Passage advice to Isle of Man

[JumbleDuck]

I think thats the first time in the 2 years I have been here I have had anything positive to contribute back instead of just asking questions Feels quite good.

You've done more in those two years than most of us do in twenty ...

 

[JumbleDuck]

For info, I pitched up twice in Douglas Marina in practice week three years ago, no probs getting a berth and of course once in you are in for the duration if you want to be.
The HM is very good at slotting people in.
Stu

Ta. I've always been a bit leery of going to Douglas, but I may give it a go. The chandlery there is excellent.

 

[JumbleDuck]

If I got the timing wrong going around the Mull of Galloway, would it be just very bouncy, rock and rolling or possibly kill me and my boat!

Where? Round the Mull itself can be horrible. We took a day trip by car to the lighthouse a couple of weeks ago and watched as the full tide developed ... I was very happy not to be in it. On the other hand, the nasties don't extend very far and so you can easily dodge them with a wee detour out to sea, which will make stuff-all impact on the distance from, say, Portpatrick to Peel.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Paul: good luck, but take care with your choice of words. On IoM, "the mainland" is the Isle of Man. Where you live is "Across" (or, more pedantically, "the adjacent island"). And on no account use the word "rat"

The biggest rat I have ever seen in my life was lying dead in the gutter outside the Maritime Museum in Castletown. It was as big as a large adult cat.

Tidal streams around the Island are quite anomalous, and not well described in Admiralty streams charts. The newcomer can easily find himself punching when he could have sworn he'd be getting help.

I believe that the Imray Irish Sea pilot gets it all wrong. I carry a nice modern guide (published by the Manx Sailing and Cruising Club) which gives the tides in great detail

and a much older Cruising Guide to the Isle of Man by Robert Kemp, publish by Brown, Son and Ferguson

which is useful although it knows nothing of flap gates and marinas.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I hate the Ailsa Craig, Portpatrick route, it always seems to be slow and tedious and you are rolling about looking at that bloody lump of granite for hours and hours

I know what you mean. We have a tradition of looking up and saying "Good God. What the hell's THAT?" while pointing at Ailsa Craig ... every half hour or so for what seems like most of a day.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I've had no problem using Manx notes in NI.

Ditto West Cumbria

It's worth remembering that unlike Scottish and NI notes, Manx notes aren't sterling (though the Manx pound is tied 1:1 to sterling) so in theory even banks can be sniffier about them. Some shops won't take anything which doesn't say "sterling" on them somewhere because their banks won't accept them. Familiarity tends to breed acceptance, though

 

[Heckler]

Every time I have been there the harbourmaster at Peel has expected a courtesy flag.

If you think that he is a stickler, visiting Gib is interesting even going the couple of hundred yards from La Linea to the Gib fuel dock. We set off on my mates boat last week to refuel, there is always always a Gib police boat lurking! My mate went to the mast as soon as we exitited LL marina, to drop the Spanish courtesy flag, he is a Gib resident and reckons the border is at the corner of the marina breakwater. As we passed the corner if the breakwater, the police boat could be soon moseying towards us then he turned back. My mate said, hmm, see that, he came for a look, saw we had dropped the flag and suddenly isnt interested. I had noticed before now the grey lurkers shadowing us as we went around the bay. They dont mess around!
Stu
PS Gib notes and coins are the same, Monarch trolley jockeys on the way home scrutinise v carefully when you pay cash on the plane

 

[macd]

The biggest rat I have ever seen in my life was lying dead in the gutter outside the Maritime Museum in Castletown. It was as big as a large adult cat.

I'm afraid your rodent recognition lacks appreciation of the nuances of Manx taxonomy. The beast you saw was a longtail. Rats are never seen on the Island, and even less frequently mentioned. (With the exception of members of Tynwald, obviously.)

I believe that the Imray Irish Sea pilot gets it all wrong. I carry a nice modern guide (published by the Manx Sailing and Cruising Club) which gives the tides in great detail...

I don't know if the Imray pilot you mention has been updated, but when first published it was indeed wildly wrong on tidal streams around the Isle of Man. This despite my correcting the proofs of that section prior to publication, none of which corrections made it to print.

The link I offered in post #24 brings up the same tidal streams charts as you describe in Kemp's old pilot, which are reliable.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Every time I have been there the harbourmaster at Peel has expected a courtesy flag.

Whatever. I know you like playing flag games & wearing your pretendsign. The rest of us, including the Peel HM, couldn't give two hoots. It's not Gibraltar.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

If you think that he is a stickler...

He isn't.

