moonraker 36 which has been immaculately kept up by professional marine engineer (known to me) and re-engined in 98 with nice IVECO 330's (450 hrs)

4. Less ancient again 1985 Princess 38 with 255 Volvos (760 hrs) reputed to be in very good nick.

Was really looking for something newer, smaller and easier to singlehand but ... nothing doing.

So I'll probably choose from the last two but I have a memory of having seen vaguely derisory references to Moonrakers here in the past.

Any advice, warnings, observations ?????

Ta

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hm. I wouldn't necessarily jump at any of these, anyway, difficult to judge condition You seem to want a biggish boat with lots of space. In which case, I would say that that the thing that will make the biggest difference to yr enjoyment of a boat in malta is ...airconditioning. Do any have this?

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The Princess, every time. Moonrakers are regarded as elegant classics by some and as badly built overvalued rubbish by others. I don't know enough to make an informed decision but my old man (retired marine surveyor) always calls for his ten foot barge pole when the word "Moonraker" is mentioned.

But is it the right way to proceed? Are you buying the boat purely to sell it on, as a means of getting a berth? (in which case definitely go for the Princess, as being the most saleable). If not, I would be very hesitant, however difficult it might be to get a berth by any other means, about a purchase influenced only by the fact that a berth came with it.

All imho.

<hr width=100% size=1>Je suis Marxiste - tendance Groucho
 
Get the princess. It does however seem an odd way to choose a boat. Moonrakers do seem to be surounded by nostalgia but. The princess will be rock solid and easy to sell whenever.

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn
 
Thanks all

I know it's a weird way to choose a boat. Problem is it's a small government owned marina with low fees, a 3-year wait list and a fair amount of local skullduggery involved in berth allocation.

By buying an existing boat outright with berth included - the boat stays on the berth and I'm in - no argument.

Next year I can choose a more suitable boat at leisure and apply to change vessels.

I fancy a smaller walk round design around 35ft like a Nimbus Nova or the largest Ombrine.

For now it sounds like the Princess - is it practical to singlehand this type of flybridge boat?

Do they have a reasonable reputation for seakeeping? They get some fairly heavy seas around Malta - even in Summer.

TCM you're dead right about aircon, the temp hit 45 last summer and we had to put it in three rooms of the villa.

Is it practical to retrofit a basic system to the Princess?

We would be happy with around 27/28 C in the saloon only (ie not US standards -where you have to put a sweater on).


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Thanks all

I know it's a weird way to choose a boat. Problem is it's a small government owned marina with low fees, a 3-year wait list and a fair amount of local skullduggery involved in berth allocation.

By buying an existing boat outright with berth included - the boat stays on the berth and I'm in - no argument.

Next year I can choose a more suitable boat at leisure and apply to change vessels.

I fancy a smaller walk round design around 35ft like a Nimbus Nova or the largest Ombrine.

For now it sounds like the Princess - is it practical to singlehand this type of flybridge boat?

Do they have a reasonable reputation for seakeeping? They get some fairly heavy seas around Malta - even in Summer.

TCM you're dead right about aircon, the temp hit 45 last summer and we had to put it in three rooms of the villa.

Is it practical to retrofit a basic system to the Princess?

We would be happy with around 27/28 C in the saloon only (ie not US standards -where you have to put a sweater on).


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Re: aircon

yep, you can retrofit, loads of peeps will do this for you. Ususally, if you had aircion, you would also have a generator as otherwise you can only use aircon in port, never at anchor cos the batteries can only start the engine or run the lights, not supply any real power for significant amount of time.

Actually, aorund there, cooling off options include getting the thing out of the marina - usually far hotter and stickier than just off the coast: anchor out for a secluded and peacful night away from it all.

In yr position I wd get the boat and use it for a while before choosing what you do or don't need, otherwise you end up with a list of stuff you think you need rather than stuff you really know you need.

Note also you won't recoup the cost of retrofitting aircon if you only keep it a year.

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No. Single handed not realy practical. I have loads of experiece but never found a fool proof way. Less dead flat and no wind at all of course.. Just need some one to slip a bow rope on. If the Princess cant handle the sea, nowt else will.

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn
 
Re: ah but in the med ...

i think you CAN do single handed moorings in the med, moored stern-to. in fact i have done it, so it must be not too hard. Cos the boat is hull-to hull squeezed between boats either side, it is far less affected by wind than side-to berth as in UK- you just have to make sure it is stopped fore and aft as the other boats hold it sideways see? Then attach rope astern if being blown off the quay, or bowline ahead if being in.

Well, yes okay, much better if you have someone to help.

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While you are in Malta look up SD Yachts..they have a good range.
I also saw on the net an Aermar 36 called fizzwizz for sale in malta...looked allright and think it had aircon. Owner was desperate to sell so might go for a song.
If you want something to work on and cheap there is a Birchwood 35 called Talisman that I have looked at again at S & D yachts..that is if you are into Semi displacement. Same boat as mine..solid, but will need some cosmetics.
Moonrakers have problems in following seas...but they do still have a certain look.
If in doubt go for the Princess.

www.sdyachts.com
www.favell.co.uk (for the Italcraft Aermar)


best regards

Steve.

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Re: ah but in the med ...

Oh. Arr. I see. Yes well ok I suppose if in auto scissor actioned vice grip. Why does every marina not have one??

<hr width=100% size=1> <font color=blue>No one can force me to come here.<font color=red> I'm a volunteer!!.<font color=blue>

Haydn
 
Foxgoose,

I was in Malta last week and the other (non gov't) marina that runs along the eastern side of Manoel Island does/might have spaces for this summer. Granted it's not as cheap as the Gov't marina but it still wasn't bad (well bad compared to UK prices). Great backdrop from the marina to Valetta too....

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Moonrakers are reputedly scary in any kind of a following sea. The P38 is a more modern design. However if you dont like it I guess its going to be difficult to sell the P38 in Malta without the berth so make sure you buy it well under the UK market price so if worst comes to worst, you can ship it back to the UK for sale and keep the berth. Reckon on about £5k for that. Also I think I'm right in saying that Malta has no VAT so you've also got to buy it at 17.5% less than UK market value to take account of that as well
A/c will cost you about £5k throughout the boat and £7k for a decent generator if you want to power it away from the marina. Dont be tempted to undersize either the aircon or the gennie. You need at least a 6kva gennie

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Steady....

What's your problem with Princesses then? You're just jealous cos you haven't won the lottery, so you can't afford one. Or gold taps for your house. Or a holiday in Majorca.

Bet you've got one of those clapped out wooden boats as well haven't you. Bet it hasn't even a jet rib tender. Haven't you got something to go and caulk???

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Re: Steady....

Oh really??

If you look at my profile, check all the posts and see the one about my dinghy pinched from the Yealm. And there's me blaming the French.
I'll swap the dinghy for a pint of Hobgoblin or a Princess V42, whichever you think is the more valuable.

No, best make that a half actually. Bit more of a level playingfield. And I don't think Princess and Hobgoblin should be mentioned in the same sentence. You can have Boddingtons.



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Re: Oi.you just step outside and say that again......

NM./forums/images/icons/laugh.gif

<hr width=100% size=1>If it aint broke fix it till it is.
 
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