Portugal D7 Visa

[TheAncientMariner]

Maybe not ideal but using North Africa (Morocco, Tunisia) as bolt holes could be an option. We have enjoyed time in both.

I am now seriously investigating Marina Yasmine in Hammamet, Tunisia as an alternative way to negotiate the 90/180 rule; annual moorings are very attractively priced, and Spain - France-Italy-Greece are all viable 90 day itineraries

 

[geem]

Good morning.

I have just secured (and paid for) a berth in the ANG marina in Vila Real de Santo Antonio; although they are not the visa authority (which is the Consultate in London) nor the Immigration/Residency authority (which is SEF), the local Town Council (Freguesia de Vila Real de Santo António ) have refused to accept either the receipt for my mooring or a formal (stamped) declaration from the Porto de Recreio do Guadiana as proof of accommodation.

Its a bit chicken and egg - the Town Hall wont accept the contract until I am physically moored up and resident here, but I cant get a D7 Visa to become resident here without proof of accommodation

The VAT situation on imported yachts is apparently NOT impossible to overcome, provided that it is handled as part of the initial immigration process via the SEF

I am desperate for any information anyone might have on this topic

If you are going the D7 visa route you need a house not a boat. The D7 visa assumes you are relocating to Portugal, selling your house in UK. Buying a car in Portugal, you also need €7k in a Portuguese bank account and income going in to it to an equivalent of the minimum wage. The D7 is not for yachties trying to stay on their boat in Portugal

 

[TheAncientMariner]

Many thanks; I am already a fair way down the D7 route, but my local consultant had intially indicated that he was familiar with liveaboard boaties, It turns out he's not, and neither is anyone else apparently

All other boxes ticked, boat situation less so

 

[Graham376]

I have just secured (and paid for) a berth in the ANG marina in Vila Real de Santo Antonio; although they are not the visa authority (which is the Consultate in London) nor the Immigration/Residency authority (which is SEF), the local Town Council (Freguesia de Vila Real de Santo António ) have refused to accept either the receipt for my mooring or a formal (stamped) declaration from the Porto de Recreio do Guadiana as proof of accommodation.

Its a bit chicken and egg - the Town Hall wont accept the contract until I am physically moored up and resident here, but I cant get a D7 Visa to become resident here without proof of accommodation

The VAT situation on imported yachts is apparently NOT impossible to overcome, provided that it is handled as part of the initial immigration process via the SEF

I am desperate for any information anyone might have on this topic

For D7 visa information/advice, you may get more information here - Portugal - British Expats

 

[Graham376]

If you are going the D7 visa route you need a house not a boat. The D7 visa assumes you are relocating to Portugal, selling your house in UK. Buying a car in Portugal, you also need €7k in a Portuguese bank account and income going in to it to an equivalent of the minimum wage. The D7 is not for yachties trying to stay on their boat in Portugal

Correct. Before Brexit, as EU citizens with the right of abode, we had to register our presence if in country >3 months so local authorities issued temporary (5 years) residence to those on boats, motor caravans etc. We no longer have any rights and treated as third country citizens with a completely different rule book. Just turning up and asking for residence no longer works.

 

[TheAncientMariner]

Correct. Before Brexit, as EU citizens with the right of abode, we had to register our presence if in country >3 months so local authorities issued temporary (5 years) residence to those on boats, motor caravans etc. We no longer have any rights and treated as third country citizens with a completely different rule book. Just turning up and asking for residence no longer works.

Many thanks for this sage advice. I apologise if I hadn't already mentioned that I am already some considerable way into the (standard) D7 process, but the Portuguese immigration consultant I am using was (initially) confident that documentary proof of living aboard in a marina would satisfy the accommodation requirement. I am currently in Portugal without the boat in order to sort out logistical arrangements, but have run into a brick wall. The local Town Council are not averse to marina contracts per se, but they require a formal Agreement, whereas all I have been given by the Marina is a receipt and a stamped formal declaration that I live (or rather will live) there.

I am surprised that this appears to be a novel or unfamiliar situation. There are many expats living aboard both in this particular marina, and at anchor further up the river, and I would be surprised if they were all pre_BREXIT arrivals

Again, apologise if I have caused any offence which warrants such a frosty response from the Forum

 

[geem]

Many thanks for this sage advice. I apologise if I hadn't already mentioned that I am already some considerable way into the (standard) D7 process, but the Portuguese immigration consultant I am using was (initially) confident that documentary proof of living aboard in a marina would satisfy the accommodation requirement. I am currently in Portugal without the boat in order to sort out logistical arrangements, but have run into a brick wall. The local Town Council are not averse to marina contracts per se, but they require a formal Agreement, whereas all I have been given by the Marina is a receipt and a stamped formal declaration that I live (or rather will live) there.