 

[EdWingfield]

Every time I have been there the harbourmaster at Peel has expected a courtesy flag.

This year I have visited all IoMan ports except Laxey. Never been asked for flags. HMs have commented favourably on the hanging basket though.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

This year I have visited all IoMan ports except Laxey. Never been asked for flags. HMs have commented favourably on the hanging basket though.

I saw that the other day! Came to find you but all i found were flowers

 

[JumbleDuck]

Whatever. I know you like playing flag games & wearing your pretendsign. The rest of us, including the Peel HM, couldn't give two hoots. It's not Gibraltar.

I can only report that when I first arrived at Peel, the harbourmaster said "You're not in the UK now, so you need a courtesy flag" and that I was happy to comply. My original sandcastle flag did another couple of visits and I now have a nice sewn one.

He was a little nonplussed by the Scottish merchant flag, but his assistant knew what it was and they seemed to like it. And so a nice, pleasant day was had by all, with no unnecessary personal animosity. Wouldn't it be nice if life was always like that?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Whatever. I know you like playing flag games & wearing your pretendsign. The rest of us, including the Peel HM, couldn't give two hoots. It's not Gibraltar.

Reply from an email to Peel HM (my bold):

Thanks for your enquiry regarding the flying of an Isle of Man Courtesy Flag.

Generally speaking most leisure vessels arriving on the island arrive from a UK or Irish port even if some may have originated from a foreign port. Although many don’t bother with a courtesy flag, it would normally be considered etiquette to fly one as you would the St Andrews for Scotland and the Welsh Dragon for Wales.

Hope this has been of some help.

Thanks & regards

(name)

Senior Watch Officer
Marine Operations Centre
DOI Ports Division
Isle of Man​

 

[macd]

I believe I'm correct in writing that in law, a courtesy flag has nothing to do with courtesy or etiquette, but represents an undertaking that the vessel concerned accepts and will comply with local laws. To the best of my knowledge the laws relating to pleasure vessels in Manx waters are no different from those in UK waters (and the Island has no navy to police them, anyway), so just what could a Manx courtesy flag represent?

Next time I see the Senior Watch Officer in Douglas, I'll also be sure to tell him I wouldn't dream of flying a Scottish, Welsh or Cornish flag, or any other such token. (Funny how the cross of St. George is never suggested, not that I'd fly that, either...)

 

[JumbleDuck]

I believe I'm correct in writing that in law, a courtesy flag has nothing to do with courtesy or etiquette, but represents an undertaking that the vessel concerned accepts and will comply with local laws. To the best of my knowledge the laws relating to pleasure vessels in Manx waters are no different from those in UK waters (and the Island has no navy to police them, anyway), so just what could a Manx courtesy flag represent?

Non-UK visitors should be acknowledging that they are subject to the Manx rules, which are presumably based on the Merchant Shipping Act (of Tynwald) 1985. I've no idea whether there is any significant variation from the British rules.

Next time I see the Senior Watch Officer in Douglas, I'll also be sure to tell him I wouldn't dream of flying a Scottish, Welsh or Cornish flag, or any other such token.

I don't think anybody in Scotland minds if visitors don't fly a courtesy flag, but it's generally appreciated if you do.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Reply from an email to Peel HM (my bold):

Thanks for your enquiry regarding the flying of an Isle of Man Courtesy Flag.

Generally speaking most leisure vessels arriving on the island arrive from a UK or Irish port even if some may have originated from a foreign port. Although many don’t bother with a courtesy flag, it would normally be considered etiquette to fly one as you would the St Andrews for Scotland and the Welsh Dragon for Wales.

Hope this has been of some help.

Thanks & regards

(name)

Senior Watch Officer
Marine Operations Centre
DOI Ports Division
Isle of Man​

So as I said, they don't give two hoots if you do or don't. You fly yours if you want, I know getting het up about flags is your thing, but I don't. I can't see the relevance on a thread about pilotage & passage planning either, so I'll say no more on the subject.

 

[JumbleDuck]

So as I said, they don't give two hoots if you do or don't.

They think it would polite. I can see that that might not be your thing.

 

[[163233]]

Funny how the cross of St. George is never suggested, not that I'd fly that, either...

Isn't it supposed to be the ensign rather than the national flag anyway?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Isn't it supposed to be the ensign rather than the national flag anyway?

For different bits of the UK the national flag would be appropriate, since I think Scotland is the only bit which has its own (historic) ensign. Most people seem to use a saltire as a Scottish courtesy flag. However, as I said, nobody really minds if you don't, although those who make a great fuss about not doing so come across as a little uncultured.