I am surprised that this appears to be a novel or unfamiliar situation. There are many expats living aboard both in this particular marina, and at anchor further up the river, and I would be surprised if they were all pre_BREXIT arrivals

Again, apologise if I have caused any offence which warrants such a frosty response from the Forum

If you got your residency before Brexit you have different rules. Living on a boat is fine. Post Brexit you need to buy a house or take out a lease/rental agreement. This is what my residency consultant advised. Also be aware that if you are out of Portugal for longer than 6 months the temporary residency lapses. We realised that it simply doesn't work for us. We are currently in the Caribbean on our boat

 

[Graham376]

I am surprised that this appears to be a novel or unfamiliar situation. There are many expats living aboard both in this particular marina, and at anchor further up the river, and I would be surprised if they were all pre_BREXIT arrivals

Again, apologise if I have caused any offence which warrants such a frosty response from the Forum

Surprised if you think any replies are frosty. I guess most of the liveaboards you have seen will have residence, it was so easy to obtain. During the last couple of years, other people who could prove they were in country before B day also managed to get residence. Slowly however, SEF have been clamping down and rejecting many later applicants.

I seem to remember a couple of years ago, local authorities being stopped from issuing temporary residence and all applications were to be handled by SEF - dept of immigration. As far as I know, unless you can prove being here before Brexit, the only way for third country citizens to obtain residence now is via the D7 route which is far more challenging than most of us had to deal with years ago.

 

[TheAncientMariner]

Surprised if you think any replies are frosty. I guess most of the liveaboards you have seen will have residence, it was so easy to obtain. During the last couple of years, other people who could prove they were in country before B day also managed to get residence. Slowly however, SEF have been clamping down and rejecting many later applicants.

I seem to remember a couple of years ago, local authorities being stopped from issuing temporary residence and all applications were to be handled by SEF - dept of immigration. As far as I know, unless you can prove being here before Brexit, the only way for third country citizens to obtain residence now is via the D7 route which is far more challenging than most of us had to deal with years ago.

Hi Graham, many thanks for this. My mistake for not already clearly spelling out that I am already midway through the D7 process and have an appointment with VFS / the London Consulate later this month. My only immediate concern is to present proof that accommodation is available, and I was advised that a certificate from the local Town Council was required. It is, but they will not issue it against an invoice and a formal stamped declaration from the marina. The marina will not issue an Agreement until I am formally resident. Chicken & Egg

I apologise if I am a bit thick: I certainly seem to be for naively thinking that I might be able to find constructive advice on YBW

 

[Sailfree]

Hi Graham, many thanks for this. My mistake for not already clearly spelling out that I am already midway through the D7 process and have an appointment with VFS / the London Consulate later this month. My only immediate concern is to present proof that accommodation is available, and I was advised that a certificate from the local Town Council was required. It is, but they will not issue it against an invoice and a formal stamped declaration from the marina. The marina will not issue an Agreement until I am formally resident. Chicken & Egg



I apologise if I am a bit thick: I certainly seem to be for naively thinking that I might be able to find constructive advice on YBW

Sorry to hear of your problem. As I said before all rules in Portugal can get interpreted differently by different beaucrates.

Have you taken along a fluent Portuguese speaker with you to try to resolve the situation. My understanding is that a number have got residency post Brexit just with a marina berth so worth keep trying.

 

[Graham376]

I apologise if I am a bit thick: I certainly seem to be for naively thinking that I might be able to find constructive advice on YBW

Not thick, a newcomer reading the forum will quite rightly assume there are a good many folks here with residence in various EU countries, who will know the system. Unfortunately, we are spread out everywhere from Greece to France, all with their own rules and systems. Add to that, the vast majority obtained or started the process for residence well before Brexit deadline, when we had the right as EU citizens and it was just a formality.

Now, we're third country citizens having to follow D7 rules in Portugal which most (if not all) of us have never used so hardly surprising not much constructive advice forthcoming. As I said before, one of the expat forums would be a better source or, maybe a third country forum.

 

[Graham376]

Sorry to hear of your problem. As I said before all rules in Portugal can get interpreted differently by different beaucrates.

Have you taken along a fluent Portuguese speaker with you to try to resolve the situation. My understanding is that a number have got residency post Brexit just with a marina berth so worth keep trying.

Yes, a couple in the boatyard managed it late last year but they had to produce marina receipts and proof of other spending in country prior to B day, to establish they were here.

 

[Sailfree]

Yes, a couple in the boatyard managed it late last year but they had to produce marina receipts and proof of other spending in country prior to B day, to establish they were here.

When we first arrived in Feb 16 a S African person working in real estate and showing us properties said it was important to have you fiscal number NIF put on receipts as these are ALL registered centrally and proves you are on residence here.







Obviously Portuguese bank account and credit card helps as well.